Pre-Oiler

[cev65]

Where can I find info on homemade pre oil systems??

 

[gimpyrobb]

Do a search!

Only one I know of for sure:
http://www.steelsoldiers.com/showthread.php?21974-Prelube-filter-adapter-Mech-gauge&highlight=

 

[dmetalmiki]

That post brings back memories..Now all mine have pre-lubes. But now I use old fork lift mast pumps. I also got lazy and use (on mine) the rear drain plug for the supply, and tap into the first oil filter can.
https://youtu.be/9Gt6Y873VMg

 

[tim292stro]

This is the one I'm putting in my XM1027 Cummins/CUCV-clone: TurboSafe

IIRC, they also have an engine pre-lube version for about the same price (was $300 when I bought, imported from Canada Eh?)

 

[Jeepsinker]

Search "Johnson gear pump" they come in 12 or 24v and were meant to be used to suck oil out of boat engines to avoid spillage in sensitive environments. They come in a kit for around $120 bucks. No reason you couldn't plumb one in to work. I believe they build 30 psi, and use dot air line and npt fittings.

 

[gimpyrobb]

Nah, not enough volume to pressurize the deuce's oil galleys.

 

[gimpyrobb]

If you guys are really worried about it, some starters have pre-lube pumps built into them.

 

[welldigger]

While a prelube system is neat, I honestly doubt anyone drives their duece enough to ever see the benefits. That includes you Jeepsinker lol.

 

[rustystud]

While a prelube system is neat, I honestly doubt anyone drives their duece enough to ever see the benefits. That includes you Jeepsinker lol.

You have a valid point there welldigger. With new style spin-on oil filters oil pressure builds right away.

 

[gimpyrobb]

Rusty, thats arguable. It is quicker, but not right away.

 

[tim292stro]

I like pre-oilers because they get pressure behind that oil before the engine is spinning, so you have a good oil film before it gets up to revs - less pressure building time for the oil pump too. The pre/post-oiler I have for the turbo is just to prolong the service life of the turbo, moving to a water cooled Garret center will also help prevent cooking the oil after a shutdown (thermosiphon keeps water circulating even though the engine water pump isn't running).

 

[oddshot]

While a prelube system is neat, I honestly doubt anyone drives their deuce enough to ever see the benefits. That includes you Jeepsinker lol.

I guess you'd have to ask a guy who broke a camshaft due to cam bearing worn out from dry starts.

Dry starts is the reason we all were looking so hard at them one way valves a couple months back.

I think I'm back to looking at some kind of oil pump (maybe something out of a 350 Chevy) driven by a starter motor.

Nah, not enough volume to pressurize the deuce's oil galleys.

In this instance, isn't the answer to "not enough volume" ... just give it a little more time pumping?

Given enough time, I would think that any pump should be able to fill any container ... but I ain't a pump guy. I'm sure experts could fill in the blanks for me.



This being said, I would much rather give a pre-pump 8 seconds to fill the system and bring it up to 30 PSI ... than run an engine for 8 seconds without oil pressure. Being able to push a little cool (relatively) oil through a turbo on shut down is all gravy.

 

[gimpyrobb]

In this instance, isn't the answer to "not enough volume" ... just give it a little more time pumping?

Given enough time, I would think that any pump should be able to fill any container ... but I ain't a pump guy. I'm sure experts could fill in the blanks for me.

The problem is, your filling a passageway. If you don't have enough volume, you'll NEVER fill it.

Don't think of it as a container, its a continuous loop.

Clear as mud?

 

[welldigger]

To say your cam failed because of dry starts is a bit of a stretch. It's not a super common failure in the multifuel.

 

[oddshot]

The problem is, your filling a passageway. If you don't have enough volume, you'll NEVER fill it.

Don't think of it as a container, its a continuous loop.

Clear as mud?

OK ... maybe not a container ... but not a continuous loop (out of oil pan, back to oil pan, if I understand what you are trying to say) either.

You are right in some sense, there are passageways, but they just don't dump oil back into the pan.

It is those passageways that lead to bearings, the clearance of which (between the bearing and the journal) cause a resistance. We know this resistance as oil pressure.

Indeed, if we pulled out the cam and just cranked the oil pump ... we would never get enough volume.

 

[gimpyrobb]

Think about how long it will take to fill the oil filter housings(how long does your stock oil pump take to make oil pressure?). Volume does matter. Pressure will not be achieved till the oil filters are fulled up and then goes to the small passageways. If just anything would do, there would be many more pre-oilers and much cheaper to boot.

 

[oddshot]

Search "Johnson gear pump" they come in 12 or 24v and were meant to be used to suck oil out of boat engines to avoid spillage in sensitive environments. They come in a kit for around $120 bucks. No reason you couldn't plumb one in to work. I believe they build 30 psi, and use dot air line and npt fittings.

Got a part number? It turns out that Johnson makes a bunch of pumps.

 

[oddshot]

Think about how long it will take to fill the oil filter housings(how long does your stock oil pump take to make oil pressure?). Volume does matter. Pressure will not be achieved till the oil filters are fulled up and then goes to the small passageways.

Please re-read my post #12. I never said volume "didn't matter" ... I asked if allowing a pre-pump to to pump for 8 seconds or even 10 seconds to fill all those passage-ways is better than a dry start-up. I cannot think of a single instant where running an engine for 8 seconds without oil pressure was a good idea.


BUT ... the op was looking for info on homebuilt pre-lubers.

Before we started looking at one-way valves for the oil filter housing to retain oil ... I was looking at building my own from a GM starter motor and the oil pump from a 350 Chevy. I've seen folks use cobbled-up pumps like this for other uses ... and I still can't see any reason not to use this as a starting point to home-brew a pre-luber.

 

[gimpyrobb]

Ehh, unless the motor is one that you have built, the point is moot.

The short time we might drive them is nothing compared to the damage already done.

 

[welldigger]

A prelube system is an answer to a non existent problem. There are many diesel engines with well over a million miles on them with no prelube system. While the multifuel has its share of problems, lack of lubrication isn't one of them.

If it makes you feel better modern spin on oil filters with antidrainback valves will build oil pressure within 3 seconds. This is about the same as any other engine.