under-hood insulation

[jesusgatos]

Have heard that there was some kind of under-hood blanket that was included as part of the arctic kit, and most of the pictures of A3's that I've seen show some kind of insulation under the hood. Got a fiberglass A3 hood that I'm planning on adapting to my A2 and would like to add some more insulation. Mostly to help with noise. I know there are lots of different products that I could use, just wondering what the military used. Anybody know?

 

[goodguyzy]

my A3 has it to, Erik has if for sale, i think its $750 ouch

 

[gimpyrobb]

If you want to add insulation to your ride, look for Armstrong armaflex rubber insulation. I used to do some work as an insulator in industrial settings. That stuff rocks, not much works better.

 

[jesusgatos]

Thanks gimp. Looks like that's mostly for heat? What about noise? Any suggestions?

 

[gimpyrobb]

The weight of it helps for noise too. I had an 86 toyota 4x4 pickup with an al bed cap. I lined it with that stuff and it made using the bed for camping awesome. There is so many places that will leak noise, I think this will do fine. You kind of have to look at noise reduction like insulating, dead air. I HATED having to take a caulk gun and caulk the 2x seams in a building. It got boring real quick. Any crack or crevice needed filled. The same will be needed for deadening sound. LOTs to do. You can go way overboard with it quick when other things might need more attention. I'm sure you know this, just pointing it out for others reading this thread.

 

[jesusgatos]

Yeah yeah, I want to go way overboard here. Trying to civilize mah deuce. A least a bit.

 

[deathrowdave]

I have used Dyna Mat it is good !!! But a bit pricey

 

[oddshot]

I worry about adding sound deadening to the Deuce. My concern is that what every method you use will not be completely water tight ... and will hold water against the steel ... causing rust to develop that will not be easily detected.

I remember working at dealerships in the 1970's ... back when we used to sell undercoating to customers. That tar-y goop would get sprayed under the car ... but never completely bond with the metal. In a few short years the floors and trunk would rot outta them cars.

I know that cars back in the 1970's didn't have the various galvanizing treatment they put in cars today ... but neither did the Deuce.

... and I know that some of the bed liner stuff and other coatings we have are REAL good ... but ... all it has to do is fail to bond in ONE spot.

The last Ford Pickup I built up was a 1982 F 150. being a Georgia Truck ... it had never seen the salt of the north east and was completely RUST-FREE .... even though the window seals had leaked and the carpets were sodden with water.

I gutted the carpet ... cleaned the steel in the cab ... and put down a good coat of anti rust rustoleum. Yeah ... it was loud ... but if it ever started to rust ... I would sure know about it.

oddshot

 

[jesusgatos]

That's a big concern of mine too, especially since I'm installing a new cab. But I'm using a fiberglass A3 hood, so no potential rust problems there.

 

[oddshot]

That's a big concern of mine too, especially since I'm installing a new cab. But I'm using a fiberglass A3 hood, so no potential rust problems there.

FWIW ...

10 years ago, I began a restoration projects on 2, 1970 vintage, MGB's, a roadster and a GT.

Both cars were stripped to bare metal, ANY panel that showed through rust was replaced, including rockers, sills, floors, fenders etc.

Because I was aware that there was NO rust prevention done by the factory ... I sprayed Master Series Rust Sealer Silver over all the bare metal surfaces in the passenger compartments of both cars. The exteriors of both were primed and painted as per normal.

For various reasons, that is where the restoration stopped. Both cars sat ... with no carpeting ... in sometimes indoor/sometimes out door storage for ten years.

I recently sold the roadster project car, as a non-running "roller" project car. As I got it ready for the gentleman to pick up ... I took time to check the interior panels.

The floors had several spots where the metal had gone "soft" ... if I had pushed real hard on it ... it may well have gone through. Additionally, in a couple of places ... the inner sills had bubbled baddly ... if I had pushed on them at ALL ... a would have had a hole. These were brand new "factory" replacement panels.

It was especially bad at anyplace there was a lap-joint ... there was just no way that the "sealant" could get into that joint and protect the metal.

