Scanner questions

[TacticalDoc]

I'm new to scanners and radios but have been doing research over the past few weeks on the internet.

I'm looking for a scanner to monitor emergency frequencies in case of a SHTF(storm, evac...) scenario for my car. What I came up with is a GRE 500 scanner since its the same as the stationary unit GRE 600 but portable. I want it for use in my BOV/truck.

Questions:

1. It seems the emergency frequencies range from 150. to 460. and I need an external antenna for my truck that attaches to my GRE500. I want one that will receive these frequencies without overload. What do you recommend? What about snoop anetnnas? Any good?

2. Are most emergency frequencies are encrypted these days?

3. What is your opinion on the GRE500? Any other brands you would recommend?






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[fireman5199]

I know in our area you can from low band 30mhz range on the statewide radio system to 800-900 mhz trunked for the state police, metropolitan and some other areas. Looks like your choice of scanner can handle anything though.

I haven't used that model but am looking for a replacment for my old Bearcat 16 channel which works great for my area till some starting getiing trunked systems.

Some places run encryption on their frequencies some don't. Some deptartments can turn it on and off as needed.

It has been my experience that as long as you have a good basic external antenna you should be ok. I dunno know if I would invest alot in a antenna for a scanner. $20 bucks or so.

 

[TacticalDoc]

some antennas are 800 range so Im looking for something that covers a wider range.

or a range covering the emergency frequencies


what about a discone antenna



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[fireman5199]

I dunno to be honest about those...I currently have a small flexible style interior antenna tucked behind the trim of the A-Post and can get stuff 20-30 miles away in the VHF range.

I was looking at this one says it goes from 25-1300 mhz. They have others like mirror arm mount and through the glass (dont like those mine kept falling off).

https://www.scannermaster.com/Wideband_Antenna_with_Mag_Mount_and_BNC_p/01-541326.htm

 

[supermechanic]

RadioShack sells a great discone scanner antenna, but it may look a bit odd on a car.
It sells for about 60 bucks.

 

[Truckoholic]

I am pretty much a scanner junky I've got scanners coming out of my ears! Don't even know how many I have now. ha ha. I am also a ham radio operator, but I just really love to know what's going on, so I have scanners in every room of the house, in every car I own, in my shop, scanners I carry around with me, scanners in my parents house so when I am visiting them and forget my hand held scanner, I can still hear what's going on. I even used to broadcast my home scanner online over RadioReference.com - Scanner Frequencies and Radio Frequency Reference . I'm sure you are probably aware of RadioReference.com by now if you have been researching scanners and things. But if not, definitely keep that website in mind. That is where you can find all of the frequencies used in your area.

The GRE 500 is an excellent scanner! And you will most definitely need one just like it with Digital capability to receive most emergency radio traffic in bigger cities. Most cities, and even a lot of small towns are switching over to digital now, and without a digital scanner, there is absolutely no way you will be able to listen to them.

The other good portable digital scanner is the Uniden BCD396XT. That's the one I have. But I personally think the GRE 500 is a better scanner. I've never used one though.

Very few radio transmissions are actually encrypted. With a digital trunking scanner, you will be able to listen to just about everything except for cell phones. A lot of people are under the false impression that "Trunking" or a "Trunked system" is a form of encryption, or that they do it to keep you from being able to follow the conversation. It is true that you will not be able to follow the conversation very well without a trunking scanner, because their transmissions change frequencies so often. But that's only incidental to the way the system is set up, and not a way to keep you from listening. All a trunked system is, is a radio system that is set up usually in the 800MHZ range, that uses multiple frequencies, and allows multiple agencies to use the same radio system without interfering with eachother. I still don't entirely understand myself, how the whole thing works. But I know that their radios continuously change frequencies, and each agencies radios change frequencies together, so that each agency still has radio communication. So when you program a trunking scanner, it knows what frequencies to follow for any given agency as you have it programmed. RadioReference.com will show you what all the frequencies are, and if you pay for a monthly account, and get the programming software for you scanner, you can just easily import all the frequencies and trunked systems right into your scanner.

