To bid or to buy, that is the genset question.

[bsorcs]

Just seeking to establish a frame of reference while looking at GL gensets...3-10kw...re winning a crapshoot.

Recognizing that bad news is generally more available and more often printed than good news, [see the following]

SurvivalBlog.com: Search Results

and having read many of the more objective threads herein about successes and failures in getting a genset that can be used with not too much effort and expenditure, I'm wondering if I should just pop for $1.7 k [delivered] for a running MEP002A w/relevant TMs and parts manual...a genset Occam's razor.

Closest units are Ft. Polk and Warner Robins; preview by me is feasible at the former. It appears conceivable that I can land a 5kw from GL for $700-900. It appears equally conceivable that that I'd could have to drop another $200-1000 to end up where I want to bedepending on 'the luck of the draw". Seems to distill down to paying to avoid frustration and save a boatload of time. Then, too, there IS the issue of Isaac bearing down! The principal problem therein likely would be a power outage for a day or so, which would not bend us much out of shape...have gas to cook, the water likely will stay on, the books and piano need no power, and the dog runs on kibbles.

Comments/Commiseration/Scorn/Wisdom/...???

 

[Warthog]

Buying a military genset is not for the faint at heart. Buying from GL is a true crapshoot. I bought a MEP-005A that looked great in the pictures. $1000 later in repairs it is still a dog.

Unless you have access to parts for the milgens, I would recommend a civvy version. Either route you will more than likely have to wait for parts. That doesn't help when you have a power outage staring you down.

 

[Ken_86gt]

Also if you buy one on GL you have to wait for the EUC to clear and that can take some time. If you like gambling and fixing things.... If you wait until you really need a generator- such as a hurricane arriving the prices will certainly be at a premium.

 

[Isaac-1]

There are no more EUC's on generators as of some time last year. As to the points at hand I have now bought 6 generators from GL some MEP's some Civilian standby units, 2 of them ran with only fluids, filters, and batteries, but even these had minor issues (like bad/wrong hour meter, pin hole leak in oil cooler, and similar), I have been lucky on all the others as all were economical to repair, some needing lots of little cheap parts, others one or two major parts. In this case I am using perfectly functional for stanby use as my standard for repair, so maybe all the bells and whistles don't work, or there is a slow leak in the radiator, etc. As to the $1,700 for a running MEP-002a if it were not for the fact that my truck is in the shop, I could be in N.O. in about 5 hours (joke), seriously though I bought my most recent MEP generator from GL at Ft. Polk for about $450 2 months ago, it is an ugly duckling green with brushed on tan CARC), but runs great with about 2,000 hours showing on the meter, brand new filters and fuel tank on it when I bought it, only real problem was a bad $5 transistor on the voltage regulator that caused the voltage to spike after 3-5 minutes of running, also flaky panel load meter (needle sticks at 25% going up and down), and voltage meters.

Ike

p.s. On a serious note if you do get hit bad let me know and I can loan you something in the 3-5 KW range.

 

[Ken_86gt]

Thanks for update on the euc. I missed that one.

 

[storeman]

Ken,
No more EUCs on many trucks, trailers or generators. That could change if they decide to surplus newer series generators in looming force draw-down ....
Jerry

 

[Isaac-1]

One more thought after reading the survival blog entry:

Surplus auction generators are NOT for everyone, but if you are reasonably mechanically inclined (can change a fuel pump, or a starter, can read and follow directions for testing procedures, etc.) chances are good that you can buy one and economically repair it, but there is always the chance of ending up with a good looking paperweight. There is also the point in between when you need to know when to throw in the towel and try to make your money back parting it out. If you think your going to buy one of these and take it to the local small engine shop where the majority of the service personnel can't think for themselves, then you are asking for trouble.

Ike

p.s. on the note about all the wires being white, this is true, but instead of cheap "color coding" each wire has a unique printed number on the jacket and the parts manuals have diagrams showing which wire number connects between each point, remember these things were build with money is no object attitude.

 

[bsorcs]

Gentlemen,

A thousand thanks for the sage advisories. While neither journeyman electrician nor experienced mechanic, the thought of getting a GL unit, getting it shape and using it is attractive [might be less so when this bleeding storm comes through, but that's another story]. The engine I can largely deal with, unless something like injector pump issues arise [although this forum is a remarkable information resource]. The sparky stuff is a horse of a different color. It would a substantial learning experience figuring out a bum transistor someplace.

Ike, thanks for the offer if the SHTF here, but I so far have faith in the electric and gas utility, and I have a bunch of butane and know where to get ice! Nice gesture, though. Are you anywhere near Elton? I get there off and on...elderly aunt and a need to buy sausage in Eunice. Also, roger the numbered wires; picked up on that working with deuce lights and pigtail.

