MEP 805A Libby Voltage Reg. Retrofit

[peapvp]

Ok thanks! I feel like I have the correct grasp on everything and appreciate the answer even if Yall probably have repeated them several times.
Yes I originally asked about the conversion and had it turned around from what I was reading earlier on which system to switch to if had problems with the voltage side of things
I probably should have started a new post or message with my new questions but continued here on this original thread or post whatever there called.

For the issue at hand the generator Volts nor Frequency fluctuates or jumps around. The generator works on 50hz and runs perfect running smoothly and produces electricity. I just can not get it to switch to 60hz. I have checked S12 and the components such as r19 and all seem to be fine. I have checked A5 and when the S12 is switched to 60hz it gives 20.1v to the #1 terminal on wire 154a which is on the switch of S12 my question is if there is not truly 24+v will it not allow the switch or A5 to work properly because strangely enough if I check A5 #1 with my multi meter when switch is in 60hz it runs the rpm up on generator and the hz go to 60 if I take my meter of it immediately goes back to 50hz with the rpm moving. I know that if you switch the S12 when the machine is running bad things can happen so trying to figure out if A5 is bad or just doesn’t have the correct amount of DC to it to switch it for 50 to 60 without it running. When the gen is running there is 24+v on terminal #1 on A5 but not when not running.
I’m trying to reread everything and see if I can find a scenario like this but haven’t found anything yet.
I sent a picture earlier of my TM making sure I’m digging in the right ones

@Capt.Moondog
Ok, understood - it is easy to miscommunicate in these threads. Thanks for clarifying this.

Next questions:

1)
have you tried to adjust R2 which is the Rheostat “Frequency “ on your front panel with S12 set to 60Hz?

2)
Does the Frequency / rpm change when S12 is set to 50Hz and you turn R2?

3)
If you can adjust the frequency / rpm by turning R2, what adjustment range do you have

in example:

S12 set to 50HZ
Adjustment range from 45Hz to 55Hz

as example
Thanks

 

[Capt.Moondog]

I tried sending video but couldn’t seem to figure out how to get it to load
But this is what the results from your questions

Yes R2 has worked in past and works now.

If S12 is set on 60hz the reading on Meter gauge is in the 50hz side and yes when turning r2 it will go as high as 51.5 and lower than 48 which is the last number on the gauge and the rpm goes up and down with the direction of turn on r2

If S12 is on 50hz it does the exact same thing it’s like the switch has done nothing.

I have used the the frequency little set screw on A5 and set S12 to 60hz and ran the rpm up using A5 to 60hz and it worked but would not allow me to switch back down to 50hz and it acted weird after about 5 minutes it just would fluctuate in rpm so I set everything back like before and ran it on 50hz for about 30 minutes with a heater plugged in and everything worked fine

 

[Capt.Moondog]

By my observation I would need to fine tune the frequency so that the range would be accurate from above and below the 50hz range.
Which will be easy to do on A5

 

[Guyfang]

Why do you need 50 hertz?

 

[peapvp]

I tried sending video but couldn’t seem to figure out how to get it to load
But this is what the results from your questions

Yes R2 has worked in past and works now.

If S12 is set on 60hz the reading on Meter gauge is in the 50hz side and yes when turning r2 it will go as high as 51.5 and lower than 48 which is the last number on the gauge and the rpm goes up and down with the direction of turn on r2

If S12 is on 50hz it does the exact same thing it’s like the switch has done nothing.

I have used the the frequency little set screw on A5 and set S12 to 60hz and ran the rpm up using A5 to 60hz and it worked but would not allow me to switch back down to 50hz and it acted weird after about 5 minutes it just would fluctuate in rpm so I set everything back like before and ran it on 50hz for about 30 minutes with a heater plugged in and everything worked fine

ok, for the moment I believe that the problem is in the S12 circuit

S12 Terminal #3 connects to K21 Terminal A which is one of the two legs of the relay Coil.
Check on K21 Terminal B for 0V / continuity ( less then 1 Ohm resistance) to chassis

Then check:
The Voltage on S12 Terminals 2 and 3 with S12 set to 60Hz and Genset running
You should see at least 24 VDC

if not, then check this wiring diagram starting where it says: TO S12-3

You may have a bad wiring connection in this circuit branch

 

[Capt.Moondog]

I do not need 50hz what I meant was I can fix the indifference in the range so I can advance or retard it equally from the 50hz position. Not sure if I'm explaining myself correctly but it really has no significance in this case just a observation while I was testing the range of frequency with R2.

I would gladly just use the A5 and just run the frequency screw up so it would run on the 60hz side of the spectrum but like I said before it started acting weird and surge in rpm about 5 minutes into running I had the same heater hooked up as before so I just returned everything back to what it was before and started asking all these questions.

If the easy solution is to do this just let me know I'll try it again I just figured I was affecting it badly some way or another when it would surge in rpm and at times hit the overspeed limit and shut down

 

[peapvp]

I do not need 50hz what I meant was I can fix the indifference in the range so I can advance or retard it equally from the 50hz position. Not sure if I'm explaining myself correctly but it really has no significance in this case just a observation while I was testing the range of frequency with R2.

I would gladly just use the A5 and just run the frequency screw up so it would run on the 60hz side of the spectrum but like I said before it started acting weird and surge in rpm about 5 minutes into running I had the same heater hooked up as before so I just returned everything back to what it was before and started asking all these questions.

