Anybody ever use railroad to get GL buy home

[FireFighterHill]

Hmm I wonder if they would let us ride along with the truck. Or we could just hide in the back.

 

[M920]

Definately no to buying and using your own railcar. Even if you found one with a current air date and everything in good mechanical condition; the railroad(s) will charge you ($150.00 on the UP) every time they couple to or uncouple from your car. YOU are responsible for loading and securing your commodity to the railroad's specs.
You car is inspected by the car department in every terminal and any repairs deemed necessary are made and you get the bill... and they won't call you first with an estimate.
A break-down enroute will involve setting the car out in some siding and a repair trip from the closest car department (not covered by AAA).
Ferro and I could tell you numerous stories about lost cars, mis-routed cars, cars used as battering rams fo hammer other cars into a rail...
Even in an enclosed car, loads can break loose-- ask Ferro about 'excessive slack action'.

Lastly, I worked as a switchman for 37 years (SP then UP) and have seen how freight cars are handled in a railyard. I don't think I would ship any of my stuff by rail.

I've had my best luck with a shipping broker (Unishippers is my #1 pick). They're used to dealing with trucking companies, and will call around for the best price for you.

I totally agree with you about all the dangers of rail transport.....The only benefit I could see in shipping by rail, is that if a person wanted the bottom half of their truck repainted in colorfull GRAFITTY!!!!!... The rail yards nowdays are full of aspiring spray can "artists".... lol
Soni

 

[Bighurt]

I totally agree with you about all the dangers of rail transport.....The only benefit I could see in shipping by rail, is that if a person wanted the bottom half of their truck repainted in colorfull GRAFITTY!!!!!... The rail yards nowdays are full of aspiring spray can "artists".... lol
Soni

Well I was only considering moving the won auction home. The amount of time it'll spend in the shop. It'll need a new paint job.

Oshkosh ships via rail I wonder how they delivery nice new trucks? minus the aerosol paint job...

 

[03silverado]

I work for CSX as a track foreman in the track department as far as I know I've never seen "personal military or civilian trucks" on flats I've seen quite a few MRAPS and some M88 recovery vehicles never saw any military vehicles with graffitti on them however all the other box cars etc. Have "markings" on them. I will definately agree that some of these engineers are very abusive to the locomotives and rail cars themselves, if they don't stretch their train (creeping ahead to remove the slack before hammering on the throttle) they can jerk cars really hard and damage freight and break knuckles.

 

[3dAngus]

You sure would think moving by rail would be cheaper than trucking, but from what I' m hearing here, ....NOT!

I guess Warren Buffet didn't make a multi-$billion investment in rails because it was cheap.
Another reason why he bought in though is due to the high value of the RR real estate that goes along with it. It stretches across America.

 

[Robo McDuff]

I am looking into a 600 mile transport crossing three countries here in Europe. In Europe, railroads use a lot of container cars. Somebody suggested me to buy or rent an old container. An M35 or M39 fits into it and you can strapp the truck into it. They will pick up the container, get it onto the rairoad car, and transport it to your destination.

For me, in Europe, the container is too expensive because I need it only one-way and I would have to pay for empty back etc. And spanning three countries on the trip, there was no option to just rent one and leave it at the destination terminal for the next customer .

Since a lot of stuff is handled by containers, that might actually work on your side a lot better than on our side. Other option depending on the auction and delivery place: river barge maybe?

 

[saddamsnightmare]

March 14th, 2011.

Gents:

If I had the time to discuss this at length, you can ship by rail, TTX has Auto racks specially built for trucks, but converting a 60' box is not impossible. But if you're gonna keep negotiating with the railroad you need to form a company that can place an "X" after the reporting marks on the car. Owning railroad cars is not out of sight or mind, insurance is not impossible, you just have to know how it's done. I've owned several passenger and freight cars and locomotives, and moved them frequently on "Own Wheels", the cars passed inspection and were maintained in my own or shortline shops, and the secret is to waybill them (today) for "head end handling" and send a messenger along with the shipment. YOU would be amazed how careful they get on handling and spotting in yards when they know someone's with the shipment 24/7 and does have a video and still camera! Without it, it may be a crapshoot, with it the equipment will be handled correctly.
The best equipment for your moves would be serviceable railboxes or equivalent, with hydrocushion draft gears and tie down systems designed to restrain the load in all directions. Like they say up above, should be able to turn the car over and nothing falls off! When the price of diesel gets to $5.00 plus a gallon, there'll be plenty of folks ready to take your money and ship via the railroads, but right now, their mindsets on half and whole unit trains worth, the individual car costs too much to handle, unless its a passenger car. The other alternative is to modify railboxes to MHC car standards and send them via Amtrak, they'll be happy to handle your car because as a private railcar, it's 100% profit on the handling and repairs.....
Now you know why Uncle has those so called super cabooses called "Guard Cars"!....

