Just Got My Deuce, and of course a few new questions.

[EWhytsell]

Buy your paint from RAPCO and you'll get that nice finish you like.

 

[Heath_h49008]

The wiring diagram is in the stickies, but just track the wires and remember you only need to check continuity one at a time. It's not bad as long as you go slow and check each one off like a list. That way you can find the problem without just throwing parts at it.

Welcome to the asylum. She's a good looking truck and a very good save. Nice job!

 

[Reaper651]

Hey All,
A little update to the thread. I did some work to the Deuce last weekend. I changed the fuel, ran the return line at the tank into a can and got ALL the old red dye out of the system. Then I changed the fuel filters. What idiot decided the location of the primary?!! Anyway, all the filters were military. The primary was plugged and full of mud, the secondary had a little bit of crud in the can and the filter was dirty and the final wasn't too bad. It was weird, the secondary filter's lower cup had a larger washer and oring than the final's, but everything looked like it would seal just fine and luckily I brought my extensive collection of CAT orings that I've acquired over the years and was able to find a perfect match for everything. The filter can nut deal on the filter head of the final had no oring at all so the leak was an easy fix. I filled the secondary can with Seafoam but lost a little of it when bleeding the air out. OOOPS! Quite a bit stayed in the system but I'm going to get some more and add it to the fuel for a little extra help. I then drove the truck around for about 30 minutes and WOW, it ran a lot better. It smokes like a non turbo multifuel now. Actually had a bit of git up and go too. It idled ok when warm but was still a little low, about 500RPM. I had to turn up the idle screw on the IP's throttle arm about 1 3/8 turns and it idles nice and smooth and starts up nicely warm or cold. It is idling about 700 to 750RPM according to the tach. After doing this, I went for another drive around the ranch. The truck purred right along. I love driving it but that Armstrong steering definitely gives the arms a good workout. Aint too bad though and definitely worth it. I also used the troubleshooting TM to figure out that the alternator and the Accessory switch need to be R&R'd. I wonder how much it costs to have the alternator rebuilt? I still need to root out the lack of power to the gages. I can't wait to get the truck squared away and registered so I can go for a real drive. lol I'm twitching and drooling a little just talking about it.


Edit: I almost forgot. There is a little bit of oily black crud coming from the exhaust manifold to exhaust pipe flange. Should I be worried?

Thanks again all for your help and advice.

 

[cattlerepairman]

I wonder how much it costs to have the alternator rebuilt? I still need to root out the lack of power to the gages. There is a little bit of oily black crud coming from the exhaust manifold to exhaust pipe flange. Should I be worried?

Alternator: depends; if you have shop in your area that can do it, ask for a quote. Also consider replacing stock alternator with a modern type alternator, maybe even go dual 24/12V. Do a search - ready made brackets available for both options. TM America on this site makes bracket kits to bolt a readiliy available Delco 27si alternator to the multifuel engine.

Gauges: no power to all gauges - check ground. The gauges are grounded via the instrument panel itself, including the four mounting screws of the panel! Of course, a defective accessory switch could also be the reason.

Crud: define "a little". Maybe a pic? Does not sound like anything unusual. Are you perhaps talking about the short stub where the slobber tube should attach? (if yours does not have one, put one on).

 

[Heath_h49008]

Switch AND alternator? I would fix the switch first and then retest. There are a couple of things in common with both that could be throwing you off.

 

[Reaper651]

Alternator: depends; if you have shop in your area that can do it, ask for a quote. Also consider replacing stock alternator with a modern type alternator, maybe even go dual 24/12V. Do a search - ready made brackets available for both options. TM America on this site makes bracket kits to bolt a readiliy available Delco 27si alternator to the multifuel engine.

Gauges: no power to all gauges - check ground. The gauges are grounded via the instrument panel itself, including the four mounting screws of the panel! Of course, a defective accessory switch could also be the reason.

Crud: define "a little". Maybe a pic? Does not sound like anything unusual. Are you perhaps talking about the short stub where the slobber tube should attach? (if yours does not have one, put one on).

There are ready made brackets for the Delco Alternators!?! AWESOME!!! I have a Delco 150Amp 12 volt self exciting new/reman alternator that was given to me. If I remember right, I have had these converted to 24 volt in the past so that's no big deal. My issue was the mount system, but if they are already made, I just might go ahead with it. Plus, I imagine they are a lot more common than the Deuce factory alternators. Not to mention no more D@mn exciter wire.
I was going to diagnose the gages last weekend but ran out of time, and I didn't feel like taking off the tach and speedo cables. I will get a fresh start on it next weekend. If the ground must go through the panel and the QR mounts, I think I will make a ground wire for it but I'm going to figure out the problem first.

