Adding Detroit Lockers???

[dozer113]

I was wondering just how difficult it is to add lockers on a M35a2. Is it a matter of just pulling out the axle shafts, removing the diff, put the ring gear on the new diff and reasemble or are we talking things being pressed on and needing all types of special tools??

 

[broman78]

if you to the corporate website and find the locker for the deuce you will also see a very detailed pdf that eaton has posted. if you can't find it can email to you.

 

[Unforgiven]

talk to the OEM guy who sells stuff here. He's got lockers + much stronger alloy axle shafts + lockouts.

When money affords, I'll do the same. Lockers up front & on front-rear axle, both with upgraded axles. Also lockout hubs on both for vibration/fuel/wear/handling reasons. I only need one set of drive wheels on pavement.

That way I have free wheeling front & front-rear for highway use. Sure the rear is still spinning in the housing. But what's the alternative? Air locking diffs are a little too much for me to attempt by myself. Putting OEM's version of a Detroit Locker in the front rear + lockout hubs should be an easier solution to air differentials. Doing this you would have completely locked front & front rear off road when needed. And if those extra two wheels in the back aren't at least helping some, well then I hope you have a functioning winch.

To do all this through the OEM stuff it's going to set you back several grand, assuming you replace bearings,seals,front ujoints,alloy axles etc. Have you seen the size of those differentials? They're going to be a bit heavier than the average shade tree mechanic has seen. You'll probably have to remove the entire axle housing to work on it & move it around with a cherry picker. You have to reach it from the top.

 

[Unforgiven]

P.S.

You need PS if you're putting lockers up front

 

[dozer113]

Sounds like your thinking like me...I want all six digging. If it aint spinnig then its doing no good. I wasn't planning on new axles I was hoping one could just add a detroit locker diff and keep everything else stock.

 

[Unforgiven]

From what I understand, lockers will eat up stock axles in this truck.

Here's an article where a guy is putting ARB's in a Rockwell axle housing. The Detroit Locker would be similar work, minus the air tube stuff.

2.5 Ton Rockwell Axle ARB Air Locker - 4-Wheel & Off-Road Magazine

The guy here who deals in some of the OEM stuff is member tie6044

The link to the axle place is

http://www.ouversonengineering.com/

That link normally works. But I just checked the link and it was down so give it some time.

 

[tm america]

detriots are cool but arb s are the way to go fully locked when on and act like stock when not locked .no need for extra compresser truck already has that covered a little more money for alot better product and better driveabilty

 

[Unforgiven]

But with lockout hubs & a selectable air transfer case the detroit locker is the same as an ARB. Hubs & TC unlocked the differential isn't spinning. Hubs locked the differential spins. Why the extra headache of install & $$ for ARB up front when lockout hubs accomplish the same exact effect with less expensive detroit lockers, unless you are trying to avoid the locker's jolt when it kicks in?

I agree ARB would be nice in the rear. Especially the rear-rear if you already have detroit lockers + hubs on the other two axles.

 

[Crackerjax]

+1 for ARB and stonger shafts....I am keeping my truck somewhat stock because its not needed for me I have a hacked up xj and a k5 for the off road needs but if I was going to do it ARB lockers all around and bigger shafts...or maybe even 5 ton axles.

 

[tm america]

lock outs and detroit are the same price as a arb but detroit doesnt fully lock it when engage they are spring loaded and will slip some under heavy loads where arb doesnt slip at all not to mention having to get out to unlock the hubs .i like the driveabilty of being able to turn with out a locker when in 6x6 and then being able to lock it fully from the cab when needed.and if you want to save some mpg put the lock outs on with the arbs

 

[tm america]

arb=850 .detroit=400 lock out hubs =600 so really arbs are cheaper than running detroits with lockouts .another thing is detroits are a pita when locked in on the street on the front or rear they put every thing in a bind the only way to eliminate this is lockout hubs and not running 6x6 and that isnt an option for most when driving in snow where the arb gives you more options while in 6x6 they have no ill effect unless locked in and you cant say that about detroits

 

[Unforgiven]

I knew detroit lockers slipped initially but I was unaware of continued slipping during off road use. Good points. So you're looking at 3K + lots of work to fully ARB the truck. I wonder how much a qualified shop would charge to install those.

Personally, I bought the truck to modify. Assuming all my mods are done properly I plan to keep the truck for a good stretch of time. $3k sounds like a lot. But it's a heck of a lot cheaper than a new $70K Kodiak or $55K Silverado. This truck, because of it's basic platform, could be easily modded out. You could add every modification possible & still be under budget for the price of even a 5 year old Chevy or Dodge pickup.

You know the ARB's would still need stronger axles.

 

[area52]

Are you gonna do rockcrawling or just occasionally offroad it? An ARB locker is way better in the front than a Detroit and lock outs just so you don't have to get out and unlock to steer.

Unless you are gonna repower with a high horsepower engine, I would not worry about breaking shafts for now.

