fried battery cable, holy c***p!

[RedHeadTarn]

So for the last 2 days my 1028 has been cranking slower and slower, even though my voltmeter said I had good voltage. Today I cranked it over and got a smell of smoke, and then nothing. I opened the hood and find that my battery cable end on the rear battery has melted off. Also, the cable was HOT, too hot to touch. The cable that connects the two batteries was very hot as well. After searching through the forums I checked the items recommended for the "melting battery terminal" problems, all cable ends were tight and solid.

Any thoughts on this? I don't want to just hook it back up if there is a more serious problem.

I have pics but can't upload from my phone, battery terminal piece is still on terminal but where it connects to the cable, there is a puddle of melted aluminum from the back of the connector.

 

[cchamilt]

Check the cable runs themselves. When I got my truck I had a similar issue where the starter cable rubbed and grounded to the frame. It melted a ground terminal and fried the alternator.

 

[RedHeadTarn]

Update: after replacing the battery cable, I tried cranking the engine. Same slow cranking like the batteries were dying, but wouldn't turn over. Stopped after about 15 seconds and checked the cables, sure enough they were HOT. Got underneath and checked the starter, it was so hot it burned a blister on my finger. So based on the heat, can I assume the starter is going out? Checked the cable to the starter, seems ok. New 24v starter on eBay now for $100 plus s/h, how much does a rebuild usually run?

Any help is appreciated, as my jeep blew a head basket on Sunday, so I am currently without a vehicle.
**** YOU LIFE!!! Why must you always break both my cars at the same time??? ( 3rd time )

 

[cranetruck]

Start from the beginning and load test your batteries. The voltmeter will show full voltage, but the batteries may be sulfated or poorly charged. Best battery tester is a hydrometer.
Low battery charge will drop the voltage while cranking and increase the current to the starter under demand. The starter will then burn up if it isn't stopped in time.
The starter should always run at full rpm, if it doesn't, something will fail (if it hasn't already).

 

[Armada]

You might want to replace your starter relay for insurance too.

I had that same situation happen on a M1008. This was years and years ago and I lived in an apartment, thus I had no tools. I went out to take the truck for a drive one evening. Turned the key, nothing. It was at night and when I got out to open the hood to see what was wrong, the ground was glowing underneath the front of the truck. It had set the wire insulation on fire, and the oily, greasy dirt on the sides of the engine didn't help. Right side of the engine was on fire. The fire department was there in a minute. Tell them you have a fire at an apartment complex and they send ALOT of trucks. In the end, I had to replace the starter, cable, glow plug wires, a wire harness, some hoses. That was the first cucv I ever owned and I learned some good lessons. I always degrease the engine on a newly acquired truck, and ALWAYS carry a fire extinguisher.

 

[RedHeadTarn]

I have taken the batteries in to get checked, both seem ok, and I have upgraded the starter relay to a heavy duty one. The only cables getting hot are the main battery cables and the starter wire. And as I said, the starter gets REAL hot. I'm thinking new starter, anybody disagree? Let me know.

 

[Warthog]

From your description I would say you starter is on its way out.

You can take the starter apart to see if there are any issues with it. I would take it to a industrial starter/alternator shop for a test/rebuild.

The new gear reduction starters are another choice. Just make sure you have the proper support bracket. And if you truck is still 24v make sure you purchase the 24v versio as some of the fleabay sellers are shipping 12v starters.

What type of starter do you have? A 27MT Direct Drive or the newer 28MT Gear Reduction?

 

[RedHeadTarn]

Not sure, how do I find out? Am I in trouble if I get the wrong one, or can you use either?

Here's what I found on eBay, several sellers with same. Stated 24 volt for military 6.2 diesel.

New Starter Military Equipment CUCV 6.2 Diesel 24 Volt - eBay Mobile (item 160446594201 6/25/2010 6:45:35 AM)

Also, if the starter is dead, what exactly dies in it? Found 24 v solenoid on ebay for 40 bucks.

NEW SOLENOID CUCV 24V GM STARTER SOLENOID 10457152 - eBay Mobile (item 280454934943 6/20/2010 4:00:02 PM)

 

[Warthog]

GM started with the Direct Drive and later switched to the Gear Reduction as the whole industry did. Either will work.

You can tell by the size. The direct drive is 4-5" in diameter and the gear reduction is 3-4". It just looks smaller.

The direct drive is cheaper to rebuild. and the 24v solenoid you found is for it.

The way a starter usually fails is the brass bushings in the nose cone and in the rear cap wearout. The nose cone more than the rear. This allows the armature to "fall" and start rubbing on the case windings. It's all down hill from there.

Here are some pictures of the two starters and the associated support brackets.

Direct drive starter on the left and the correct brackter on the right (I should retake and correct them ....LOL)

Smaller gear reduction starter on the right and bracket on the left.

I have also included a Testing Manual from DelcoRemy for the gear reduction.

 

[Crash_AF]

Sent you an email response to your email. The starter is probably bad and your quickest option will be to have it rebuilt. There are two places locally that can take care of it. Contact info is in the email.

Later,
Joe

 

[RedHeadTarn]

So, ordered new starter off eBay, and one week and 30 min of work later truck starts great! Took the old starter into the shop for testing, it was drawing 493 amps!

Having problems uploading pics from my phone... but here's a link...