BUT ... after all the work I put into prep ... I am not very impressed with the protection that Master Series Rust Sealer Silver afforded.

In hind site, I think I may have been better off putting down a simple coat of Rustoleum.

For sure, rust is something to be concerned with.


oddshot


BTW ... I have been following your project(s).

Nice Work!

 

[PropDr]

I have also been looking into insulating the hood and cab of my truck.

I'm not exactly sure what the military used on these trucks, but i have seen some closed cell expanded vinyl-nitrile foam mating used in helicopters and other machines for noise / thermal insulation. IIRC it's flame retardant too. Last time I looked the thick stuff (2"x48"x48") slab was around $120.

their is also mass loaded vinyl but i have no idea how well that works for vehicles.

If rust is a concern you could just spray a coating of O.D. green zinc chromate primer down before you install the matting. This stuff is considerably better than red oxide or zinc oxide primers. Just make sure you wear a resperator with the proper filters while you spray because zinc chromate is a known carcinogen. It is usually available at good marine shops.

 

[PropDr]

It was especially bad at anyplace there was a lap-joint ... there was just no way that the "sealant" could get into that joint and protect the metal.

I take it that you didn't use weld through primer on the lap joints?

 

[jesusgatos]

This is the best resource I've found online for information about insulation and sound-deadening in vehicles (and other applications): soundproofing.org. They are a retailer though, just something to take into consideration.

 

[jesusgatos]

I just had all the cab and all the bodypanels sandblasted and epoxy-primed. Hope that'll be OK. Still trying to decide what I want to do about insulation on all those sheetmetal parts. Might just suck it up and have some sort of professional spray-on bedliner applied.

 

[PropDr]

This is the best resource I've found online for information about insulation and sound-deadening in vehicles (and other applications): soundproofing.org. They are a retailer though, just something to take into consideration.

Yep their the ones that make the mat i was describing. Did you look at their how to article?

SOUND PROOFING — http://www.soundproofing.org/images/LightAircraft.pdfhttp://www.soundproofing.org/images/LightAircraft.pdf


Another product i used was called "The insulator". It works ok. I used it on the roof inside the cab of my 64 ford f100. It's recycled cotton that has been treated to be mold, rot, and fire resistant. It comes in a couple flavors, one side aluminzed, both alumized, and double thick cotton. I think it was made by bonded logic but I'm not sure if they still make it.


Epoxy primer is the definately way to go. That should last a long time.

 

[Heavysteven]

I like the idea of lining the hood with Armiflex. My question is how to adhere this product to the hood? Either chemicaly or mechanicaly how do you keep it from coming off?

 

[mikew]

I'm working on an A3 right now. They have a closed cell foam insulation under the hood and inside the cab... you should see the rust under it!

On Jaguars I use "waxoyl". it's a spray on material that sets up just like the militarys rust preventative, kind of a soft and sticky wax.

I'd use something like that under the sound deadening material and then mechanically attach it.

 

[gimpyrobb]

I like the idea of lining the hood with Armiflex. My question is how to adhere this product to the hood? Either chemicaly or mechanicaly how do you keep it from coming off?

Clean surface, cut insulation to fit, remove insulation, apply 520 adhesive(contact cement) to hood and insulation. Once dry/tacky start to install insulation. Caution, once the two parts with glue on them touch, it will stay that way. Make sure you have everything lined up right before they touch.

 

[usmc320]

Good ideas here. One day I will get around to some insulation for the truck. Too many other projects first, but isn't that always the case.

 

[oldMan99]

I have seen several projects on "Powerblock-TV" where they used this stuff.

Lizardskin Ceramic Insulation and Sound Control Spray-on Formula

They have both a sound and thermal formula and if you want you can use both. The thermal is good up to 500f.

It is paintable

It does not look like it is inexpensive but then none of the competitive products are inexpensive either.

Their website is pretty complete giving good info on both products.

Seems to have several advantages over the various mat products.

I think I am going to give it a try but it will be some time until I am ready for this phase of the project.

Hope this helps.