The crud coming from the exhaust flange is black and quite sticky. It doesn't seem like engine oil. I wish I would have taken a pic. The slobber tube definitely needs a hose but the crud is for sure coming from the exhaust flange. There are about 5 drops on the top of the starter and some residue on the bottom of the flange after about an hour and 20 minutes total run time. I'm figuring that its just a combination of old fuel and accumulated goo in the combustion chambers from sitting for seven years that has finally gotten hot enough to liquefy and/or the seafoam has loosened up. I will monitor it closely but I hope its nothing serious. There also was a good bit of blow by coming from the slobber tube and a slight combustion knock coming from #2 piston, but after a bit of running, the knock has gone away and it looks like the blow by has reduced a lot. I figure the rings are starting to wake up and seal properly. I'm pretty sure that the LD and LDT motors have piston squirters, I think I read that in the Engine TM's, so that will help get the rings and cylinders wet again.

Switch AND alternator? I would fix the switch first and then retest. There are a couple of things in common with both that could be throwing you off.

What I did after finding out that both #11 wires were hot but the master switch wasn't giving power to the #1 wire, was I jumped the #1 wire to positive on the battery. After doing this, the exciter wire had power at the alternator. With the engine running, I still had no current coming from the charge wire on the alternator so I attempted to adjust the voltage output according to the troubleshooting manual and was not able to make it change. Maybe I missed something so I will get a new master switch and then do the test again.

Thanks very much for the help.

 

[Reaper651]

Hey all,
Another update. I did some more work to the Deuce. I determined via the Org. Level troubleshooting TM that my fuel level, water temp, and oil pressure gages are done for. I then flushed the brake system and oiled the air pack's air piston. I also discovered my source of brake fluid loss, apparently my truck had the old style hydraulic brake light switch and fluid was actually leaking through the switch itself. I guess the new fluid cleaned everything out because fluid started running out of the brake switch when I pressed the pedal. I removed the switch and capped the end of the Air pack slave cylinder, re-bled the brakes and they work great now. I can lock all ten tires on dirt without much pedal pressure. I will convert to an air operated brake light switch in the future. So far, I can't find any other leaks in the brake system and the pedal is solid. There wasn't very much debris in the old brake fluid either and I didn't see much water. I was surprised how everything still works good. I believe that my truck had DOT 3 or 4 fluid in it because it was dark like normal fluid would be after being in the system for a long time. Does DOT 5 get dark over time? I greased everything and took it for a drive around the ranch. I got into a soft patch down by the river bed and actually HAD to lock the front drive to back out of it. Once I locked the front it cruised right out. I noticed that when the front is disengaged, I have to back up a bit, then go forward to get it to unlock. Is that normal? What is your standard procedure for ensuring the front drive is locked/unlocked. I also realized how much the non turbo multi fuel smokes. YES Its like a 671 Detroit with a plugged air filter running on pure engine oil with some oil soaked shop rags stuck in the tailpipe. I think its cool but I'm afraid I might get an excessive smoke ticket when I start driving it on road. I think the C turbo would be authentic for this truck but a D turbo seems to be the best. If I can find a C for a good deal, I might try to get one. I also would like a turbo, because where I will be moving, the high elevation will play h$ll on the non turbo Multi. I also noticed that the RPM fluctuates a little bit at idle, and when I let off the throttle, I noticed that the RPM drops to about 500, then picks back up to 700. Its not a problem and I figure its normal. Maybe not?

 

[brianp454]

Yes, DOT 5 yellows with time. If you do a web search you'll find many folks posting about it here and on the motorcycle sites. If you take a sample of brake fluid you're concerened about it takes seconds to test it. Take a couple clear SOLD cups and half fill them with water, squirt in your sample. DOT 3 will mix with water while DOT 5 will not mix and come to rest on top of the water. I have pictures if you want to see them.

I have a D turbo if interested.

Sounds like you may want to adjust your idle up a bit. If you search the site there's instructions with pics. It's also in the TM's as you know.