I likely will post a request re previews of some stuff at Warner Robins. We shall see.

Thanks again to all.

 

[Isaac-1]

I live about 45 - 50 miles NW of Elton, the electrical stuff is usually not too bad, most often it is the same sort of things as you likely get into with your lighting, bad grounds, broken connections, bad meters, that sort of thing. If you can use a multimeter to test for volts, resistance/continuity and maybe Hertz you can likely follow 90+% of the testing procedures in the TM. Much the same goes on the mechanical side, 90% of it is finding a broken part, and swapping it out, few people get into trying to repair engines with broken internal parts (pistons, rings, connecting rods, etc.) as if you do get one with something broken inside the engine it is often cheaper to roll the dice again and likely buy a good one. Injection pump replacement (repair?) is likely as hard of project as most people here attempt.

Ike

 

[Rickety Bones]

I just bought a mep 005a from barstow

mep 005a 500

injector pump 330

injectors 330

batteries 150

filters oil and antifreeze 100

25 hrs of labor free

material to build trailer 500

total about 2000.00

to me well worth is, I now have a gen that I know will run when I need it, no questions asked....

on ebay they sell for well over 4K

Rick

 

[leedawg]

My injector pump quit again rick Sent it back again will see what they say. Id have to say I bought two MEP 005a. One I got for 600 bucks and only put 200 dollars in and runs great. The other I paid 1k for and have invested 330 for injectors, 320 for injection pump, 600 for voltage regulator, 150 for thermal watt converter, 100 for hz meter, 75 for air filter, filters oil antifreeze 100. Total for 2675 so...

From what ive learned from both purchases is its a total crap shoot what your going to get and for how much and how much you are going to have to put into it to get it up and running reliably. However that being said ive always enjoyed turning wrenches and working on stuff so its been a fun project.

 

[derf]

I'm about 10 for 10 getting small GL gens going. Most have required minor repairs and some required some parts.
I can fix anything but a rainbow or a broken heart, though.
I see bargains on craigslist frequently, too.

 

[Isaac-1]

One other point here, is the question of what are your goals, is it to get a good running generator, or have everything restored and working like new down to authentic CARC paint scheme? Many of the components on these older MEP generators are hard to find and often expensive, if your goal is simply to have a good working generator then the easiest way to get there is often by replacing certain hard to find parts with their modern counterparts. Obscure CVT transformers and meters can be replaced by modern digital voltage meters, complex shoe box size discrete component automatic voltage regulators can be replaced by match box sized highly integrated modern commercial automatic voltage regulators, etc.

Ike

 

[derf]

I think everyone should just buy good, running gens from people like Jim. That way no one is bidding against me, except maybe Jim.

 

[ETN550]

There is probably more people on here bidding then you realize!

I have had pretty good luck with the little ones too. But there is not much margin in them once the costs of getting them gets factored in. Usually they can be made to run pretty easy but to really get them right and reliable they all need something. 24vdc regulators, high voltage regulator replacement or repair, frequency meter transducer repair, gas tanks with 20 pinholes once the rust is sand blasted out, 016B's with the governor linkage screwed up needing a full tune up and load test by the manual, bad fuel tank float switches, replace injector tips due to black smoking, bad electric fuel pumps, stuck mechanical fuel pumps, bad connections on the glow plugs, bad wiring connectors on the start solenoid, bad cranking relay on the pull in coil for fuel solenoid, cracked hoses, sand in the crankcase (scrapped that one, had a spun rod bearing), missing gas caps and oil fill plugs, these are all common things I have found on many units. I now believe there is a reason why most of the units are sidelined. Much of the problems are compounded due to sitting and DRMO and GL keeps a lot of inventory outside for 6-8 months from the time DRMO is done with it until it gets sold by G/L. Not good with filters off and fuel tanks opened.

These small parts and pieces are expensive and add up, especially the electrical parts unique to the machine. 24vdc limits the aftermarket options for different electronics. 12vdc would give lots of options. Never the less the small units are far superior to any stor bought unit once their bugs are worked out. The brushless generators themselves seem bullet proof.

I have also found that if there is more than one unit per lot on the bid line item then there is a great chance that their problems are much more severe. If they are missing any major parts or if the controls have been canabalized then they are parts machines and no telling how much it will take to get one working again. The hour meters mean nothing.

 

[derf]

Yeah, when you get a 016D that has about 250 hours on it but the gen head has a tag from 1969 you have to admit the gen head is probably a reliable thing and been through at least one engine overhaul.

