Amplifier for speaker and subwoofers

[leisman7]

Looking to hook speakers and subwoofers up in my m1010 with a 24 volt system with a 24 volt to 12 volnt dc converter. Im wondering if you can just tap straight to the battery to power my 2 amps or should i go from the converter? Any one have any ideas or have you done this before?
Thanks

 

[1986Blazerk5]

I would go directly to the batteries make sure you hook up to a 12 volt spot not a 24 spot, make sure your amp has a capacitor or it will kill your battery

 

[Blood_of_Tyrants]

Hook the system up through the fuse box. It's 12vdc and your alternator will take it with no problem.

 

[1986Blazerk5]

What brand and size of subs are you hooking up?

 

[leisman7]

What brand and size of subs are you hooking up?

2 10inch memphis audio subs

 

[Brett09]

I wouldn't use a DC converter. Just go to the first battery for your 12 volts. As far as a cap saving your battery, I don't know how it would. A cap will help with tightening the bass, but if your running a mild system and a class D amp (most sub amps are now) with your subs your shouldn't need one. The D just stands for digital. The amp turns itself on and off between notes to save power.

 

[Brett09]

Hook the system up through the fuse box. It's 12vdc and your alternator will take it with no problem.

Do NOT do this, the wiring is way to small of a gauge. Just hook up your amps to the battery.

 

[leisman7]

I would go directly to the batteries make sure you hook up to a 12 volt spot not a 24 spot, make sure your amp has a capacitor or it will kill your battery

Is this somehting that you have done before. I cant wrap my head around this. If you can just hook straight to the battery how come there is a dc converter for all my other 12 volt accessories?

 

[Wrench Wench]

If you're handy with a soldering iron (and SMT components), there a company in Sweden called 41 Hz. They sell kits based around the class-T Tripath audio chipsets. They have a product feature matrix up on Google docs:
https://spreadsheets0.google.com/ccc?key=tPUHWscGEOtbjquP9YZCCeg&hl=en#gid=0

By that, it looks like with the single-channel, 24 VDC, single-voltage supply, if your subs can be hooked up to present 4 Ω and suckle only 100 W of power, a single AMP11-LV would do the trick.

41Hz Audio:AMP11-LV

It's only about $40, but the shipping from Sweden to the states could be a bear, but then, it is just a kit. you'd have to supply your own hookup wire and case. If you can manage to DC-DC convert that up to 50 V, you can power subs to the tune of 200W with the -HV, high voltage, version of the AMP11.

I'm wanting an AMP9 for a homebrew car head unit project.

For the record, I have no relationship with 41 Hz. I just really like their products.

And do not hook your amps directly to the battery. Hook them to the battery through an accessory relay, otherwise, they'll drain your battery even if left with no signal to amplify.

 

[sirleaksalot]

ok rather than typing a book, here is a page I found with a quick search. I have done multiple car audio installs (with amps) this is a nut shell version but it will get you what you need. click on the link for a diagram.

as said just get 12 vdc from the front battery. I have installed a seperate fuse panel in mine.



Edit, removed copyrighted material. Here's a link to the website he mentioned.

How to Install a Car Amphttp://www.caraudiohelp.com/images/how_to_install_a_car_amp.gif

 

[seve7]

As already said, to do it easiest and best way grab a 12v rail off the battery, until you start going over a 1000w true rms class d amp, you will not need a cap, especially the fact these trucks have 2 batteries in them. there is some misinformation here, the class d doesnt shut off, its just a more efficient way of amplification compared to class a or ab amps, although it does have a higher thd and is really only useful for low frequency applications.

as far as wiring goes the bigger the better for 1kw total rms power, 4 guage will be fine, but bigger, the better.

you can hook straight to your battery, their will be a minimum residual power drain, but nothing more than all the other accessories in the vehicle that arent on a relay, the amp has its own internal switch, theres 2 ways this is done, one is a presence of a voltage on the rca interconnects, or high power inputs, or it will use a 12v remote switch either from a switch you can hook up or, almost all head units will have an amp remote line on the back of them for this purpose.

if you are using 2 memphis audio subs, (ive been out of the car audio scene for quite some time now) they used to be a premium sub, so i'm sure you are going to want to throw more than 100w at them, that build your own amp kit, will not even come close to satisfying your need. and honestly i wouldnt doubt it if that amp couldnt handle the massive continuous power output needed for driving subs. if you havent decided on an amp yet, if you can find a classic jbl bp600.1 or 1200.1 they are the best performing value class D you can get. or if you are going to spend some money, grab an mmats class d amp, there is no better performing amp period.

 

[leisman7]

I cant wrap my head around this. If you can just hook straight to the battery how come there is a dc converter for all my other 12 volt accessories?

 

[leisman7]

because someone does NOT KNOW **** ABOUT CUCV's

My truck has one alternator someone had done a conversion and put in an upgraded 24 to 12 volt dc to dc converter. I also don't appreciate you being a jerk man. I think a good amount of people are here to seek answers for things we don't know much about or get a different opinion on things we do know about.

 

[seve7]

to solve a lot of your questions, you could just get a multi meter and just poke around, the reason for 2 batteries is they are hooked in series so 2 12v batteries in series is 24v unlike regular applications that have 2 12v batteries hooked in parallel.

 

[Brett09]

I did car audio for about 10 years. You're getting a lot of mixed advise I rather not comment on for the sake of not getting into a pissing match. This is a very simple and easy install that I can help you step by step with. If you would like my help just send me a PM and I'll walk you through it. I can explain what to do and why you are doing it so you will know for the future.

