Deuce air cleaner modifiacation W/LDS engine

[Recht71]

Thanks for the imfo always wonder about the L DS - 465 -2

 

[rosco]

That original filter is going to be real hard to beat. It does a respectable job and a "Measurable difference" in performance will be an illusion. When it comes to extended service intervals, the original equipment will be the top performer! Just because its old, doesn't mean that its not good!

Lee in Alaska

 

[jesusgatos]

Yes, they were built exclusively for the 1969 m656/xm757/xm791 8x8 trucks. Very few in existence...
The air cleaner on these trucks is of a 2-stage type, where fins or vanes set up a cyclone effect on the air to separate heavier particles, which are collected in the "dust pot" shown in the images and that was 40 years ago.

Don't think you'll notice much difference in the performance with a different filter unless you operate the truck under near full or full load.
To measure the efficiency of the filter, install a "vacuum" gauge and look at the readings for the different filters. Third image below shows the gauge I have in the M35 and it indicates about 3 to 4 inches of water mostly.
The restriction indicator on the dash, by the steering wheel shows red at about 20 inches...

Yeah, thanks for the info about the LDS-2. What was different about those, as compared to the LDS-1? That cyclone-type air filter is very similar to the Sy-Klone pre-filter that I'm going to mount on top of my snorkel. Not going to increase airflow, but should help keep the air filter a lot cleaner, and flowing more air. Not going to worry about feeding my LDS any more air until/unless it's a problem.

 

[cranetruck]

Jessie, do a GOOGLE search and include "steelsoldiers" among the keywords and you'll get a number of hits showing previous posts on the -2 engine and the xm757.
Typically:
http://www.steelsoldiers.com/deuce/43459-ldt-465-1c-vs-lds-465-multifuels-3.html

 

[6X6 ALL THE WAY]

My uncle is a diesel mechanic at a ford dealer. Every truck that has came in with a dusted engine had a K&N or other oil type filter. He told me never to run one on a turbo diesel.

 

[tm america]

can you see the bottom of the filter when looking throught the air intake tube?i am interested in doing this mod to i am wondering if a k&n ru 3260 would fit it is 2 inches longer than the ru 3060. what do you think i want to get my filter ordered soon . if you could give me a rough idea how much clearence there is at the bottom of filter it would be greatly helpful.i think this mod could really help keep the egt in a better place than it is now

 

[treysoucie]

k&N filters on any turbo diesel is a no no, id maybe try a afe paper filter or a large napa paper filter

 

[mikeroot2]

k&N filters on any turbo diesel is a no no

K&N filters are a no no, Lucas is a no no, slick 50 is a no no. synthectic oil is a no no, letting an engine idle to warm up is a no no, using the phrase "no no" is a no no.

Oh wait, I mean they are all awesome!

For every engine that supposedly blew up because of one of the above one was supposedly saved by one of the above.

For EVERY OPINION on any of them there is an opposite opinion, some actually even show so called FACTS and INDEPENDANT lab studies. I saw it on T.V. or read it online so it must be true. I know this guy who is an engine builder by trade and he swears by/against it so it must be true. On and on and on.

Thank you for the detailed write up and pictures recht71your info and effort is appreciated

 

[treysoucie]

you may be right on that sir, although i have yet to hear any diesels techs say any of what you mention is a no no. They do however show how reusable k&n's allow lots of dust and dirt through more so than other diesel filters. i ran a k&n on my old dodge 12 valve for a few years until i started noticing the excessive amounts of dirt and grit in the intake boot.

K&N filters are a no no, Lucas is a no no, slick 50 is a no no. synthectic oil is a no no, letting an engine idle to warm up is a no no, using the phrase "no no" is a no no.

Oh wait, I mean they are all awesome!

For every engine that supposedly blew up because of one of the above one was supposedly saved by one of the above.

For EVERY OPINION on any of them there is an opposite opinion, some actually even show so called FACTS and INDEPENDANT lab studies. I saw it on T.V. or read it online so it must be true. I know this guy who is an engine builder by trade and he swears by/against it so it must be true. On and on and on.

Thank you for the detailed write up and pictures recht71your info and effort is appreciated

 

[Recht71]

TM I did the measurments I don't think the 3260 will work. If you notice the the air cleaner can has the hump in the bottom. The 3060 gives you more then enough cfm. I agree with MIKEROOT2 everybody has what they think is best and thats ok. I'll post a picture i have it completed now. Tell later Randy

 

[JasonS]

you may be right on that sir, although i have yet to hear any diesels techs say any of what you mention is a no no. They do however show how reusable k&n's allow lots of dust and dirt through more so than other diesel filters. i ran a k&n on my old dodge 12 valve for a few years until i started noticing the excessive amounts of dirt and grit in the intake boot.

