Full flow oil system for M37

[asstor]

Hi gang,

Well, I have jsut spent over $1,500.00 and six months of sweat and tears (oh, some blood too!) rebuilding my 1951 T245 from the ground up. It has new or re-machined everything. I am in the process of assembly and realized that this engine does not have a full flow oil system. Upon further research I discovered that only about 10% of the oil is actually filtered, so most of what goes to the bearings is unfiltered oil. Ouch.

Although it will not be historically correct, I would like to modify the block, if possible, in to a full flow oil system. I'd hate to run my shiny new T245 on 90% unfiltered oil!!

Does anyone know if there is a conversion available or if anyone knows how I might acomplish this?

Thanks in advance for any replies, and Merry CHristmas to everyone out there.

Louis

 

[Bill W]

Keep the oil changed every couple of thousand miles and don't worry about it., However there was a guy a few years back on the PW forum ( Dodge Power Wagon Forum #346 ) that blocked off the discharge side of the external oil pump ( piece of sheetmetal gasket ) he then tapped the discharge side of the oil galley on the pump and the same galley on the block then plumbed it so the discharged oil went through a filter first. You can go post the question over on Joe's site and I'm sure someone will remember the post/pictures I thought it was a waste of time but it was still pretty neat and cheap to do setup

 

[Tanner]

The expense of modifying it will outweigh the gains... keep the oil changed on regular basis & drive it.

'Tanner'

 

[Roller]

Hi gang,

Well, I have jsut spent over $1,500.00 and six months of sweat and tears (oh, some blood too!) rebuilding my 1951 T245 from the ground up. It has new or re-machined everything. I am in the process of assembly and realized that this engine does not have a full flow oil system. Upon further research I discovered that only about 10% of the oil is actually filtered, so most of what goes to the bearings is unfiltered oil. Ouch.

Although it will not be historically correct, I would like to modify the block, if possible, in to a full flow oil system. I'd hate to run my shiny new T245 on 90% unfiltered oil!!

Does anyone know if there is a conversion available or if anyone knows how I might acomplish this?

Thanks in advance for any replies, and Merry CHristmas to everyone out there.

Louis

There was a good article on this in the Power Wagon Advertiser in a past issue. I had a Chrysler Industrial engine in my truck and it was set up to use bypass or full flow filtration. I used the full flow which I felt would be better, but these engines did just fine as built with the bypass system. Your engine will probably outlast you either way.

Frank

 

[asstor]

Thanks for the replies guys.

From doing some further research it appears that the bypass oil filter system is not as bad as I originally thought. I looked at many blogs and forums and it appears that when the flathead is running all the oil get filtered due to mixing the filtered and unfiltered oil in the sump, and that this takes place within a very short period of time (7 to 10 minutes). I do not know how accurate that is, but I guess it is more important to get a good quality filter.

Louis

 

[rosco]

Keep the Carb adjusted. There is more wear from diluted fuel, then from particulate matter. Also change the filter every oil change.

 

[Bill W]

On a 230ci (mil and civie)
The oil only gets filtered when the oil pressure goes over 45psi
The Bypass oil filter "return" line ( #28 in pic) is plumbed into the pressure relief valve and it opens only when OP is at 45psi, below 45psi the oil dead heads at the valve .

 

[Kasper31]

As you can see there is several ways of filtering the oil, when I O-hauled my M-37 engine I replaced the stock / standard oil filter can that uses the sock type filter. I went with the remote adaptor and a FRAM PH 8A filter, this makes changing the oil and filter very easy. I mounted the remote adapter on a bracket that is mounted on the cylinder head bolts. As you can see this allows me to change the filter without a mess to clean up, just unscrew the filter and put another one on, I do agree that doing oil and filter changes every couple thousand miles. I am using Amsoil 10 - 30 racing oil because it has the higher zinc needed on these engines. Any thoughts from other MV owners is appreciated. I don't throw the drain oil away, I use it in other engines like the mower etc.

