Axle Seal Gremlins!

[oldshep]

Not very happy! Did my front right axle seals/ repacked bearings 2 weeks ago. Drove it about 10 miles. Bearing was a little warm. It finally stopped raining so tonight I took the lockout(Ouverson) off and gear lube came out. My dad and I did everything the way we should have. Besides since I've got lockouts so the front end wouldnt be turning anyway so that rules out poor axle venting. Any insights on this? Id really like to drive it for a change! Thanks.


Will.

 

[armytruck63]

Does the front axle have the little cork keyway plugs like the rear axles do? If they are missing they will let gear lube into the wheel bearings.

I don't know the answer about the front keyway plugs. I'm curious because I have to do this job soon myself.

 

[southdave]

Ditto above other than that, I have no Idea, may RR the wheel bearing and races? BTW where did you get your disk brake set up?

 

[oldshep]

The key way has RTV in it. The gear lube is kept in the axle housing with the seal in the housing. The brakes are from my old buddy at usa 6x6. They work good. Hes out of business. Its got F550 calipers. I dont want this to be a "bash usa 6x6 thread". btw.

 

[kc5mzd]

Just because the axle isn't turning doesn't rule out a venting issue. Atmospheric pressure changes alone can have an effect. I haven't replaced any axle seals on any of my M35s yet but I need to replace several.
I am not sure what king of seal the M35 uses. Either way I wonder if it would help to drive with the hubs engaged for a while to break-in the seals and let them seat better?

 

[jwaller]

Just because the axle isn't turning doesn't rule out a venting issue. Atmospheric pressure changes alone can have an effect. I haven't replaced any axle seals on any of my M35s yet but I need to replace several.
I am not sure what king of seal the M35 uses. Either way I wonder if it would help to drive with the hubs engaged for a while to break-in the seals and let them seat better?

it's not really any issue with the design.

getting them to not leak is a crap shoot. I usually hit everything with carb cleaner just to be sure my rtv and cork are completly free of oil and I let the job sit overnight before I put oil to it so everything is clean and dry till the rtv is set up.

 

[BugEyeBear]

Have you checked your axle vents to be certain that they aren't clogged?

You might want to remove them & clean them with brake fluid cleaner. Or replace with new ones. Or replace vent valve with a hose venting to a higher location or to the air cleaner. Some people use the more modern Wrangler vents in the high end of a 5/16 ID vent hose.

You can test the vent valves by blowing and sucking on them (from the threaded side). You should be able to blow but not suck. (Just don't swallow any of the aforementioned brake cleaner.... It tastes awful... DON'T ASK how I know...)

 

[Strykerboy]

yep i just got a rear axle leak on my left side its slinging oil inside the inner tires rim wonderfull!!!!l ;(

 

[oldshep]

I got some hose barbs tonight. Ill see what i get done tomarrow and will report back. The vents were a little gummed up.

 

[tiger422]

The cork in keyway is not needed in front axle gearlube should not be in the knuckle the seal in the axle tube must have problem. The diff must also be over full for it to fill knuckle and flow into spindle.
Sorry to hear it good luck with the repair.
Jim

 

[G-Force]

Not very happy! Did my front right axle seals/ repacked bearings 2 weeks ago. Drove it about 10 miles. Bearing was a little warm. It finally stopped raining so tonight I took the lockout(Ouverson) off and gear lube came out. My dad and I did everything the way we should have. Besides since I've got lockouts so the front end wouldnt be turning anyway so that rules out poor axle venting. Any insights on this? Id really like to drive it for a change! Thanks.


Will.

You wanna DRIVE IT??????

 

[kc5mzd]

Are they the kind that seal on the axle shaft or do they have 2 parts that seal against each other? If they seal against the shaft you may need to use some fine steel wool or very fine sand paper to clean up the seat. Also the type of seal that seals against the shaft will need to be pre lubed and might take a couple of miles to seat.

 

[tiger422]

seals on axle shaft

 

[1stDeuce]

Yeah, ditto on what tiger422 said... You've got some sort of issue with the axle seal that's inside the axle housing if you've got gear lube in the wheel bearings on the front axle. Front axle has to fill the knuckle boot about half full before it'll make it's way into the bearings, especially if the front end isn't spinning. And, it does seem like that's WAY over full to have that much gear oil in the bearings already... Are you sure the axle seal is even there??

Chris

 

[oldshep]

I just put the new seal in. The diff isnt over full to my knowlage. Ill get it figured out. Wish i had a shop building with lights. Id have it fixed tonight!

 

[kc5mzd]

seals on axle shaft

Make sure the axle shaft is clean and very smooth. Make sure the seal is facing the right direction and make sure everything is pre-lubed. If the seal is dry you can burn it up fast. Make sure you drive it with the hubs engaged so the axle shafts spin to allow the seal to seat to the axle shaft. Make sure the "new" seal is not old stock that sat on some shelf for 40 years and had the rubber dry up and deteriorate before you put it on. If the bearings heat up to much my first guess is that they are probably to tight. Make sure the wheel spins with no resistance from the bearings. I usually spin the wheel while tightening the bearing nut until there is noticeable resistance from the bearings being to tight. Then I back the nut off until the wheel pins freely making sure there is no play from the bearings being to loose. Good luck!
To make sure the axle is not overfilled all you have to do is take the fill plug off and see if anything comes out. If it does then it was overfilled. To check it you would normally just stick your finger in the hole and see if you can feel it. It should be about halfway up your finger.

 

[m16ty]

The cork in keyway is not needed in front axle gearlube should not be in the knuckle the seal in the axle tube must have problem. The diff must also be over full for it to fill knuckle and flow into spindle.
Sorry to hear it good luck with the repair.
Jim

There is no need for an outer seal either on the front but I have seen them installed from the military. Guess it may help to keep water out of the bearings if it gets past the boots but other than that there is nothing to seal on that end.

 

[BugEyeBear]

...Make sure the seal is facing the right direction....

Is there an easy way to visibly know that the seal is facing the correct way?


ALSO, Question to original poster ("oldshep"):
What sort of hub temps are you seeing after a 15-20min drive at speed?
(I use an Infrared Gun to check my hubs, diffs, brake drums, xfer, & trans regularly.)
Excessive heat (above 130F) would indicate that bearing preload is too tight.
Excessive heat can also deteriorate/melt seals.

 

[jwaller]

hey guys I think when he said forward I think he meant forward tandum. as in a rear axle. it's almost impossible to get gear oil in the wheel bearings on the steer axle.

 

[m16ty]

hey guys I think when he said forward I think he meant forward tandum. as in a rear axle. it's almost impossible to get gear oil in the wheel bearings on the steer axle.

You may be right but I thought he had a bober.