24 V CUCV motor in a civi truck

[niferous]

Ok as many know already I am in the process of sourcing a Chevrolet 3/4 ton Suburban and converting it into a "M1007 CUCV". I want to use the current 12v motor out of the Suburban and drop it into a FJ60 Land Cruiser. Now that leaves the Suburban without a motor. Since I need a parts CUCV for the M1007 build anyway I was wanting to take the 24 v motor out of the CUCV and drop it into in the Suburban. So what all would I have to change to make this work? It seems this would be a straight swap but I thought I should ask.

 

[Recovry4x4]

Only significant difference is the starter. If the burb already has a 6.2, just leave it and put the one out of the CUCV in the cruiser. Not sure how feasible it would be to convert the burb to 24V.

 

[Chief_919]

Yep, just the starter.

The two big starter dealers on Ebay are having a price war right now and you can buy a brand new 6.2/6.5 12v starter for about $85. I have had one from them on my daily driver 6.5 for over a year now and it works perfectly.

 

[MARCO1031]

Does the diesel burb have dual batteries? If so it seems like you could set up a 24v sub system to run the slave plug and a few other things. The big issue is that you would have to mimic the dual alt setup from the cucv. On second thought converting the burb would probably not be so simple...but if you like challenges have at it.

 

[niferous]

Well if converting the Suburban to 24 Volt would pose such a challenge what would putting the 24 v motor into the Land Cruiser present? Wouldn't I also have to get rid of one of the alternators? A big reason I want to use the civi motor in the Land Cruiser is that it is also set-up for air conditioning just like my FJ60. So it should already have a bracket and therefore negate a bunch of fab work.

The guy I talked to who had done the swap used a 12 v civi motor and he said that there is one wire from the ignition on the Land Cruiser that needs to be connected to the motor and that all the wiring needed. Basically an on and off switch. I would assume this wire goes to the starter but I'm not totally sure yet. I would imagine a little more would be needed to get everything else I am used to going but I'm not totaly sure. This is my first engine swap and I'm new to CUCVs which is why I'm asking . The way it looks I may be an expert on both by the time I am done!

 

[Chief_919]

Well if converting the Suburban to 24 Volt would pose such a challenge what would putting the 24 v motor into the Land Cruiser present? Wouldn't I also have to get rid of one of the alternators? A big reason I want to use the civi motor in the Land Cruiser is that it is also set-up for air conditioning just like my FJ60. So it should already have a bracket and therefore negate a bunch of fab work.

The guy I talked to who had done the swap used a 12 v civi motor and he said that there is one wire from the ignition on the Land Cruiser that needs to be connected to the motor and that all the wiring needed. Basically an on and off switch. I would assume this wire goes to the starter but I'm not totally sure yet. I would imagine a little more would be needed to get everything else I am used to going but I'm not totaly sure. This is my first engine swap and I'm new to CUCVs which is why I'm asking . The way it looks I may be an expert on both by the time I am done!

The one wire is the one that goes to the solenoid in the injection pump. On the CUCV this is 12v the same as any civilian 6.2.

The only thing 24V on the CUCV engine is the starter, if it was me I would just put a new 12v starter on it.

 

[ken]

They are right. The only thing you will have to change is the starter. The Injection pump and glow plugs run off of 12V. Most electrical circuts on the CUCV are 12V. The Starter is 24V so that slaving other NATO equipment won't be a problem. Just connect your ignition wire in the cruisers wiring harness to the Injection pump. And you'll need to rig yourself up something to run the glow plugs. But the bigger question is, Can the cruisers front axle handle the weight of a 6.2? Doesen't this engine weigh close to 800 pounds?

 

[TyJustice]

I purchased a spare 6.2l from GL and the crate classifies the motor weight at 650lbs.

I did however order the HD springs when I replaced the suspension to prevent any sag do to the extra engine weight.

 

[niferous]

Actually the straight six that is in the FJ60 is heavier than the 6.2 if you can believe that. The guy I talked to that did it and others on the Land Cruiser forum all say you have to buy some kind of lift for the rear because you get a bout 1" of lift on the front due to the lighter motor. Also since it's a straight six and a 4.2 liter at that it's longer than the 6.2 so my engine space situation should improve.

So at this point I'm guessing it's going to be better to just leave the motor in the Suburban and find a 6.2 with transmission for the Land Cruiser. The same guy off of here that has the Suburban also has a 6.2 out of a CUCV that I can use and I'll just need to find a transmission. Then get my adapters and drop it in. Wiring probably won't be a big deal either. Getting the air conditioning hooked up may pose a problem.

 

[Blood_of_Tyrants]

Everyone who says that converting a civilian vehicle only involves a starter change are WRONG and have never looked at a CUCV wiring diagram. First, you will need to add a second alternator with the charge wire to the + terminal of the high battery and the GND terminal to the + side of the low battery. This means that you will need new terminals to separate the 12 vdc circuits from the 24 vdc circuits.

Second, you will have to put in a new relay to switch 24vdc to the starter solenoid. Only military trucks have this relay because military starters use 24 vdc for the starter solenoid and starter motor.

An experienced electrician could do it, could you?