As for antennas..... I love the glass mount ones because they are kind of stealthy. But their reception is not the best, and like fireman5199 said, they tend to be hard to keep together. The antenna part keeps wanting to come loose. The part stuck to the glass should stay there good as long as you clean the glass really good with rubbing alcohol before you stick it. But yeah, the best antennas are either mag mount, or NMO mount antenna's. Radio shack sells a very good working magnet mount scanner antenna. But yeah, there are plenty of them for cheap on Ebay, and pretty much any antenna on the outside of your vehicle is going to make a huge difference on what you can receive.

Hope that helps. I saw the title to this thread and said "Oooh! Scanners! I'm all over this one!" Ha ha

Here's something to keep in mind about Florida too:

[SIZE=-1]Florida Scanner Law
843.16 Unlawful to install radio equipment using assigned frequency of state or law enforcement officers; definitions; exceptions; penalties.--
(1) No person, firm, or corporation shall install in any motor vehicle or business establishment, except an emergency vehicle or crime watch vehicle as herein defined or a place established by municipal, county, state, or federal authority for governmental purposes, any frequency modulation radio receiving equipment so adjusted or tuned as to receive messages or signals on frequencies assigned by the Federal Communications Commission to police or law enforcement officers of any city or county of the state or to the state or any of its agencies. Provided, nothing herein shall be construed to affect any radio station licensed by the Federal Communications System or to affect any recognized newspaper or news publication engaged in covering the news on a full-time basis or any alarm system contractor certified pursuant to part II of chapter 489, operating a central monitoring system.
(2) As used in this section, the term:
(a) "Emergency vehicle" shall specifically mean:
1. Any motor vehicle used by any law enforcement officer or employee of any city, any county, the state, the Federal Bureau of Investigation, or the Armed Forces of the United States while on official business;
2. Any fire department vehicle of any city or county of the state or any state fire department vehicle;
3. Any motor vehicle designated as an emergency vehicle by the Department of Highway Safety and Motor Vehicles when said vehicle is to be assigned the use of frequencies assigned to the state;
4. Any motor vehicle designated as an emergency vehicle by the sheriff of any county in the state when said vehicle is to be assigned the use of frequencies assigned to the said county;
5. Any motor vehicle designated as an emergency vehicle by the chief of police of any city in the state when said vehicle is to be assigned the use of frequencies assigned to the said city.
(b) "Crime watch vehicle" means any motor vehicle used by any person participating in a citizen crime watch or neighborhood watch program when such program and use are approved in writing by the appropriate sheriff or chief of police where the vehicle will be used and the vehicle is assigned the use of frequencies assigned to the county or city. Such approval shall be renewed annually.
(3) This section shall not apply to any holder of a valid amateur radio operator or station license issued by the Federal Communications Commission or to any recognized newspaper or news publication engaged in covering the news on a full-time basis or any alarm system contractor certified pursuant to part II of chapter 489, operating a central monitoring system.
(4) Any person, firm, or corporation violating any of the provisions of this section shall be deemed guilty of a misdemeanor of the second degree, punishable as provided in s. 775.082 or s. 775.083.


Attorney General's opinion of the law:
[/SIZE]

[SIZE=-1]http://www.afn.org/~afn09444/scanlaws/laws/scanner/opinion.html



The term "installation" is not defined in the statute. However, this office has stated that the term contemplates that the unit be connected to a power source and have need of an external antenna capable of rendering the unit functional. Thus, this office concluded that the elements of "installation," for purposes of s. 843.16, F.S., would be present when:
[/SIZE] The radio unit is in some way connected to and dependent upon the motor vehicle's electrical power system; and the radio unit is connected to an independent and external antenna capable of receiving broadcasts of law enforcement agencies.

So, looks like unless you have a ham radio license, or are a fire fighter or something it is actually illegal to have your scanner hooked to an external antenna there.

 

[supermechanic]

Florida scanner law seems to contradict Communications act of 1934.

