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M923A2 Won't Stop Building Air

Navo

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Good Morning!

The temperature still hasn't been cold like it was the other days that I had and issue. Tomorrow's high is suppose to be 31 with the lows in the 20's. Even though it's 41 outside, I'm sitting in my truck right now and just started it up to see...... And............. It just popped off like normal. So tomorrow should be the big test! I said that earlier in the week, but we know how the weatherman are....
 

doghead

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Until you service your dryer, I would expect the problem to persist.
 

Navo

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Just an Update- This morning was windy and cold. Temps were around 25. Went outside and fired her up with no issues. I watched the air pressure gauge and right at 120 the air dryer popped as it should! So looks like it was the PPV valve. I won't be able to drive the truck again for a few weeks as I will be out of town. But, I'll have my dad drive it every now and then.

So at this point all is working as advertised. Thanks again for all your help guys! You all got me back on the road!

Andrew
 

bigwhale

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Have regular m923 did the same thing yesterday when it was 9 degrees out. I even tried to pre warm the engine and surrounding area with a salamander. The primary and secondary both overcharge and no blowdown. Tanks are drained always after use. The wipers, the 6 wheel drive interlock, and the horn NOT operative. Had the truck for over a year and does it only when its really cold. I see by the threads above the PPV valve is stuck. Where is the moisture comming from to freeze inside this valve if I drain the system after each use? Has anyone here thought of using methyl alcohol solution antifreeze spray or putting a tee before the valve to insert some of this "anti freeze" spray to defrost the unit and get rid of the moisture? I thought the older trucks had alcohol solution placed in the air system, did the older trucks have this alcohol based system? please elaborate and what kind of alcohol solution is safe to use on the plastic air pipes in the M923. Thanks again.
 

Scar59

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Bigwhale,
When was the last time the Halidex dryer filter/cartage was changed? Start there and remove and clean the ppv( or buy new).
 

datadawg

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The wipers, the 6 wheel drive interlock, and the horn NOT operative. I see by the threads above the PPV valve is stuck.
Thank goodness for this thread, I was freaking out... my 923a2 first lost horn 2 weeks ago and today wipers inop. I could hear clicking when pressing the horn, but nothing happening. Seems like my PPV is frozen/stuck. Glad it's a common problem, so at least I can now try to figure out cure. Is thawing out PPV just a short term fix that treats symptoms but not problem? Is the truck safe to drive?
 

doghead

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Thawing is the quick fix.

Maintaining your air dryer is the real fix.

Safe to drive if you thaw it, yes
 

datadawg

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Is there a link or thread showing how to service the air dryer? I tried to search, but didn't find anything. And also, when my primary and secondary pressure gauges go near 150, the truck makes a funky noise, much to my kids' delight... I gather from reading threads this is the excess pressure being released. Is this normal operating condition -- logically, I would have thought the compressor would be told to stop pressurizing air, rather than keep it going and release the overpressure.
 

wheelspinner

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The signal air for the governor is released from the non-primarysideof the air system. This side is fed air from the PPV. This is why you will have brakes, no accesories, and the compressor will continue to blow off the safety valve. These are all fail-safes to ensure brakes are always allowed o have air first. As far as servicing, I'm sure its right in the TM.
 

Neophyte

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Is there a link or thread showing how to service the air dryer? I tried to search, but didn't find anything. And also, when my primary and secondary pressure gauges go near 150, the truck makes a funky noise, much to my kids' delight... I gather from reading threads this is the excess pressure being released. Is this normal operating condition -- logically, I would have thought the compressor would be told to stop pressurizing air, rather than keep it going and release the overpressure.
The drier is a spin on canister (looks like an oil filter)......should come off by hand. It sits right behind the primary tank , black can (post #7 : http://www.steelsoldiers.com/showth...valve-opening-on-M925-Frozen-air-lines-valves). This will help once it warms up, allowing the water in the lines to be absorbed by the desiccant in the filter. Napa has them for about $130....part # DQ6036.

I ordered one through a favorite bidding site.......and the sealant bag had a hole in it (thought I was saving a buck)...therefore allowing the desiccant to absorb moisture over the years (was a NOS item from 2007). Buy this from a well known company, check the bag before taking delivery. Napa isn't cheap, but they always stand behind what they sell.
 

doghead

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Post 15, try clicking the link for some good info.

Maintenance will be in the -20 or -24 manual.
 

bigwhale

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I saw on youtube a guy from Montana whom "serviced " is Haldex canister and it looks like its a real bitch to get the large filter off. He was complaining that he had to crush the canister with giant channel locks to get it off. DQ6036 is the Haldex number I believe. As far as relying on the over pressure safety valve when having the pressures greater than 150 lbs, if it were my truck, I would not operate it with those high pressures since the lines are old and plastic and could blow out on you. You can operate it if need be temporarily, by cracking the drain valves on the primary and secondary tanks to keep the pressures down. It might make a funny noise that your kiddies might like to hear(pressure relief valve operation), but will cost you more time and $ when you have to replace those lines in your truck and you might have to cage your brakes to get her home (not fun). I aim to replace the PPV valve and the canister on mine as soon as weather permits and keep her parked till then. Will update and possibly take picts of the procedure.
 