 

[Chief_919]

Everyone who says that converting a civilian vehicle only involves a starter change are WRONG and have never looked at a CUCV wiring diagram. First, you will need to add a second alternator with the charge wire to the + terminal of the high battery and the GND terminal to the + side of the low battery. This means that you will need new terminals to separate the 12 vdc circuits from the 24 vdc circuits.

Second, you will have to put in a new relay to switch 24vdc to the starter solenoid. Only military trucks have this relay because military starters use 24 vdc for the starter solenoid and starter motor.

An experienced electrician could do it, could you?

Huh?

What we are saying is that to use a CUCV motor in a 12v setup, the only thing one needs to change is the starter to a 12V model- not the other way around.

 

[TyJustice]

no

 

[niferous]

An experienced electrician could do it, could you?

If I can't I bet I can find someone who can and pay them to do so!

On another note. Once again the same guy who has the Suburban and motor also has a complete firewall with wiring harness from the CUCV that he got the motor out of. So I could also buy that and go to town with it. We'll see what happens. Right now for me the priority is getting the dang Suburban and then getting a good reliable diesel motor into my Land Cruiser with an auto trans and make it all work.

Like I said before, when this is all over I may be a subject matter expert!

 

[M725]

Ok as many know already I am in the process of sourcing a Chevrolet 3/4 ton Suburban and converting it into a "M1007 CUCV". I want to use the current 12v motor out of the Suburban and drop it into a FJ60 Land Cruiser. Now that leaves the Suburban without a motor. Since I need a parts CUCV for the M1007 build anyway I was wanting to take the 24 v motor out of the CUCV and drop it into in the Suburban. So what all would I have to change to make this work? It seems this would be a straight swap but I thought I should ask.

Why change 12v motor? Just paint the truck carc green. It still will not be a M1007 ( first time I heard of the after 25yrs in the army, must have been a secret truck. They are not in any manual.) Why do you need 24v, are you going to use military radios?
If you are set on 24v and make to standard. you need a CUCV, switch the all the wire hardnesses and gauges, Install the military fuel filter, don't forget the blackout lights.

 

[M725]

Sorry but I just checked, M1007 is a semitrailer, van, electronic, 6 ton.
M1008 Truck, cargo, 1 1/4-ton, 4 X 4, NSN 2320-01-123-6827
M1008A1 Truck, cargo, communications kit, 100amp/24v, 1 1/4-ton, 4 X 4
M1009 Truck, utility, 3/4-ton, 4 X 4, NSN 2320-01-123-2665
M1010 Truck, ambulance, 1 1/4-ton, 4 X 4, NSN 2320-01-123-2666

 

[niferous]

Sorry but I just checked, M1007 is a semitrailer, van, electronic, 6 ton.
M1008 Truck, cargo, 1 1/4-ton, 4 X 4, NSN 2320-01-123-6827
M1008A1 Truck, cargo, communications kit, 100amp/24v, 1 1/4-ton, 4 X 4
M1009 Truck, utility, 3/4-ton, 4 X 4, NSN 2320-01-123-2665
M1010 Truck, ambulance, 1 1/4-ton, 4 X 4, NSN 2320-01-123-2666

I don't think I'm making myself clear here. I know they never made a suburban CUCV. That's common knowledge. I'm trying to make a CUCV clone out of a Suburban. On here people refer to them as an "M1007" I guess because seven people can sit in it.

Here is a link to a guy here on Steel Soldiers who has done it before:

http://www.steelsoldiers.com/members-rides/21049-m1007-suburban-cucv-conversion.html

As for why 24 volt. Well I feel that if I'm going to do this I want to do it all the way. The suburban I'm looking at is a work truck series so it has the crank down windows, manual locks, etc. So there isn't much wiring to take care of. Also is has the tailgate instead of barn doors so that helps. As far as other 24v vehicles I already have a M1009 and I want some more military vehicles so having them all 24 volt would be beneficial to me.

I guess what I'm trying to say here is I'm not asking "should I" I'm asking "can I"? Once I figure out how much is involved I will decide on the "should I" part. Right now because of the good information I've gotten so far it looks like yes I can. I just feel if I'm going to do this I should do it well. I don't want a Suburban that I just painted CARC green and threw some bumpers on. If I'm going to invest time and money in this I want it to be done as it would have been for the military.

Think of it like this. If you buy a 1969 Chevrolet Malibu and decide to make it an SS Chevelle clone idealy you would want the motor that came in the SS and not the one that came in the Malibu right? I mean the SS badges identify a different package which is why people want it.

Not sure if this is just rambling or it's making any sense. I guess maybe I'm being too much of a perfecionist but I really want to do this 100% correct.

 

[niferous]

I stand corrected. I was looking over that post about Rickyoday's Suburban CUCV clone.

I remember seeing a bunch of GI suburbans at Mountain Home Air base, as well as Gowen Field (Boise Idaho) during the 80's and early 90's. The AF ones were usually painted blue, the ones at Gowen were almost always plain OD, (a few I remember were tan). They had the GI front ends, shackles, etc. The rear had the proper BO lights, etc. Antenna mounts towards the rear on the sides of the bodies. Very similar to the pictures shown.

So I guess they did exist although may not have been made as much as the other trucks or it may have been something the military converted after they purchased a regular suburban.