Sudden Deuce Starting Issue

[cthein]

Hey Guys - long time lurker here, first time poster.

I've been reading and I think I'm mostly trying to avoid having to take the HH apart and am on here to try a last hail mary. I'll try and provide as much detail as possible:

I bought my bobbed deuce about 6 months ago in San Diego, CA and drove it ~500 miles up to where I live in the bay area. No problems. I try to drive it at least once a month and get the engine nice and hot. Recently, about a month and a half ago, I changed out all of the fluids, except radiator, and switched to spin-on fuel filter adapters (already had the spin-on oil filter adapters). At the same time I switched over from straight diesel to ~20% WMO. After all of the work I took it out for a spin, maybe a 20 min drive, and then parked it and didn't try to start it again until a few days ago - which is where my problem began. She cranks just fine, but I wasn't getting any ignition. With the LP on I get fuel out of the secondary and primary bleeders. After that I took out the 3/4" bolt in the top of the HH and I get fuel out from there with the LP on, but it doesn't come out super fast - like a slow oozing. The IP seems to reciprocate when I crank the engine, so I don't think it is stuck. I took the cap off of where the fuel cut-off is and the arm returns easily, but only to 6 oclock, it never, even with pushing it, goes to 7 oclock. Another item I noticed is that if I hold my foot on the gas pedal I can occasionally get it to start for about a second or two, but it immediately dies. I also cracked one of the injector lines and got no fuel out. Another note: i've left the LP on for ~10 minutes straight to help bleed any air out.

I feel like a lot of this says it's an issue with the fuel cut off, but besides not returning to 7 oclock it seems to be in order. From what I read on here I probably need to take my HH apart and see if my bottom button is still in place. Please let me know if any of you have thoughts on this.

Thank you for taking the time to read this.

 

[gimpyrobb]

I'd soak the fuel lever with some ATF or penetrating fluid to try and get full range of motion.

Does the lever move freely other than not getting full range of motion?

 

[rustystud]

You probably got the fuel system mucked up with the waste oil. How clean was the oil you used ? Did you filter it before you used it ? Did you "cut" the oil with gasoline ? Remember it needs to flow like diesel. You will probably need to replace all the filters and pull the fuel pump out and clean it also. Then I would drain your fuel tank and put in some straight diesel and try and start it with that. You still might have problems with the injection pump so use a good cleaner in the fuel until it cleans up and runs right.

 

[cthein]

Thanks guys - forgot to mention that I filter all of the WMO through a 5 micron filter before putting it in the tank. Running ~80% diesel, 20% filtered WMO. Truck has run for >30 minutes on this before this incident.

Gimpy, I'll open that up again tomorrow and use some pb blaster to try and loosen it. Lever moves freely though and always returns to 6 o'clock.

 

[orren]

I'm finding that the HH single plunger is very easy to damage with more than sub micron filtering. Had much trouble trying to
use WVO even at one micron filtering because of extremely fine particles of burnt grease(carbon) that are very hard
and abrasive. I would suggest not trying to use WVO or WMO unless you know of a way to clean it better.
Good luck.

Thanks guys - forgot to mention that I filter all of the WMO through a 5 micron filter before putting it in the tank. Running ~80% diesel, 20% filtered WMO. Truck has run for >30 minutes on this before this incident.

Gimpy, I'll open that up again tomorrow and use some pb blaster to try and loosen it. Lever moves freely though and always returns to 6 o'clock.

 

[Floridianson]

The Head removal is not hard and I am betting on the button. Now there was a thread where the delivery valve spring was broken and that corrected the hard starting problem. There is also the overflow valve that can cause hard starting problems but I have never seen a thread with the problem. Clean the IP well before starting and watch the two small parts on the fuel control assembly on the head don't end up lost.
As for the control at 6 c"lock that is fine. Just as long as it is not stuck on the 4 o"clock or shut down.
As for the 7 o'clock position that can be because of where the main fuel adjustment is set. If one was to increase the fuel at the main fuel control nuts the leaver could end up at the 8 o'clock position before starting but that would be way to much fuel. Maybe after you get the hard starting problem fixed then you might want to get Pyro and tweek your main fuel and the control assembly clock will change too.