Scar59

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If the large canister/filter has been installed for a long time it will rust/corrode to the housing. You will have to cut it off.
I've been there. My M35A3 from WPAFB sat for a long time. Had to remove the whole assembly and work it on the bench to remove the filter, literally cut it off w/ a wiz wheel. This system is designed to be maintained frequently,especially in high humidity enviorments.
JC
 

datadawg

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As far as relying on the over pressure safety valve when having the pressures greater than 150 lbs, if it were my truck, I would not operate it with those high pressures since the lines are old and plastic and could blow out on you. It might make a funny noise that your kiddies might like to hear(pressure relief valve operation), but will cost you more time and $ when you have to replace those lines in your truck and you might have to cage your brakes to get her home (not fun).
Bigwhale, thanks for the youtube tip, I did watch the video. I just got my truck, thinking it was very cool to have a monster, as well as give new life to tired soldiers, but to my dismay realizing these may require more mechanical aptitude and commitment than I can ever muster. My head is spinning from trying to read all the manuals online or even find the information. Every time I drive the truck (4 so far), there is some new nuance and I spend night after night trying to figure it out. I'm starting to wonder if I made a mistake, since the effort to build proficiency in operating and understanding these, at least for me, with my OCD, is Herculean. I never served and never drove these, so it makes things even worse... As far as the air blow noise, do I understand you correctly that my situation is not normal? Again, in my situation, the air pressure reaches some high level, and then gets blown off with attendant noise. I haven't tracked the exact PSI when it happens or how often, but guesstimate it's b/w 125-150 PSI. If I am just driving at 30 mph and not using brakes, every minute or so it makes that whooshing noise. I'm just trying to figure out if it's normal or not. I was thinking of taking it to a truck service center just to get some education and assistance, but I presume they are going to bend me over, realizing I have no clue. My truck is a RRAD 2011 overhaul, so I always assumed mechanically I will be in good shape. Now I am wincing every time I think about her.
 

bigwhale

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datadawg,
Eventhough yours is an overhaul as recently as 2011 you still need to understand that "stuff" is going to happen and one should expect that, similar to changing oil in your car etc. Anyway,the blow off (whoosh) is normal from under the truck near the 1st rear axle/ Its supposed to cycle at 125-135 psi. If the gauges read above 150 there is a problem. When you hit the brakes the air is released from the main (primary tank). his is expelled and the governor kicks in and recharges the system as needed under preset conditions. The more you hit the brakes the more air is purged. That is normal, but anything over 150 in either primary or secondary is bad news. I am replacing my PPV valve since mine was overcharging and its only a 25 dollar piece and an hours time. Dont get discouraged. Its a hobby after all.
 

datadawg

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So if you drive at 35 mph constant speed, no brake use, it's normal to get blow off periodically, b/c the compressor continues to pressurize the system??? Why would compressor keep working, so extra air must be blown off to prevent overpressurizing system? Why wouldn't the compressor cycle on and off as needed, to prevent overpressurizing system? I know this is not a good analogy, but my porter cable compressor for tools stops pressurizing the tank when it hits 120 psi... it doesn't keep working and trigger pressure relief valve just to modulate pressure.
 

wheelspinner

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Its impossible to know whether what you are experiencing is normal or not becasue you are too vague on what pressure you hear the "blowing off" at. If its below 130 indicated, yes its normal. If its above there (most likely the gauges will be pegged) its NOT normal. At that point you need to do other troubleshooting to determine if the fault is lack of supply air to the governor (PPV most likely) or the actual governor. If your compressor is cycling, its doing that in response to a need. In other words, if no brake applications are made, no accessories are running (i.e. wipers) then you have a leak. If the system holds pressure without leaking, the compressor stays off. Your truck works exactly like your home compressor when it is operating CORRECTLY. You may need to supply shop air to the truck with the engine off so that you can check for air leaks.
 

bigwhale

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Use your gauges. greater than 135 psi you have a problem , idleing driving, whatever . The compressor will stop if you have no leaks and system is fully charged at 135psi. If keeps charging you have air loss somewhere, or if needles are greater than 135-140 the ppv (pressure protection valve) is faulty 90% time or governor is faulty. Extreme cold sometimes plays havoc with airbrake systems.
 

datadawg

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Its impossible to know whether what you are experiencing is normal or not becasue you are too vague on what pressure you hear the "blowing off" at. If its below 130 indicated, yes its normal. If its above there (most likely the gauges will be pegged) its NOT normal. At that point you need to do other troubleshooting to determine if the fault is lack of supply air to the governor (PPV most likely) or the actual governor. If your compressor is cycling, its doing that in response to a need. In other words, if no brake applications are made, no accessories are running (i.e. wipers) then you have a leak. If the system holds pressure without leaking, the compressor stays off. Your truck works exactly like your home compressor when it is operating CORRECTLY. You may need to supply shop air to the truck with the engine off so that you can check for air leaks.
Thank you, that is very helpful. When it gets warmer, I will take her on the road and do some diagnosis.
 
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