 

[SCSG-G4]

Get a HAM license and it won't matter. I took the exam after reading the test questions on-line, and had no trouble passing. The test cost $15. You will wind up spending a hundred times that much in attorney fees and court costs fighting the Florida law, with a fairly good probability of losing since the FCC may file a 'friend-of -the-court' paper deferring to the local law. The VA radar detector law has already been upheld and that is a 'radio frequency receiver'. Of course, a radar detector in most MV's is an exercise in futility, while a scanner might be of some use.

 

[Rustygears]

A discone antenna for a mobile scanner is a bit of overkill. Diamond makes a small, flexible version but it's pretty obvious. I'd stick to a whip. Most modern public service communications, especially in urban areas, are now using 800 MHz band trunked analog or even more trunked digital. The GRE is a good choice for picking this up. Since 800mhz has very directional line of sight propagation, you won't need much antenna because the systems are set up with multiple base stations to provide coverage. The only reason you really need an external mount antenna in a car is to get signal from outside the metal box you sit inside. The car body tends to shield an antenna mounted on the scanner. If you are in a convertible or a soft top deuce, then a rubber ducky antenna attached directly to the scanner will work fine for local public service reception.

Dittos on the ham license. The FCC designates hams as emergency communicators and gets around all the hands free laws for phones, etc. Its a cheap hall pass for many silly laws.

 

[TacticalDoc]

I thought the gre 500 is a digital scanner. Also it states that the "radio unit is in some way connected to and dependent upon the motor vehicle's electrical power system; AND the radio unit is connected to an independent and external antenna capable of receiving broadcasts of law enforcement agencies."

doesn't this mean a hand held scanner is legal to have in your car w/o a ham license?

 

[Truckoholic]

I thought the gre 500 is a digital scanner. Also it states that the "radio unit is in some way connected to and dependent upon the motor vehicle's electrical power system; AND the radio unit is connected to an independent and external antenna capable of receiving broadcasts of law enforcement agencies."

doesn't this mean a hand held scanner is legal to have in your car w/o a ham license?

Yes, the GRE 500 IS a digital scanner, which is why I told you it is an excellent one to get.

And yes you are right, a portable handheld scanner IS legal in your car as long as it is not hooked to the cars power source or an external antenna. The reason I put so much emphasis on it being illegal, is because you were asking about external antennas. But as long as the scanner is just laying on your seat, or dash and not hooked up to an external antenna, then it appears to me that it is perfectly legal to have it in your vehicle. I would even think having it plugged into it's cigarette lighter socket charger would be okay, because that is simply charging its internal power source, and the scanner is not "Dependent on the vehicles electrical power system" as the governor said.

 

[TacticalDoc]

Yes, the GRE 500 IS a digital scanner, which is why I told you it is an excellent one to get.

And yes you are right, a portable handheld scanner IS legal in your car as long as it is not hooked to the cars power source or an external antenna. The reason I put so much emphasis on it being illegal, is because you were asking about external antennas. But as long as the scanner is just laying on your seat, or dash and not hooked up to an external antenna, then it appears to me that it is perfectly legal to have it in your vehicle. I would even think having it plugged into it's cigarette lighter socket charger would be okay, because that is simply charging its internal power source, and the scanner is not "Dependent on the vehicles electrical power system" as the governor said.

The quote above states powere supply AND (NOT OR) external antenna

 

[CanonNinja]

FYI, a lot of public service agencies (atleast here in Houston) are moving to the 700mhz bands within the next 12-18 month. Something to think about when looking at buying a new scanner

 

[TacticalDoc]

FYI, a lot of public service agencies (atleast here in Houston) are moving to the 700mhz bands within the next 12-18 month. Something to think about when looking at buying a new scanner

meaning what? getting an antenna thats specific for that range? The gre 500 scans those frequencies.

 

[TacticalDoc]

what about the GRE 700 and 800 model scanners. Seems like it would be easier to work with and not much more of a cost

 

[quickfarms]

A lot of good info

Here the police do not use the radio for critical communications because the media is listening and potentially broadcasting the information to the suspect

 

[Wile E. Coyote]

I wonder if a magmount with the cable run through the passenger side window constitutes an antenna 'dependent on the vehicle' as it's no more permanently mounted than your handheld scanner would be.