 

[Josh]

Im having a hard time understanding why Lockers would destroy these axles?(shafts) I know a guy using stock deuce axles on a chevy with bigblock 502 putting out near 900hp, and lockers front and rear and in the last year only has broke one axle.

He brakes drive lines and transfer cases more then anything else.

Assuming you only lock in the axles when offroad allowing for tire slip. I can see the front-rear axle suffering the most punishment, but from the low RPM and HP coming into it, I'm struggling to understand this.

 

[Unforgiven]

Here in the Nevada desert you can go from rocks to gravel to sand to fine silt to slippery shale & even to mud & snow in the mountains. You can even throw in the occasional unexpected flash flood to the mix. I've been four-wheeling around here for twenty + years & have had "oh poop" moments in all of the above. Why I've never put ARB or lockers on my FJ's is beyond me. Time & $$ I guess.

But now that I have this new M35 hobby I've decided I'm going to do it properly. I'm going to upgrade it BEFORE I get myself into any "oh poop" moments. It's easy to call some friends in Blazers to pull out an FJ (luckily I always managed to wiggle free). I don't think it would be so easy if I buried a 14,000 lb truck 3 axles deep in the sand halfway over a ravine.

As far as snapping the stock axles, I'm not an expert. But I've read quite a few of the old posts. People with lockers always suggested better axles. Maybe the OEM guy that I gave the link to earlier can explain it better.

 

[tm america]

with arbs you wont have to upgrade axles unless you have bigger tires and are gonna beat the heck out of it on hard ground with them locked it .with detroits you in the rears you run a risk of snapping an axle since they make things bind in turns.fronts wont break unless locked in on hard ground beating things up.you can snap front axles with either one when cross rutting with tires cut hard and locked in .detroits have more of a tendincy to snap axles cuz the way the bind then slip then grab again .arbs dont change how things drive til they are locked in.i have had lockers in front axles and didnt like the breakagge that goes with it i ended up running opens in the front it helps turning out of ruts to.they will climb rather than bind forcing things to go straight. with an open in the front and proper pedal control you can hop out of ruts. another reason to go with arbs having more steering when needed and more traction if needed with the push of a button

 

[Recovry4x4]

Folks, a little driving savvy, you won't have nearly any of the problems you all are identifying with the Detroits. You don't need lockouts on the front axle with a Detroit installed either. The Detroit will be invisible as long as it's not under power which means for normal driving in rear wheel drive, you won't notice it. As far as in the rear, if you can adjust your driving to not be under power in the turns then you won't notice them in the rear either. They will unlock in turns as long as they are not under power. As far as them slipping, only if they are worn out. When they lock, they are solidly locked. ARB's are nice but compared to the price of an automatic locker, I can't justify it on the rears, the front....maybe. Then again, I don't see the problems reported because I have some experience driving with them.

 

[DanMartin]

I have a set of those ARB lockers ready to drop in...any time now. I got 3 of the first crate that came in from Australia last year.

Seriously...they are going in soon. I'll do a full write-up. I'm looking at using some of the same air switches that control the front axle engage to independently engage the front and rear lockers (so there will be 2 more of those air switches on the dash). Should be a fun project.

Again, a full write-up when it happens.

 

[USMC6062]

Folks, a little driving savvy, you won't have nearly any of the problems you all are identifying with the Detroits. You don't need lockouts on the front axle with a Detroit installed either. The Detroit will be invisible as long as it's not under power which means for normal driving in rear wheel drive, you won't notice it. As far as in the rear, if you can adjust your driving to not be under power in the turns then you won't notice them in the rear either. They will unlock in turns as long as they are not under power. As far as them slipping, only if they are worn out. When they lock, they are solidly locked. ARB's are nice but compared to the price of an automatic locker, I can't justify it on the rears, the front....maybe. Then again, I don't see the problems reported because I have some experience driving with them.

I agree, I had Detroits front and rear on an old Dodge truck I built, and the truck acted normal as long as you weren't on the trottle in a turn. I would accelerate sometimes while turning around in a gas station just to make the tires bark and mess with people.

 

[andytk5]

I know this thread is a bit old but I am looking to do this. I think like Dan and tmamerica were saying the ARBs would be the top bill. Yes price alone makes them nearly double, but think how $100 here or there flies out of your wallet for silly (drinking) crap, hehe.

Anyhow I will be taking my truck single T831s, down to Vilano Beach to drive on the sand for beach days, BBQ's, surf fishin, etc.. Looking to an ARB in the front and not bother with lockouts. This will basically be used just on sand so I don't think I will be looking at the axle shaft issues if there are any since everything can slip easily.

Maybe a later add one to each of the rears if needed.

I have been searching everywhere and can't find any threads or even Youtube videos of any deuces with ARBs in one or all or even a mix of Detroits or spools for 6x6 action. Love to see some of that vs the stuck trucks with one or to wheels spinning...