Tarn Brubaker's Photos | Facebook

 

[ryan77]

Man that picture is wild lucky the battery didnt blow up!!!!!!!

 

[blacktop_one]

I'm glad you got that fixed, but while you're at it you might want to check the braided ground strap(s), usually at the rear of the engine block to the frame and/or firewall, just to make sure they're good and tight. One of those often forgotten pieces of the charging system...

 

[CARNAC]

If the batteries are Hawkers, you are suppose to change the terminals according to what I was told yesterday. The lead terminals are supposedly a no-go.

 

[Armada]

If the batteries are Hawkers, you are suppose to change the terminals according to what I was told yesterday. The lead terminals are supposedly a no-go.

Where do you get terminals made from something other than lead, Carnac?

 

[ActionStarCBRxx]

Just had the same thing happen to me. 1986 M1008.

I was replacing all the belts (alt/alt/steering) and had just put it all back together. I reconnected the battery cables. Jumped in the cab to start the truck, turned the key, waited for the glow plugs to turn off (wait light). It turns off, turn the switch the starter attempts to turn and a puff of smoke off the last terminal on the second battery. I turn truck off completely and notice silver on top of the battery where the soldier from the cable had melted.

Checked both batteries and they were 12.6 front and 12.5 rear. Checked alternators to make sure I hadn't bumped something all connections good. Checked the glow plug connectors by the alternator since I was there with a wrench earlier loosening the alternator to change the belt. It was bent over a little bit. Straightened it out. Checked the voltage on the top post of the glow plug solenoid... it showed 12 volts. Turned the key on with glow plugs and the bottom post showed 12 volts and the middle terminal on the solenoid had switched like it was supposed to.

Went back to the cab and put the key in again, turned the key to light the glow plugs... waited for "Wait" light to go out and turned the key... no starter but more smoke from the rear terminal of 2nd battery. This time it melted and broke off the rear battery connector/terminal.

Came inside, turned on the PC, hoped on Steel Soldiers and saw that it could either be loose connections or a starter. Went back out and felt the starter... still very hot.

Removed starter, went and had it tested at O'Riely's and it shut down the test machine twice while it was being tested. Meaning it blew a switch on their machine so that it shut it down and stopped the test.

Culprit... Starter again.

Just curious... Anyone get more than a few years out of a starter? Or is this one of those you get what you paid for items? Buy cheap get cheap?

 

[Dave Kay]

Just had the same thing happen to me. 1986 M1008.

I was replacing all the belts (alt/alt/steering) and had just put it all back together. I reconnected the battery cables. Jumped in the cab to start the truck, turned the key, waited for the glow plugs to turn off (wait light). It turns off, turn the switch the starter attempts to turn and a puff of smoke off the last terminal on the second battery. I turn truck off completely and notice silver on top of the battery where the soldier from the cable had melted.

Checked both batteries and they were 12.6 front and 12.5 rear. Checked alternators to make sure I hadn't bumped something all connections good. Checked the glow plug connectors by the alternator since I was there with a wrench earlier loosening the alternator to change the belt. It was bent over a little bit. Straightened it out. Checked the voltage on the top post of the glow plug solenoid... it showed 12 volts. Turned the key on with glow plugs and the bottom post showed 12 volts and the middle terminal on the solenoid had switched like it was supposed to.

Went back to the cab and put the key in again, turned the key to light the glow plugs... waited for "Wait" light to go out and turned the key... no starter but more smoke from the rear terminal of 2nd battery. This time it melted and broke off the rear battery connector/terminal.

Came inside, turned on the PC, hoped on Steel Soldiers and saw that it could either be loose connections or a starter. Went back out and felt the starter... still very hot.

Removed starter, went and had it tested at O'Riely's and it shut down the test machine twice while it was being tested. Meaning it blew a switch on their machine so that it shut it down and stopped the test.

Culprit... Starter again.

Just curious... Anyone get more than a few years out of a starter? Or is this one of those you get what you paid for items? Buy cheap get cheap?

Interesting! Was that your original starter since truck was owned or a replacement starter?

 

[cjtroutt]

From your description I would say you starter is on its way out.

You can take the starter apart to see if there are any issues with it. I would take it to a industrial starter/alternator shop for a test/rebuild.

The new gear reduction starters are another choice. Just make sure you have the proper support bracket. And if you truck is still 24v make sure you purchase the 24v versio as some of the fleabay sellers are shipping 12v starters.

What type of starter do you have? A 27MT Direct Drive or the newer 28MT Gear Reduction?

Ditto to above.

 

[deepseeman]

ok. so im just double checking here. cucv running great. come out of store and go to start. all lights bright lights, turn key and get a slow turning starter. pop hood and positive lead and jumper are to hot to touch. let cool for a moment. tried again and my passenger said that the stated leads were flexing when i turned the key. i then checked the starter and solenoid. they were very hot. i checked battery connections and gave it 10 minutes to cool. tried it again and she started right up. solenoid is only a year old and starter was rebuilt 1.5 years ago. is the starter giving me the free warning to rebuild her?

 

[3dAngus]

In my area, we have a battery and starter shop that does nothing but rebuild starters and sell batteries. They could hook up their equipment and do a load test on the batteries, then test in line with the equipment when trying to start, and tell you within three minutes everything you ever wanted to know, and there just simply is NONE better.

See if you can find a starter and alternator repair shop. They will test it for your for free, and they will take all the guess work out of it.