 

[searls84]

I had a similar problem a couple years ago. Mine would start and idle but progressively got worse, to the point where it wouldn't start and stay running without holding the throttle. I had been running WMO and just let the stock filters do the cleaning/filtering. Bad Idea! Long story short, the fine particulate in the WMO toasted the plunger in the HH. Unless you have the capability to filter the WMO down past the 1 micron point, I wouldn't run it. In my opinion, yes these trucks can run on almost anything combustible but it's not worth ruining and replacing expensive parts in order to save a couple bucks at the pump. Here is the link to the thread on my WMO woes. I have a couple take out IPs for a good price listed in the classifieds if that turns out to be your problem.

http://www.steelsoldiers.com/showthread.php?105791-HH-Orings-replaced-now-low-power&highlight=

 

[gimpyrobb]

You probably got the fuel system mucked up with the waste oil. How clean was the oil you used ? Did you filter it before you used it ? Did you "cut" the oil with gasoline ? Remember it needs to flow like diesel. You will probably need to replace all the filters and pull the fuel pump out and clean it also. Then I would drain your fuel tank and put in some straight diesel and try and start it with that. You still might have problems with the injection pump so use a good cleaner in the fuel until it cleans up and runs right.

Not really Greg, I've run 100% wmo in the past, even in winter

I had a similar problem a couple years ago. Mine would start and idle but progressively got worse, to the point where it wouldn't start and stay running without holding the throttle. I had been running WMO and just let the stock filters do the cleaning/filtering. Bad Idea! Long story short, the fine particulate in the WMO toasted the plunger in the HH. Unless you have the capability to filter the WMO down past the 1 micron point, I wouldn't run it. In my opinion, yes these trucks can run on almost anything combustible but it's not worth ruining and replacing expensive parts in order to save a couple bucks at the pump. Here is the link to the thread on my WMO woes. I have a couple take out IPs for a good price listed in the classifieds if that turns out to be your problem.

I've run enough wmo to justify buying new IPs. Its actually saved me thousands.

 

[cthein]

Truck was running perfectly until this issue with not being able to start - time to soak the fuel lever

 

[Floridianson]

It's not the fuel leaver.

 

[gimpyrobb]

Its either the lever or the button. Its easier to try the lever first. If it moves freely, it might be the button.

 

[plym49]

I'm finding that the HH single plunger is very easy to damage with more than sub micron filtering. Had much trouble trying to
use WVO even at one micron filtering because of extremely fine particles of burnt grease(carbon) that are very hard
and abrasive. I would suggest not trying to use WVO or WMO unless you know of a way to clean it better.
Good luck.

Not really Greg, I've run 100% wmo in the past, even in winter


I've run enough wmo to justify buying new IPs. Its actually saved me thousands.

GR, are you filtering to under a micron? What is the real deal on running WMO without clogging filters or killing pumps?

 

[cthein]

Doesn't seem to be the lever - time to remove the HH. Thank you to all and I will report back with my findings in a week or two. Have to find the time for the fun work

 

[gimpyrobb]

A while back, I won a "lot" from GL. In addition to the items I was bidding to win, it also had some 10micron filters in it. I have been using those for years and haven't had any issues.

I am going to make a centrifuge to clean the oil as I'm running out of free filters to use. Once you have the centrifuge setup, all you have to do is clean the bowl, no filters to buy.

 

[rustystud]

A while back, I won a "lot" from GL. In addition to the items I was bidding to win, it also had some 10micron filters in it. I have been using those for years and haven't had any issues.

I am going to make a centrifuge to clean the oil as I'm running out of free filters to use. Once you have the centrifuge setup, all you have to do is clean the bowl, no filters to buy.

That would be the only way I would use Waste Motor Oil in my truck, a centrifuge. Costly on initial investment, but you would save in the long run. Also about running straight oil. I never had anything good happen when I did it. If I cut the oil with gasoline it worked so much better. I haven't run any waste oil for some time but I'm still saving it up and plan on buying a centrifuge later on.

 

[Floridianson]

Doesn't seem to be the lever - time to remove the HH. Thank you to all and I will report back with my findings in a week or two. Have to find the time for the fun work

I might check the delivery valve spring first as it is a quick and easy. Just don't loose the spring or needle. Also is your FDC bypassed. That needs to be done.