 

[Brett09]

As already said, to do it easiest and best way grab a 12v rail off the battery, until you start going over a 1000w true rms class d amp, you will not need a cap, especially the fact these trucks have 2 batteries in them. there is some misinformation here, the class d doesnt shut off, its just a more efficient way of amplification compared to class a or ab amps, although it does have a higher thd and is really only useful for low frequency applications.


Okay so I am going to comment. Please don't try to correct me with you don't know what you're talking about. Class D amps use binary switching where they shut off power. The amp itself doesn't turn off but power inside shut off. That's why these amps can be 95% efficient or higher. They don't really waste any power.

As far as stiffening cap goes, there is no real number for the watts to say you should need one or not (in the car audio world, don't want an electrical engineer to come in with a PP presentation). It really depends on the person, what they are listening to and how loud/hard they run their system.

 

[seve7]

I wouldn't use a DC converter. Just go to the first battery for your 12 volts. As far as a cap saving your battery, I don't know how it would. A cap will help with tightening the bass, but if your running a mild system and a class D amp (most sub amps are now) with your subs your shouldn't need one. The D just stands for digital. The amp turns itself on and off between notes to save power.

Okay so I am going to comment. Please don't try to correct me with you don't know what you're talking about. Class D amps use binary switching where they shut off power. The amp itself doesn't turn off but power inside shut off. That's why these amps can be 95% efficient or higher. They don't really waste any power.

As far as stiffening cap goes, there is no real number for the watts to say you should need one or not (in the car audio world, don't want an electrical engineer to come in with a PP presentation). It really depends on the person, what they are listening to and how loud/hard they run their system.

First off I wont say you dont know what you are talking about, and I'm sure you are a competent installer but you are wrong on a few points. Class D does not mean digital. While they may have digital circuits in them, the classification of an amp is done by its power circuit and the design of the power stage.

The amp itself does not actually shut the power off inside, without getting an ee involved what the amp is doing is just making a close copy of the audio signal with pwm to switch the transistors to make a waveform output, they way the work in a nut shell is they have a minimal amount of power wasted as heat because all of the current is used to drive the speaker. i'm sure an actual ee can clear this up better than i am doing.

i agree with you on the cap issue, but with 2 batteries there is a significant power reserve already in the electrical system, ideally you would put one right in front of each amp regardless in a perfect system, but most of the time unless there is a massive load on the electrical system it really is a moot point most of the time.

 

[Brett09]

First off I wont say you dont know what you are talking about, and I'm sure you are a competent installer but you are wrong on a few points. Class D does not mean digital. While they may have digital circuits in them, the classification of an amp is done by its power circuit and the design of the power stage.

The amp itself does not actually shut the power off inside, without getting an ee involved what the amp is doing is just making a close copy of the audio signal with pwm to switch the transistors to make a waveform output, they way the work in a nut shell is they have a minimal amount of power wasted as heat because all of the current is used to drive the speaker. i'm sure an actual ee can clear this up better than i am doing.

i agree with you on the cap issue, but with 2 batteries there is a significant power reserve already in the electrical system, ideally you would put one right in front of each amp regardless in a perfect system, but most of the time unless there is a massive load on the electrical system it really is a moot point most of the time.

Okay being that I'm trying to help a guy that really doesn't know if he has 12 or 24 volts and it doesn't sound like he can go out and find it. Me calling this a digital amp isn't a technically correct term, but I can use it to try to help someone understand something. Do you understand what binary switching is? IT IS TURNING THE POWER ON AND OFF. Not the whole amp and not when its playing a note but when its not doing a job it shuts the power off. 01011101 on and off??? Anything sticking there? So me telling a guy that really is having an issue understanding all of this would be an acceptable term to use. With the way these batteries are wired we are doubling the volts, not the amps. You will be putting a load more on one of the batteries. Not both like if they are wired in parallel. Remember you are grabbing 12v off of the first battery in the series.

So here is my question for you. Does your johnson touch uranus? If it does go **** yourself. I'm trying to help someone in terms they can understand. You know....the whole idea behind the forum post. All your doing is saying the sky is blue when I've already said the sky is blue.

 

[seve7]

wow your ignorance amazes

and to the original author sorry about the thread jacking that has taken place.

 

[Wrench Wench]

If the only operative part of the electrical system that is truly 24 VDC is the starter, then great. That's perfect. You're not going to be blasting the audio system while starting the engine as a matter of course. That seems like a perfect opportunity to share the 24 V system between the starter and the Audio system. People with a serious burr under their saddle for car audio put a second alt in their engine bay to power just their audio system all the time. The way I see it, a CUCV owner is just a few steps ahead of such an autoaudiophile.

Of course, I'd want a nice, beefy isolation relay between the 24 VDC circuit which contains the starter and the part of the 24 VDC circuit which contains the amps. Just cut out the power to the audio system when the ignition line is energized and don't cut the audio system in until 5 seconds after the ignition line goes low and accessory power line goes high.

When it comes to audio amplification, Volts get you deciBels/Watts, not Amperes. The circuits as constructed can only pass so much in the way of current. If you want more sound from the amp, you have to crank up the voltage. At least, that's the way the 41Hz.com kit amps work. Maybe commercial autoaudiophile amps are design-locked to a 12 VDC power input. I don't know. I've never been impressed with the performance numbers (or price) on any commercial car amp I've ever seen.

Generally, amps get blown from too much current, not too much voltage. Though, I could be wrong on that in certain circumstances. Just like the justification for having 24 VDC starters in the first place. Higher voltage allows you to get away with using less current to get the same job done. If you power an amp off a 12 VDC system, you'll have to use higher gauge wiring to get the same amount of power through higher current than you would if you powered a 24+ VDC amp, or that same amp and power cables powered off 24 VDC will give more power than off 12 VDC.