Hey all,
Another update. I did some more work to the Deuce. I determined via the Org. Level troubleshooting TM that my fuel level, water temp, and oil pressure gages are done for. I then flushed the brake system and oiled the air pack's air piston. I also discovered my source of brake fluid loss, apparently my truck had the old style hydraulic brake light switch and fluid was actually leaking through the switch itself. I guess the new fluid cleaned everything out because fluid started running out of the brake switch when I pressed the pedal. I removed the switch and capped the end of the Air pack slave cylinder, re-bled the brakes and they work great now. I can lock all ten tires on dirt without much pedal pressure. I will convert to an air operated brake light switch in the future. So far, I can't find any other leaks in the brake system and the pedal is solid. There wasn't very much debris in the old brake fluid either and I didn't see much water. I was surprised how everything still works good. I believe that my truck had DOT 3 or 4 fluid in it because it was dark like normal fluid would be after being in the system for a long time. Does DOT 5 get dark over time? I greased everything and took it for a drive around the ranch. I got into a soft patch down by the river bed and actually HAD to lock the front drive to back out of it. Once I locked the front it cruised right out. I noticed that when the front is disengaged, I have to back up a bit, then go forward to get it to unlock. Is that normal? What is your standard procedure for ensuring the front drive is locked/unlocked. I also realized how much the non turbo multi fuel smokes. YES Its like a 671 Detroit with a plugged air filter running on pure engine oil with some oil soaked shop rags stuck in the tailpipe. I think its cool but I'm afraid I might get an excessive smoke ticket when I start driving it on road. I think the C turbo would be authentic for this truck but a D turbo seems to be the best. If I can find a C for a good deal, I might try to get one. I also would like a turbo, because where I will be moving, the high elevation will play h$ll on the non turbo Multi. I also noticed that the RPM fluctuates a little bit at idle, and when I let off the throttle, I noticed that the RPM drops to about 500, then picks back up to 700. Its not a problem and I figure its normal. Maybe not?

 

[Woodsplinter]

Regarding your gauges, did you troubleshoot them using an ohmmeter? I followed the troubleshooting guide for my oil pressure gauge and discovered the values in the TM are wrong. It indicated my gauge was bad but it was actually the sending unit. I discovered this by talking to Erik at www.eriksmilitarysurplus.com. He is a whiz with troubleshooting.
I thought it suspicious that the TM indicated you had 3 bad gauges- I think it's more likely sending units would be bad but I could be wrong.


Just trying to save you some $$ if I can since I've already been down this road.


Mark

 

[Dipstick]

I agree with splinter with the exception that I just check each circuit for continuity. My troubleshooting regimen goes wire continuity, loose connection at the sender, bad Packard fitting, sender, and lastly the gauge itself. I replaced all of my gauges, the gauge spider, and my senders. I'm not made of money, but Brutus' original gauges were illegible and I really like to know what Brutus and his Whistler are doing at any given moment. Welcome to the addiction! Howdy splinter!

 

[Dipstick]

Oh hey guys, how do I list a description of my green metal pal at the bottom of my posts? I would like it to read something like "truncated 1984 AM General M35A2C". Thanks.

 

[Woodsplinter]

Click on "settings" button at top right corner of main screen. On next screen go to left side and scroll down to "edit signature". Click on that and you can enter what you want on the next screen.

 

[Reaper651]

Regarding your gauges, did you troubleshoot them using an ohmmeter? I followed the troubleshooting guide for my oil pressure gauge and discovered the values in the TM are wrong. It indicated my gauge was bad but it was actually the sending unit. I discovered this by talking to Erik at www.eriksmilitarysurplus.com. He is a whiz with troubleshooting.
I thought it suspicious that the TM indicated you had 3 bad gauges- I think it's more likely sending units would be bad but I could be wrong.


Just trying to save you some $$ if I can since I've already been down this road.


Mark

Thanks for the advice. I did troubleshoot with a ohmmeter. I too thought it was strange that all three gauges were bad.(The volt meter, air pressure, speedo and tach all work) I made sure everything had power and all sending wires had continuity, I even turned the master switch on and unhooked the sending wires and tried grounding each one and could not make any gauge needles move. I will call Erik and talk to him about it. I at least want to get the oil pressure gauge working asap, having to install a manual gauge every time I want to drive it is getting old quickly. Also, I know that the 3 lever switch has a setting for panel lights, but I don't see a bulb or wires for bulbs on any of the gauges. Am I missing something there? I will be running my truck at night mostly and I definitely want backlit gauges. Thanks for the help.

 

[Reaper651]

Sorry I forgot to mention, I noticed that the free play adjustment clevis on the clutch linkage appears to be set to it's shortest setting. The clutch pedal has about 1 3/4" of free play so it will be ok for a little bit, but I'm guessing that a clutch replacement is in my future. I was kinda surprised but I guess its normal. I have looked at several surplus websites and they all seem to have the "6 finger" clutch discs rather circular clutch discs. I'm guessing that the "6 finger" disc is standard for a Deuce? I wonder what the difference is?

 

[Woodsplinter]

Can't help with the clutch- don't know anything about it. Regarding the instrument lights the gauges do not have individual bulbs. They are lit by 2 bulbs mounted between the upper and lower rows of gauges. (Under the round, screw-in covers).

Its a terrible system and there are several threads about attempts to fix it. I wrote one where I used two red led's mounted in front of the instrument panel to light the front of the gauges. Not perfect but much better.