 

[Bill W]

As you can see there is several ways of filtering the oil, when I O-hauled my M-37 engine I replaced the stock / standard oil filter can that uses the sock type filter. I went with the remote adaptor and a FRAM PH 8A filter, this makes changing the oil and filter very easy. I mounted the remote adapter on a bracket that is mounted on the cylinder head bolts. As you can see this allows me to change the filter without a mess to clean up, just unscrew the filter and put another one on, I do agree that doing oil and filter changes every couple thousand miles. I am using Amsoil 10 - 30 racing oil because it has the higher zinc needed on these engines. Any thoughts from other MV owners is appreciated. I don't throw the drain oil away, I use it in other engines like the mower etc.

What did you do for a metering hole in the new filter mount??, The center post in the bypass filter has a VERY small metering hole/orifice to prevent oil pressure loss from the main oil galley where it tapped off of. If you don't have any kind of metering device ( flow restricter ) than you left it up the the pressure relief valve to do it which means as soon as it opens at 45psi then your full flow filter dumps unrestricted oil flow right back into the pan causing the oil pressure to drop imediately thus the oil pressure valve will close and when pressure rebuilds it will open and again and let unrestricted oil flow back down, oil pressure drops valve closes again and so on and so on???? No offense but I don't think you did your engine any good by installing a full flow filter in place of the ( designed to work on that engine) bypass filter

 

[Kasper31]

The reason I used the PH8A filter is that I was told the 8A has no restriction as it is a full flow filter. However that said , I have over 4500 mi. on this engine with no strange noises.
Oil pressure going down the road runs 52psi on a stewart warner master oil pressure gage. With the engine temp at 185 - 190 F. If there is something to be learned here, I want to know, as I also want the engine to outlast me.

 

[Bill W]

It has to be doing something to the oil pressure relief valve
Think about it
You have your ( unrestricted ) full flow filter is tapped off the high pressure oil galley and dumping back into the pan, if it wasn't for the oil pressure reg in the way ( #32 in picture ) then all you had accomplished was to just open up the 1/8" plug/hole in the oil galley and let it dump back into the pan. As I mentioned earlier there is a very small restricter hole in the center tube of the bypass filter housing where the oil returns to the pan after being filtered through the element this stops the ( for lack of better words ) the dumping effect of oil returning to the pan., The full flow filter does not need a restrictor being in more modern engine the oil goes through the full flow filter and then to the the bearings (which are a restricter ) and from there back to the pan.
I think I said all that right...a little longish but right

 

[Kasper31]

Bill W
Well as you already know,,,, yes there is an orfice for the oil metering hole. I talked to the mechanic about this and,,,,,,,, as he told me,,, "yes he put a metering hole into the fitting on the filter adaptor" SOooooo as you know, when I change the filters I could not see the meter hole and thought that I was OK with the filter. As you can see ( I learned something on this stream of conversation about oil flow. I thank you sir.

 

[zout]

Remember that old commercial by Fram Filters - engine rebuilder standing in his shop with a torn down engine on the bench - and hold up a filter and says:

"Pay me now - or Pay me Later"

good filters - good oil and a good oil change interval.

 

[Lifer]

I'll go along with everyone who said "leave it the way it is." As hard as it may be for you young guys to believe, oil filters are a relatively new concept. When I was a kid, most cars and ALL trucks were unfiltered. (Power windows, A/C and stereo systems were unheard of but a radio was extra-cost option. Passenger side windshield wipers, heaters, and passenger-side sun visors were also extra-cost options. All cars came with a hand crank so you could start your car when the battery was dead without forking out $50 for a jump start.)

 

[Bill W]

Kasper your quite welcome

Lifer
Heck when you were a kid the wheel was still a new concept

 

[Kasper31]

Thanks Bill W.,,,,, I'm in/on a very steep learning curve,,,,having been a pilot for a LONG time and am VERY new to the MV ( on the ground vehicles ) I'm here to learn and try to give my two cents when I can,,,, Thanks Bill.

 

[Sarge29]

Careful Lifer,
You are gonna tell your age if you are not careful. I know because I remember some of the things you are talking about. I also agree with "leave it the way it is". The design for that system works well and with proper maintenance dictated by your driving habits and operating conditions that engine will last a lifetime and then some.

 

[majorhitt]

Sounds like leave it as is, is the perfered system. What about oil type? Amsoil 10 30 as Kasper said or something else? I was told to use Rotella (did I spell that correct?)for about the same reason.