Note to SS Memebers:

If I remember right, a deuce w/winch is a little longer then the stock WoW model, but two deuces should fit in a 100Ton 60' boxcar, three in the modified maxi racks that are used to transport vans and tractor trailer tractors. You will come no where near the weight capacity of the cars, but CSX is claiming they can move 500 tons of freight a mile on a gallon of diesel, so there is potential to form a freight forwarding company to do this. M105 trailers could be tipped up and secured inside boxcars, but you would need a forklift at either end and a special end rack fabricated to support the last trailers tongue. My cars were moved as PW&KX or WRSX shipments, the last digit indicates a privately owned car in express service and I could negotiate special handling for the shipments, including front or rear end handling and messenger service. In the old days I always shipped the cars next to the cabin car (caboose), today I would ship next to the power if the car is heavy enough, as that negates almost all slack action, and the hydrocushion underframe can handle any of the rest.

 

[Ferroequinologist]

You sure would think moving by rail would be cheaper than trucking, but from what I' m hearing here, ....NOT!

I guess Warren Buffet didn't make a multi-$billion investment in rails because it was cheap.
Another reason why he bought in though is due to the high value of the RR real estate that goes along with it. It stretches across America.

Shipping via rail IS way cheaper. Remember, one boxcar holds about 3 trucks worth of freight.

The reason it seems so expensive is because you pay to move one car- if you fill the car with parts and such until you can barely close the door, the price seems reasonable, because of how many trucks you would need to haul all that instead. If you put one deuce in a boxcar, your still paying to ship all the empty space in the car, so it seems more expensive. You pay to use that 10W 60L 13H 'space' on the train. The more you fill it the cheaper the overall shipment cost per item/pound/gallon becomes.

Another reason the railroads might be quoting more to those of us that can get them to give us a quote, is because they just don't want to deal with it.

 

[03silverado]

Yeah your big class one railroads: CSX, NS, UP, BNSF, CN aren't interested in moving one car without charging you a bunch of moola these big railroads are interested in "unit trains" point A to point B with no stops and switching in route. Shortlines have taken over much of the class one railroads industry switching so shortlines the way to go if you can

 

[03silverado]

You might be able to use the short line like a broker where you go to them say I have this it needs to go from here to there and they could put it on one of the big guys. Like here in maryland we have the Maryland Mid-Land short line and CSX moves their cars I see them all the time its worth a shot especially with the sky rocketing fuel prices. Railroads can offer better prices because they buy their fuel in "bulk" contracting fuel delivery for mutiple years at a set price.

 

[jamesfrom180]

Fascinating conversation! "popcorn"
My chosen profession seems obsessed with rail..Environmental Engineering...why I do not know. It would seem small freight terminals would service this need. I have done plenty of "assessments" on industrial property sitting vacant with sidings. Most sidings are torn out after sales. Here in FL, the powers to be seem to be in a real fight over rail and its future. Would seem old fashion cars with smaller dimensions would solve some of the dead volume concerns. Be a rough business model since your prime cost is always set by the actual rail roads.

 

[03silverado]

Yeah I can't tell you how many businesses used to use rail but no longer do because of the big rail roads not wanting to switch cars I believe that the rising cost of diesel will bring these small industries back and we will be restoring the rail heads we tore out 30 years ago when rail was doing bad. Trucks will always be needed to take the frieght from the warehouse to the individual stores but freight has been increasing drastically on the rail roads because people realize its much cheaper to move "bulk" freight by rail. I believe that one 90' box car can move 4 trucks worth of freight, that's four less trucks on the long haul road, four less drivers and insurance and 4 less fuel bills so rail is smarter and more economical. I do understand what you mean about smaller rail cars the big guys wont have them but if you had a business that delt with moving MV's you could purchase your own small cars and the big guys might agree to move them

 

[USAFSS-ColdWarrior]

Just a thought but....
When Walmart/Sams suddenly realizes the economies of rail, spurs will be built to existing stores and new stores will be built on existing rights of way.

In a "perfect world", this would have already been an integral part of their business plan.

Cruise around on GOOGLE EARTH and look at how many military bases have ACTIVE rail access.

I rest my case.

 

[Katahdin]

Container shipping by boat is coming the Eastern Seaboard in 2011. Hopefully that will give us casual freight users some new MV cargo options, or at least open closed doors due to the increased competition.

Weekly container ship service coming to Portland | The Portland Press Herald / Maine Sunday Telegram

American Feeder Lines

 

[Bighurt]

Cruise around on GOOGLE EARTH and look at how many military bases have ACTIVE rail access.

I rest my case.

You mean had rail access...like many a grain silo most the bases now have abandon spurs, most of which are only identifiably by the signature scar found from a satellite image.

What a waste...