I have a slightly used 60 psi oil pressure sending unit and gauge I will let you have if you pay the shipping. They work fine and look brand new. PM me if you want them.

 

[rustystud]

Sorry I forgot to mention, I noticed that the free play adjustment clevis on the clutch linkage appears to be set to it's shortest setting. The clutch pedal has about 1 3/4" of free play so it will be ok for a little bit, but I'm guessing that a clutch replacement is in my future. I was kinda surprised but I guess its normal. I have looked at several surplus websites and they all seem to have the "6 finger" clutch discs rather circular clutch discs. I'm guessing that the "6 finger" disc is standard for a Deuce? I wonder what the difference is?

The military went to the ceramic style disc years ago since the ceramics can hold up better to heat and pressure better then the old fiber/asbestos ones. You can still get them though through regular truck parts shops. I would stick with the ceramic ones myself. You just have to learn to NOT slip the clutch like you would with a fiber disc.
I know some on this site will say there deuce came with a fiber disc, well the National Guard and Reserve units had to use up all the old stock from the regular military supply. My last couple of years in the Marines where spent in a reserve unit in vehicle maintenance . As a sergeant part of my job was to requisition parts and supplies ( what a pain in the A$$ job it was too ! Can you say triplicate !!! ) and this was before computers where in common use . We got all the old obsolete parts and just had to make due with them.

 

[Reaper651]

The military went to the ceramic style disc years ago since the ceramics can hold up better to heat and pressure better then the old fiber/asbestos ones. You can still get them though through regular truck parts shops. I would stick with the ceramic ones myself. You just have to learn to NOT slip the clutch like you would with a fiber disc.
I know some on this site will say there deuce came with a fiber disc, well the National Guard and Reserve units had to use up all the old stock from the regular military supply. My last couple of years in the Marines where spent in a reserve unit in vehicle maintenance . As a sergeant part of my job was to requisition parts and supplies ( what a pain in the A$$ job it was too ! Can you say triplicate !!! ) and this was before computers where in common use . We got all the old obsolete parts and just had to make due with them.

Ahhhh, so the "6 Finger" Clutch is Ceramic, and the full round one is asbestos. Thanks for ending my confusion. And its just a standard clutch? No special military thing? I like that, makes it easier. I am thinking its a 14" clutch but I'm probably wrong. Ya know, I will bet that mine has an asbestos clutch disc. Since I drove my truck the first time, I have been amazed at how smooth it is. My service truck has a ceramic clutch and its a pita trying to take off with out the truck lurching a bit. Ok well its not too bad but takes a bit of getting used to.

Thanks for your help.

 

[Reaper651]

Can't help with the clutch- don't know anything about it. Regarding the instrument lights the gauges do not have individual bulbs. They are lit by 2 bulbs mounted between the upper and lower rows of gauges. (Under the round, screw-in covers).

Its a terrible system and there are several threads about attempts to fix it. I wrote one where I used two red led's mounted in front of the instrument panel to light the front of the gauges. Not perfect but much better.

Are you talking about the two lights between the rows of gauges in this picture? I've been wondering what they do. I haven't been able to find anything in the TM's about these two lights either. I'm probably not looking in the right one. I thought they were turn signal indicators but I haven't got my turn signals working yet to see. I can't imagine they light the gauges up very well.
Thanks for the help. Lol I was starting to pull my beard hairs out while trying to figure out how the gauges lit up with no bulbs in them.

 

[Woodsplinter]

Yes, those are the bulbs I'm talking about. If you unscrew the cap you will find a bulb inside. The gauges have open spaces or "windows" around their edges. In theory the light from the two bulbs shines through the edges of the gauges to illuminate them. In practice it just doesn't work very well. Sometimes cleaning the gauges will help if the edges are dirty.

Others have tried different bulbs, LEDs, etc. with varying results- there are threads covering this.

Their is only one turn signal indicator for both directions and the 4-way flashers- it has a green cover and is located on the turn signal switch.

 

[rustystud]

Yes, those are the bulbs I'm talking about. If you unscrew the cap you will find a bulb inside. The gauges have open spaces or "windows" around their edges. In theory the light from the two bulbs shines through the edges of the gauges to illuminate them. In practice it just doesn't work very well. Sometimes cleaning the gauges will help if the edges are dirty.

Others have tried different bulbs, LEDs, etc. with varying results- there are threads covering this.

Their is only one turn signal indicator for both directions and the 4-way flashers- it has a green cover and is located on the turn signal switch.

The only way to go if you really want light on your gauges is to replace all the military gauges and go with civilian ones. As for me, I've replace my oil pressure gauge and I'm thinking about the Voltage and coolant but the rest can stay as they are.