Cummins made a statement on their website specifically recommending AGAINST using KnN type filters. Good enough for me.

 

[mikeroot2]

Cummins made a statement on their website specifically recommending AGAINST using KnN type filters. Good enough for me.

Where? Can't find it.

 

[JasonS]

Where? Can't find it.

It was on one of their European web pages. I found it several years ago but could not recently.

 

[akonitony]

When I put a K&N filter in my '06 2500HD Silverado, the check engine light came on. When I pulled the code, it was the MAF sensor not being able to handle more air. I tried buying a hypertech and programming in all three stages, but none of them helped, so I emailed K&N. and they told me I would need to purchase their complete intake package to relocate the sensor so it wouldn't get too much air. With that I wondered how the computer would be able to calculate the correct mix. I eventually returned the filter to ORielly's, explained to them what was going on, and they gave me a full refund, thanks be to God, for I would have been out $75 if they had refused to do so.
Only other point I would like to make here is the K&N filter oil is a ripoff. I have heard tale it is nothing more than WD40 by someone at the automotive counter. Sounds like it could be possible...

 

[Stretch44875]

Recently installed a K&N filter on my M108. Already had the pump turned up to 1200deg. With the new filter, I was able to turn the pump up 2 full turns more, and still be at 1200 degrees. Truck now has as much, if not a little more, power than my M35. M35 is also turned up, but with a stock filter. And the M108 weighs 7,000lbs more. Need to install a boost gauge and see where I'm at, and maybe throw the old filter back on and see how much the temps rise.

Not worried about the wear issue. Lucky to get 3,000 miles a year.

 

[patracy]

I personally don't want to run K&N or any oiled media filter on my vehicles. But for what it's worth. There have been two TM's from Dodge on truck against these filters. (Both being grounds for warranty restrictions)

 

[jwaller]

K&N flows more air bc it doesn't filter as well. I'll stay with my stock filter.
if you never see dust or dirt it might be ok for a short while.

 

[micmccon]

Your Mass Airflow Sensor in most vehicles does NOT do well getting oil from a K&N filter in it. As a GM tech, I can tell you that any issues caused by useing a K&N filter are not covered by the manufacturer's warranty. I have indeed seen these filters screw up the MAF sensor.
This bulletin is being revised to add models and model years. Please discard Corporate Bulletin Number 04-07-30-013A (Section 07 -- Transmission/Transaxle).
DO THIS
DON'T DO THIS
First, Inspect the vehicle for a reusable aftermarket excessively/over- oiled air filter
DO NOT repair MAF sensors under warranty if concerns result from the use of an excessively/over-oiled aftermarket, reusable air filter.

The use of an excessively/over-oiled aftermarket, reusable air filter may result in:

• Service Engine Soon (SES) light on
• Transmission shift concerns, slipping and damaged clutch(es) or band(s)
• Engine driveability concerns, poor acceleration from a stop, limited engine RPM range​

The oil that is used on these air filter elements may be transferred onto the Mass Air Flow (MAF) sensor causing contamination of the sensor. As a result, the Grams per Second (GPS) signal from the MAF may be low and any or all of the concerns listed above may occur.
When servicing a vehicle with any of these concerns, be sure to check for the presence of an aftermarket reusable, excessively/over- oiled air filter. The MAF, GPS reading should be compared to a like vehicle with an OEM air box and filter under the same driving conditions to verify the concern

 

[tm america]

Dennis thanks for posting that I've been thinking about going with the on filter wasn't sure it would make much differenc.nice to see its a very worth while mod.

 

[s1036s]

Cummins made a statement on their website specifically recommending AGAINST using KnN type filters. Good enough for me.

X2, I was told to not run any oil on the filters if you are using them on your diesel trucks. If I find the info to back it up I will post it, otherwise I would just run the filter and clean it more often. Check with AEM they are a common source for intakes on the newer diesels, if the install instuctions say to oil the filter or not.... should get you the answer on the oiling.
My theory is that the oil restricts flow, which is a no no. Turbos are made to force air out, not suck. Restrictions on either may work the turbo harder... just my