Help with identifying PTO

[cattlerepairman]

I got what I think is a rear facing transfer case PTO for the deuce. It's a Chelsea/Parker.

Can somebody identify/verify?

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[Tracer]

https://www.google.com/search?q=m35...p392lXfngM%3A%2CmiHpOEMrzfv8yM%2C_&vet=1&usg= I think that's what ya got. Hope I didn't screw this cut & paste up.

 

[gringeltaube]

I got what I think is a rear facing transfer case PTO for the deuce. It's a Chelsea/Parker.
Can somebody identify/verify?

Not. The rear-facing PTO (P-136-C) for the Deuce T-Case is pictured, here...
What you got is a typical transmission PTO from something else.

 

[cattlerepairman]

Thank you. Well, the person I bought it from appears knowledgeable and said it was a rear facing Deuce PTO. When I saw it, I was not so sure, and looking at pictures did not really help me.

 

[simp5782]

It's a standard 442 PTO. Common to a 939 series for the allison if he swears its military. How many teeth? It would depend on if itll fit a Spicer or not vs the allison

https://www.oshkoshequipment.com/products/detail/74/706/Power-Takeoff-PTO-Assembly

 

[cattlerepairman]

Thanks, simp! Maybe it's for the M35A3 Allison?
I will count teeth.

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[simp5782]

Yes it could be. they are identical

 

[gringeltaube]

Yes it could be. they are identical

I don't think so - although I must say I've never had one of these in my hand...
Thing is, the PTO input gear for the M35A3 transmission has straight-cut teeth, while the OP's is a helical gear.

Maybe TobyS can chime in here and confirm that.

(Just saw his info and pictures, here...)

 

[tobyS]

Yea, teeth are the issue for fitting the Allison...the one pictured won't fit an Alison 1545 or the 5 ton. I don't know about the Spicer.

The one OP pictured can probably use the same kits for direct mount pump as the one in my ad, once you find what it mounts on. I like the direct mount better than having a shaft and on the A3, there is no room for a shaft.

 

[tobyS]

You may have the rare bird of a PTO that fits the Spicer 5 speed. I don't have one, but images on google do seem to show 6 bolt pto. But it's on the tranny, not the transfer case.

That would seem to give you the option of also having a direct mounted pump with a flange and shaft kit (if they fit, I think it might) instead of a shaft.

Edit...looking at about the third photo of the post, the spline that the gear slides on is different than mine, so I doubt if the flange kit would work. Mine has a spiral spline which must aid in engaging or disengaging.

 

[simp5782]

I don't think so - although I must say I've never had one of these in my hand...
Thing is, the PTO input gear for the M35A3 transmission has straight-cut teeth, while the OP's is a helical gear.

Maybe TobyS can chime in here and confirm that.

(Just saw his info and pictures, here...)

I was referring to the case. I don't look at teeth cut as it usually is set by number of teeth

 

[cattlerepairman]

Counted teeth.

21 on the coarse big wheel
26 on the finer big wheel

Does that help in identifying whether it will fit onto a Spicer?

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[cattlerepairman]

Simp, anyone?

 

[tobyS]

Come on all you guys with deuces with 3053 Spicer. I can't find any pictures of the PTO opening that shows the mating gear. There is a 6 bolt cover. Somebody has to have seen what is behind it....help us out please. Where is Gimpy when you need him? Cattlerepairman, you may have to crawl under and take the plate off of yours (and take some photo's).

Check out this older post https://www.steelsoldiers.com/showthread.php?3366-3053a-trany-pto/page2

Here is an interesting statement from Gerhard: I counted all teeth again: for the 3053A it's 29/42, 24/27, 27/25, 25/17....I don't see 21 or 26 but they are close.

I think the above number are ratios of the PTO gear to the gear in the tranny, not the two gears that are part of the PTO above. If you read, one of the gears turns all the time and the other is the engagement gear.

 

[gringeltaube]

No, the OP's PTO in question does not fit any of the Deuce transmissions, as it is...



The Spicer 3052/53 requires a T25 input gear, RH (right-cut) and it is positioned to the rear of the window. (left in the picture)

Here is a drawing I made, according to specs I've gathered over the years:



The input gear of the same winch PTO but for the 5-ton 6352 & 6453 Spicers is a T19, LH; positioned towards the front of the PTO housing. (right side of pic.)
Not sure if that T21 gear (from the PTO in question) would mesh with the corresponding drive gear in the 5-ton transmissions. Maybe it does...?

 

[tobyS]

oops, duplicate

 

[tobyS]

G, so you have eliminated the deuce with Spicer, right? What 5-ton are you referring to, the 809 series with 6352 and 6453? It does not fit the 939.

 

[gringeltaube]

....What 5-ton are you referring to, the 809 series with 6352 and 6453?

M39- & M809-series.

It does not fit the 939.

Correct.

 

[cattlerepairman]

If anyone needs a PTO for a 5ton 809 series, I know where one is! Good price, too!

 

[tobyS]

It's an interesting unit because part of it turns all the time and must be lubed. You have to use it, not just hang it on the truck like our newer ones that will fully disengage, because you are introducing some parasitic drag just by putting it on the truck. Like maybe a truck only used for plowing. Highway use....limited.

My next project (bucket list) is to 4x4 an M818, keeping the Spicer and putting in an 8.3. This would probably fit, but I want to cruise 65.