That Florida law really does seem ridiculous and largely unenforceable. If the object is to ban bad guys getting intel via the airwaves, why draw the distinction between handheld and mobile? If the bad guys *aren't* the target...why have the reg at all?

Someone's smoking the contents of the Property Room in Florida, I'm a-thinkin'.

 

[bonshawman]

A lot of good discussion.

Of Note: Certainly one should consider and abide by the applicable regulations.

Having said that: Logic begs the question "what would you be doing with your vehicle (and it's identifiable antenna) that would draw the attention of law enforcement to you?"

If you are speeding, showing up on fire or crime scenes, lurking around neighborhoods or business establishments late at night, you are drawing the attention of LEO. The fact that you have a scanner then heightens the suspicion of the LEO you encounter (and possibly rightfully so).

As a former LEO, I never stopped a vehicle for having an antenna. I would notice vehicles with multiple antennas, as one wondered "why?" - and of course if I ever stopped a vehicle and they were not in public service (firefighter, cop, news, DOT, etc) and they had a scanner (portable or not) I would investigate further. My crew cab dually has three distinct non stock antennas on it (I am a volunteer fire fighter), but no one has ever stopped me and asked about the antennas and what they were connected to (no external markings or emergency lights on my truck), because my BEHAVIOR does not draw attention to my vehicle or myself.

There is a REASON the Florida law was enacted - think about it. If your behavior does not draw attention to you, most likely you could enjoy your scanner with it's power source and external antenna. It is a risk/benefit decision for you.

The question: what purpose do you have for wanting a scanner in your vehicle? Entertainment? Information? Or taking action with your curiosity and appearing at and incident location that you would NOT have naturally come across without the intel from the scanner?

I would presume that unless your other activities warranted prosecution (like speeding, etc), the presence in and of a scanner alone would not generate a citation. Of course the law is the law, and you could always be subject to prosecution - but in my experience it was the actions of the individual (such as showing up at fire scenes, perhaps straying a bit into the "impersonation of an officer" in some manner at some incident, etc) that drew my attention, and the presence of a scanner just ratcheted it up.

You can go out and by a Crown Vic Police Interceptor (unmarked, of course), bristling with antennas and darkened by (legal) tinted windows and drive around - will you draw the attention of citizens? Of course - isn't that why you bought it? LEO? Most likely they will wonder who you are and with what agency. Is it legal? Sure, so long as you don't "impersonate" - but by its nature it will DRAW ATTENTION to you, with perhaps mixed results.
An innocuous antenna in a vehicle connected to a scanner, operated by someone with sensetivity to their behavior and its interpretations will, in my opinion, have little problems.

 

[TacticalDoc]

the reason I want it is for SHTF scenario and to listen for accidents which can be useful for work too.

what about the 700 and 800 models... are they worth an extra 100 bucks?

 

[rlwm211]

Hi Doc.

I am a ham operator as others are who have posted in this thread.

I would look into a dawn to daylight receiver from ICOM or Yaesu. You can find the entry level models on sale for about half of the original and they can be used as a receiver and also as a scanner. I recommend this as in a true SHTF you have no idea what frequencies you will want to follow and they may change as other agencies come into your area. Any of the higher end receivers like this are very capable and other than the cellular frequencies they can receive anything from Low Band to Microwaves.

I monitor mobile all the time and I have found it is not the antenna as much as it is a very selective and sensitive receiver that is necessary for good reception under difficult conditions. If the front end of a receiver is junk, it does not matter a hoot as to how much signal you send to it from your massive antenna array as it will simply overload a lower quality rig. You can go to EHAM.net and they have reviews of various types of equipment and if you find something you are interested in you can check out what others think about it before getting too serious about it.


I would offer that the Technician test is pretty easy and would be a good step on bringing your communication skills to a level where you could be far more efficient in taking care of your antenna needs and radio equipment.

Getting a ham license would be a great first step in making intelligent and financially prudent decisions as you pursue your needs in radios.

I hope I have helped out somewhat in your search.