But it goes with the current philosophy of the military, why fix it when we can pay someone else to do it. The best example I see for this is Civil Engineering here in Minot they have literally written enough MFR's with other base agencies that they no longer do anything...

This has become incredibly wastefully, why because during hours of darkness Security forces uses facility lighting to maintain clear sight on high security structure doors. These are built in lights just like the amber light on the pole lining the city streets. I think it uses a 150 watt light bulb. The point is when these lights go out it's a requirement that temporary lighting be brought in within an hr of the last check to maintain the requirement. What is wasteful is that it will take somewhere between 1-3 months for CE it get to the work-order to change the bulb. Meanwhile every night it's out the portable JP-8 run portable light-all is in place and running. Which is cheaper running a light-all that has to be refilled twice a night for 3 months straight or sending a CE man lift out with a light-bulb. Apparently it's the light-all there are now some half dozen machines running every night...

So it doesn't surprise me one bit that the AF has no more active rail lines.

 

[rideni]

Yeah I can't tell you how many businesses used to use rail but no longer do because of the big rail roads not wanting to switch cars I believe that the rising cost of diesel will bring these small industries back and we will be restoring the rail heads we tore out 30 years ago when rail was doing bad. Trucks will always be needed to take the frieght from the warehouse to the individual stores but freight has been increasing drastically on the rail roads because people realize its much cheaper to move "bulk" freight by rail. I believe that one 90' box car can move 4 trucks worth of freight, that's four less trucks on the long haul road, four less drivers and insurance and 4 less fuel bills so rail is smarter and more economical. I do understand what you mean about smaller rail cars the big guys wont have them but if you had a business that delt with moving MV's you could purchase your own small cars and the big guys might agree to move them

Just a thought but....
When Walmart/Sams suddenly realizes the economies of rail, spurs will be built to existing stores and new stores will be built on existing rights of way.

In a "perfect world", this would have already been an integral part of their business plan.

Cruise around on GOOGLE EARTH and look at how many military bases have ACTIVE rail access.

I rest my case.

84 Lumber company, a major reigional player in the mid-atlantic built many of there stores along railroad lines so that they could get rail delivered materials. These are generally active spurs and they actively receive a few cars each year, much more efficent then truck on transporting plywood or 2x4's if you ever have seen a lumber rack. I know of three locations that receive materials this way. It's a shame that freight station agents have disappeared as has LCL(less then car load) rail freight for the most part. I'd love to see more industries come back on the rail and industrial parts that were once rail served and still have the infrastructure for the most part. There are ton of remnants on my territory as well as 03silverado's territory of spurs.
I've been pondering buying a spur with a run around near my house that has some old freight handling equipment. and a little bit of land to place another spur. It would be useful for the railroad societies, museums and historical societies I help as well as for my freight purposes.

 

[m16ty]

I deal with people every day that move a bunch of freight. Most have tried the railroad but have either done away with it completely or it is very limited. The stories I hear is the railroad (CSX) is just so hard to deal with. I do know it's not very fast to get something moved by rail and nowdays most companies live by the moto "time is money". I also know the railroad has some crazy rules on how the car has to be loaded and the cargo secured.

We've loaded several pieces of machinery onto railcars. You have to load the machine, weld tie downs to the floor, and use heavy steel cables and turnbuckles to secure it (you'll never see your rigging again unless you're the same person unloading it). When it's unloaded the tie downs have to be cut off and the welds ground off. All this is very labor intensive and the cost can add up fast.

 

[73m819]

Would there be enough use of a car to pay for it self if someone brought one, got connected with a shout line so you could ship from short line to short line, if busy enough, it may take 6 months or even a year before it showed up at it's home short line

Also what is the cost to dead head to another loading site or short line if it needs to be there for a load????

 

[Ferroequinologist]

So it doesn't surprise me one bit that the AF has no more active rail lines.

I BEG to differ!

YouTube - Shaw Air Force Base Railroad

BTW, that's me in the video!

And the Army is purchasing lots of new locomotives and sending all the current ones to the shop for rebuild- yes a lot of bases have lost their rail access but those that still have it are busier than ever. We asked to get a locomotive to replace the two we are using now at Shaw AFB. The Army told us that with projected usage and the new/rebuilt units, they can spare us one in 20yrs. No lie! The Army handles all DOD rail assets and training- my engineers license was issued by the Army.

 

[Bighurt]

I BEG to differ!

YouTube - Shaw Air Force Base Railroad

BTW, that's me in the video!

And the Army is purchasing lots of new locomotives and sending all the current ones to the shop for rebuild- yes a lot of bases have lost their rail access but those that still have it are busier than ever. We asked to get a locomotive to replace the two we are using now at Shaw AFB. The Army told us that with projected usage and the new/rebuilt units, they can spare us one in 20yrs. No lie! The Army handles all DOD rail assets and training- my engineers license was issued by the Army.

Well I was generalizing, most AFB's have lost there active lines...