MEP gooroo's, question for you

[ClintA]

We use our MEP's for pumping water for cattle, all wells have submersible pumps (3 and 4 horse) and every pump has a control box and on the bottom of the control box has 2 reset buttons. So here we go with the question, the ranch bought 2 MEP802a's and at one pump station sits a 002a with dead batteries. (I did not know what was wrong with the 002a at the time) My Dad tried to start it and I was not there, so I pulled the new 802a to the pump station and all was working just fine, the 802a was putting out the right volts, but the control box reset button keep tripping no matter what I tried. So I take the batteries out of the 802A and put them on the 002A and hook it up, the pump runs just fine with same volts going down the hole. I went down and checked it this morning and it had pumped all night. I did not have time today to retry the 802a.
So what am I missing? Am I doing anything wrong/different?
Is it old school Vs new school? Any thoughts and like always, thanks in advance, Clint

 

[Korgoth1]

Are you sure you hooked up your lines correctly? Are both reconection switches in the correct position? Has this unit been load tested/used before?

 

[Daybreak]

Howdy,
Naming is everything... what are you calling the control box reset button's?

Was a light lit on the Fault indicators? which one was lit?

Have you run this MEP-802A before and loaded it to ensure its ready to go.

Behind panel set for 120/240 single phase, hots to L1 and L3, N = neutral and Ground of course. Ground rod in the ground and connected to ground.

 

[ClintA]

The control box is for the pump itself and is mounted on the windmill tower, it has nothing to do with the 802A or the 002A, every submersible pump has one, they have the starting capacitors inside that stars/ runs the pump and the reset buttons are on bottom of that box. The momentary toggle switch that puts power to L1-L3 is on and the green light is on and I have full power to both L1-l3. It is wired same as the 002A with grounded to ground both on genset and windmill tower. The 802A has 14 hours on meter but this is the first time we have ever used it so this is its first test. The 802A lugs down when load is put on unit just like the 002A does and I check the voltage and it stays steady the hole time. It will pump water for a few minutes every time I tried.
What it boils down to is that the 802A is new to me, we won 2 of them and I am looking for a voltage regulator for the 2nd unit so I can try it.

 

[ZiggyO]

I think it might be gfci related....

Z

 

[Guyfang]

OK, If it was here in germany, where we use three phases, I would say check to see if the pump rotation is correct. But you all use two phases, right? It is possible for you to check rotation? If I remember right, the capacitor can be hooked up in two different ways, to achieve rotation in two different directions. You say it pumped water for a few minutes both times. Did it pump enough water. It is one of the first things I look at when we have this kind of problem.A pump running backwards WILL pump some water. Just not enough. At some point in time the pump shuts off, because it is running backwards. It gives us a warning like overload.

 

[ClintA]

OK, If it was here in germany, where we use three phases, I would say check to see if the pump rotation is correct. But you all use two phases, right? It is possible for you to check rotation? If I remember right, the capacitor can be hooked up in two different ways, to achieve rotation in two different directions. You say it pumped water for a few minutes both times. Did it pump enough water. It is one of the first things I look at when we have this kind of problem.A pump running backwards WILL pump some water. Just not enough. At some point in time the pump shuts off, because it is running backwards. It gives us a warning like overload.

Yes we use 2 phase, and the water pump will only pump one direction that I know of. It has to be the 802A is not doing it's job for some unknown reason? All the water pumps we have run on 240 volts even the ones that feed our houses but they are hooked to power and they too have control boxes with the reset buttons. The 802A did pump water and the same amount/volume that the 002A does, but not for very long. The only thing I can think of now is the Hrtz meter on the 802A is pegged out no matter where I have the throttle so could that be the problem? If so how does one fix that?

 

[Korgoth1]

So you don't know what your hertz are? Thatll do it..

 

[bmwsyc]

A picture would be helpful, but I'm guessing the two reset buttons are the motor overload relay resets. If the pump runs fine on one generator, but not the other, I would guess a voltage issue. If the resets are for motor overload, for some reason the pump is drawing more amps on the 802, than on the 002. I'm assuming the pumps are single phase, 240 volts, by your mention of starting caps. Single phase has no rotation issues like 3 phase, unless you change how start windings and cap is wired to the pump, I would also assume that when you change generators, you only change the generator connection to the control box, and not the internal wiring. Long story short, I'm thinking under voltage issues.

edit: Korgoth could be on to something there with out of the correct frequency range.

 

[Triple Jim]

It's possible the 002A handles the pump's starting current better, so it gets the pump running quickly and the pump's control box breaker doesn't trip, wheres the 802A takes longer to get it running, so the starting current stays high longer, and the breaker trips. I'm just guessing though.

 

[DieselAddict]

You need to verify correct frequency. If you are too high or too low with a single phase motor it can drastically change the current drawn by the motor.

Dont continue to try to run these pumps from the 802 until you have verified it is operating near 60hz.

 

[Guyfang]

On the whole, the 002 and 003 always assume a load better than the TQG's.

You say the hertz meter is pegged out. Do you have a multimeter that reads frequency? If so, plug it in the 110 volt outlet and see what it reads.

 

[Daybreak]

Howdy,
As others have said, get a hand meter and check what the frequency and volts are at the lugs.

Motors start and run better on 240 volts and 60 Hz.

If you keep going and the Hz is way off, you will kill your pump.

 

[ClintA]

OK thanks all you guys, I will try it as soon as I can. It will be mid Nov. or so for we are starting our fall roundup and I will not have time to play with it. I bet it is the Hz. that is messing me up, the 002A is sitting right on 60 Hz and still pumping water. I can't thank you guys enough.
P.S. How would one go about fixing the Hz problem?

 

[DieselAddict]

Just use a VOM with frequency or plug a kill-a-watt meter in the convenience outlet. They are very handy to have around. Not a budget buster either.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kill_A_Watt

Repairing the frequency meter is something you can do. It will take studying the manual and doing some troubleshooting. If its too much to fix you can order some replacements from JimC here on the forum.

http://www.steelsoldiers.com/showth...requency-and-voltage-gauges&highlight=l+gauge

 

[JRM]

take a video, post it up lots easier