 

[MarcusOReallyus]

p.s. on the note about all the wires being white, this is true, but instead of cheap "color coding" each wire has a unique printed number on the jacket and the parts manuals have diagrams showing which wire number connects between each point, remember these things were build with money is no object attitude.

This is a good thing, folks. This is FAR better than that stupid color-code business.

Even for those of us who have perfect color perception, reading a black number on a white jacket (printed all along every wire) is a FAR more reliable method than color coding. Tracing a red wire with fat green stripe in a bundle of wires that includes several OTHER red wires with varying kinds of green stripes is a great way to go bald.

With numbered wires, you know EXACTLY what you're dealing with.

 

[bsorcs]

My primary goal is reliable house power during an outage, ideally running at least one central ac unit, and PERHAPS running 3-ph machines during non-outage times [assuming I get the workshop built]. Spoke with an electrician working on a natural gas 15kw [40a/240v output] set across the street the other day. Said he would not put anything smaller than about 25 kw at his house, but he's thinking non-mil sets.

My 3-ph pieces ...saw, jointer, planer...want from 5.5 to 20a @208v per the motor tags, so it would seem that an MEP-004a might suffice, particularly if I ran 'em in 440v configuration individually. Other 3-ph options are, I think, some sort of step-up transformer or a pricey but quiet digital phase converter, but then these are paperweights when the power is down!

On perusing the auctions, even I can spot missing shrouds, gauges and cables, breaks, bends, and rusted/non-rusted screws/bolts/hinges/panels, etc. On spotting something clean, shiny, and apparently intact, the tempation to bid increases. Don't want too much capacity, but I'm wondering what it would take to comfortably fill the bil for the house? I;ll sit down and try to add everything all the current demands.

 

[Isaac-1]

The central air conditioner is going to be the limiting issue, the information from the data plate with LRA and RLA is a start, but those numbers are worst case. To get a better idea of what your air conditioner unit really draws, put a good clamp meter on it on a hot day and see what the real running load amps are and if the meter supports it what the inrush current is while it starts. With air conditioners running load (and likely starting) will depend on head pressure, which goes up with heat, so the highest load will be on a hot unit on a hot day. I know we have one refrigeration unit at work (same sort of principal as your home air conditioner, just bigger) where the RLA on the data plate is 15-20% higher than the actual running load amps on a hot day.

Ike

p.s. bigger is not always better, I remember a guy posting some messages over on the Smokstak board about running his 30KW natural gas generator for a week or so after one of the hurricanes that hit the Texas coast a few years ago, then being surprised by the multi thousand dollar gas bill the next month. For me a 3-5KW mil surplus generator is enough for household emergencies, it lets me run the freezer and refrigerator, along with at least a couple of window / portable air conditioners (14,000 btu and 8,800 btu), plus incidental loads (some CF lights, tv, computer, etc.) Note I live in a mixed gas/electric house with gas stove and heat, but electric clothes dryer and water heater, if I had a gas water heater I could be reasonably comfortable with this set up, as it is I have no running hot water during an outage, but can still heat water on the stove for a bath.

Ike

 

[tbearatkin]

The central air conditioner is going to be the limiting issue, the information from the data plate with LRA and RLA is a start, but those numbers are worst case. To get a better idea of what your air conditioner unit really draws, put a good clamp meter on it on a hot day and see what the real running load amps are and if the meter supports it what the inrush current is while it starts. With air conditioners running load (and likely starting) will depend on head pressure, which goes up with heat, so the highest load will be on a hot unit on a hot day. I know we have one refrigeration unit at work (same sort of principal as your home air conditioner, just bigger) where the RLA on the data plate is 15-20% higher than the actual running load amps on a hot day.

Ike

p.s. bigger is not always better, I remember a guy posting some messages over on the Smokstak board about running his 30KW natural gas generator for a week or so after one of the hurricanes that hit the Texas coast a few years ago, then being surprised by the multi thousand dollar gas bill the next month. For me a 3-5KW mil surplus generator is enough for household emergencies, it lets me run the freezer and refrigerator, along with at least a couple of window / portable air conditioners (14,000 btu and 8,800 btu), plus incidental loads (some CF lights, tv, computer, etc.) Note I live in a mixed gas/electric house with gas stove and heat, but electric clothes dryer and water heater, if I had a gas water heater I could be reasonably comfortable with this set up, as it is I have no running hot water during an outage, but can still heat water on the stove for a bath.

Ike

Good thing about a Gas/diesel generator over a NG one. YOU are very conscience of how much you are spending as you fill the tank up each time vice the NG where you are lulled into that I've got power I've got power without a thought to how much it will cost in a month. As well in earthquake prone areas NG lines can break as well.