If the easy solution is to do this just let me know I'll try it again I just figured I was affecting it badly some way or another when it would surge in rpm and at times hit the overspeed limit and shut down

I would do the troubleshooting in post #45 as we eventually will get to the root cause of the problem

adjusting the generator via A5 to 60Hz with S12 set to 50Hz is not a good idea and not recommended at all.
This can lead to instability problems which you have already experienced to a certain extent

 

[Capt.Moondog]

Thank You PEAPVP I'll go through that per your instructions and let you know the results.
I truly appreciate the patience and time.

 

[Guyfang]

When you start and run the set in 60 hertz, is the green light on, on the A5?

 

[Capt.Moondog]

Guyfang I’ll have to double check but I am unaware of any light visible on A5 while running on 60hz that doesn’t mean it’s not.
So tomorrow I’ll get back to the project and double check for the light!

 

[Guyfang]

Your right. Its on the B model.

I sent you this before, but am not sure Peter has seen it.

I think you can check on the A5, if K21 is sending power to the A5.

 

[Capt.Moondog]

Yes you sent that earlier I was using it as a guide to check the #1,3 and 19 that’s when I discovered if I touched #1 with my meter tester the unit speed up rpm and went to 60hz if the S19 was in the 60hz position kinda thru me for a loop!
I will print out all the ideas and instructions and sit down and try to see what results I can come up with.
It’s a bit hard for me to read sometimes since my 4 & 2 year old boys are bound and determined to help me fix this thing to so give me a day or so and I’ll run all the test above.
Thanks for all of yalls advice

 

[Capt.Moondog]

I think it is S12 not S19

 

[Guyfang]

I have two helpers also. But it is 00:25 and they are in bed.

 

[peapvp]

@Guyfang
old man like you shouldn’t stay up past 20:00 MEZ. Think about your health. Your liver is rock hard, brain cells have perished in the hundreds of thousands and BAMAD has send me the results of your stool samples, which has one calling for the Priest!
Best wishes
Peter

 

[peapvp]

@Guyfang I am glad you haven’t lost your sense of humor! I am right behind you!

 

[Guyfang]

If you cant laugh with and at yourself, its a sad day. I do take a nap every once in a while!!

 

[Capt.Moondog]

Good Afternoon
sounds like you guys are from the ole school and been there done that and forgot more than ill ever know as a few ole timers have told me!!!
My ancestry comes from Germany and is on my bucket list to get there. My last name is Kaufmann and my Moms maiden is Peters so kinda full blooded.

I'll try to make this short, I have went through what both of you have sent me and the only discrepancies is that the Terminals on the A5 of #1,3,19 are they are around 21-23 DC volts while the machine is NOT running. I checked the volts at S1 and its the same just looks like there is not a true 24v coming in. I cleaned the wires at starter and checked the battery's and they are 24volts but nothing over. So I'm not sure if that could lead to any problems or not it just don't seem like it would be any issues to me but wanted to be totally transparent with all my findings.

The Terminals 2&3 on S12 have 24 volts "while machine is running" and is switched to 60hz.
Also the terminal on K21 B has .07 olhms I'm guessing when it says resistance to chassis is meaning grounded on the machine.

The only thing I have found other than the 1-2 lower volts on terminals with machine not running but seem to be correct while running on the ones that are supposed to be hot is following.....

GuyFangs page of the A5 adjustment procedure everything seems to be correct except for A5/20 when I start the machine and hold S1 to start it reads 25 DC volts and held for 10 seconds and let go to run position is still stays on 25v. The A5/18 terminal does what the paper says its supposed to do, it jumps up when cranked then goes back to 0v but the A5/20 does not it stays 25v in both positions. If I am reading this correctly its supposed to go to 0v once S1 goes to run position.

Any ideas or thoughts of something I am over looking or have done wrong.

 

[Capt.Moondog]

I meant to to say K21 not K12 on the Terminal B olhms check I originally said K12 but edited it but not sure it did on your end

 

[peapvp]

Good Afternoon
sounds like you guys are from the ole school and been there done that and forgot more than ill ever know as a few ole timers have told me!!!
My ancestry comes from Germany and is on my bucket list to get there. My last name is Kaufmann and my Moms maiden is Peters so kinda full blooded.

I'll try to make this short, I have went through what both of you have sent me and the only discrepancies is that the Terminals on the A5 of #1,3,19 are they are around 21-23 DC volts while the machine is NOT running. I checked the volts at S1 and its the same just looks like there is not a true 24v coming in. I cleaned the wires at starter and checked the battery's and they are 24volts but nothing over. So I'm not sure if that could lead to any problems or not it just don't seem like it would be any issues to me but wanted to be totally transparent with all my findings.

The Terminals 2&3 on S12 have 24 volts "while machine is running" and is switched to 60hz.
Also the terminal on K21 B has .07 olhms I'm guessing when it says resistance to chassis is meaning grounded on the machine.

The only thing I have found other than the 1-2 lower volts on terminals with machine not running but seem to be correct while running on the ones that are supposed to be hot is following.....

GuyFangs page of the A5 adjustment procedure everything seems to be correct except for A5/20 when I start the machine and hold S1 to start it reads 25 DC volts and held for 10 seconds and let go to run position is still stays on 25v. The A5/18 terminal does what the paper says its supposed to do, it jumps up when cranked then goes back to 0v but the A5/20 does not it stays 25v in both positions. If I am reading this correctly its supposed to go to 0v once S1 goes to run position.

Any ideas or thoughts of something I am over looking or have done wrong.

Check the wire numbers on A5/18 and A5/20, not that someone swapped them by accident