6TL AGM source?

[ckouba]

Can anyone point me in the direction of reasonably priced 6TL AGM's?

 

[Freedom Land Clearing]

Can anyone point me in the direction of reasonably priced 6TL AGM's?

I picked up two at Napa last year. Decent price if I recall.

John

 

[ckouba]

What's a decent price, and AGM or FLA? I can find ~$200 FLA but the AGM'S I've found are $600+.

 

[GeneralDisorder]

They are pretty much all $600+ these days. There's essentially Odyssey (Enersys, Hawker, etc), Optima, and some others like Full Throttle (China). But pretty much all of them are in that same price range.

 

[Ronmar]

IMO AGM batts are a little overrated. They do deliver a greater CA per pound, so in a vehicle where weight is important, like an airplane, boat or quad/motorcycle, they make sense. They are a little more resilient to being pounded on, so again a quad or a UTV they make more sense than a vehicle that spends most of its time on paved roads…. Beyond that they are still a lead acid battery with the same basic requirements and failings…

 

[MatthewWBailey]

IMO AGM batts are a little overrated. They do deliver a greater CA per pound, so in a vehicle where weight is important, like an airplane, boat or quad/motorcycle, they make sense. They are a little more resilient to being pounded on, so again a quad or a UTV they make more sense than a vehicle that spends most of its time on paved roads…. Beyond that they are still a lead acid battery with the same basic requirements and failings…

"AGM" sounds more advanced than "VRLA" or "Lead Acid", Which is all they are. They're Still an h2 producer when over driven. I've had inspectors demand that AGM must be used (off grid batteries and data centers) because "no h2 is produced". Labels make for bad chemistry

 

[country]

Have 6TMF reasonable

Set of 4 US 6TMF 12 Volt Wet Battery Type II Standard Military Vehicle Battery

Set of 4 US 6TMF 12 Volt Wet Battery Type II Batteries

www.easternsurplus.net

 

[GeneralDisorder]

The military likes them because they don't leak and are MUCH less affected by low temperature. They can also suffer minor damage and continue to function (think a crack in the case, etc). A wet cell will leak out the acid if cracked and cease to function (no electrolyte = DEAD) while an Absorbed Glass Mat battery will keep working with a minor crack to the case as it will not leak out it's electrolyte. So they are more suited to the military where cost is secondary to mission suitability.

I personally run 4 x 6TAGM's because of these reasons, and specifically I run four since a single battery failure can be reconfigured to a two battery system and still function to get back home. With a two battery system you have zero options if you have one that decides to fail, explode, crack, melt off a terminal, etc, etc. You are SOL.

If I were trying to save coins I would reconfigure to 4 x Group 31's - either SLA or AGM depending on how much you want spend. I can get the Exide Sprinter van SLA Group 31's with stud terminals for CHEAP (like $145 each delivered to my shop) since sprinters are everywhere right now. And they have 950 CCA. Have a pair in my CUCV.

 

[Ronmar]

The military likes them because they don't leak and are MUCH less affected by low temperature. They can also suffer minor damage and continue to function (think a crack in the case, etc). A wet cell will leak out the acid if cracked and cease to function (no electrolyte = DEAD) while an Absorbed Glass Mat battery will keep working with a minor crack to the case as it will not leak out it's electrolyte. So they are more suited to the military where cost is secondary to mission suitability.

I personally run 4 x 6TAGM's because of these reasons, and specifically I run four since a single battery failure can be reconfigured to a two battery system and still function to get back home. With a two battery system you have zero options if you have one that decides to fail, explode, crack, melt off a terminal, etc, etc. You are SOL.

If I were trying to save coins I would reconfigure to 4 x Group 31's - either SLA or AGM depending on how much you want spend. I can get the Exide Sprinter van SLA Group 31's with stud terminals for CHEAP (like $145 each delivered to my shop) since sprinters are everywhere right now. And they have 950 CCA. Have a pair in my CUCV.

As long as the alt can support them

 

[GeneralDisorder]

As long as the alt can support them

Right. Everyone in this forum must consider that, unfortunately, since S&S didn't. It boggles my mind that my CUCV from 1984 has twice (200A) as much alternator(s), half as much battery (two 6TL's or two GRP 31's), and predates the FMTV's by a decade. The DOD should have made S&S fix them at their expense. Someone got paid on that deal

 

[Keith Knight]

I switched to 4each group 31C batteries. I had to make new mounts and connections, but way cheaper. I used 1”x.25” silver plated copper buss bars from McMaster Carr.

 

[ckouba]

Damn Keith, that is pretty!

 

[Keith Knight]

Thanks and they are meant for heavy duty truck use.

 

[71DeuceAK]

I've got Hawker AGM 6TLs in my M929A2 dump truck that appear to have been in there since 2005. At almost 20 years old, they are finally beginning to show their age.

 

[ckouba]

I switched to 4each group 31C batteries. I had to make new mounts and connections, but way cheaper. I used 1”x.25” silver plated copper buss bars from McMaster Carr. View attachment 927875

Keith,

Upon closer look, you may want to consider reconfiguring your +24 connection like this:



I had my house solar batteries configured as you have here and a contact who does solar for a living recommended moving it as drawn to force current to travel through all batteries (both charge and discharge). It will work as you currently have it (as you have already seen in your travels), but for longevity, it was recommended to me to make the switch.

Chris

 

[wandering neurons]

I got two flooded (no -AGM) batteries from O’Reilly for $230 each. Already filled with acid, dropped in and fired up. I set up for two batteries only and installed a disconnect that kills parasitic 12v load when shut down.

 

[Keith Knight]

Keith,

Upon closer look, you may want to consider reconfiguring your +24 connection like this:

View attachment 927905

I had my house solar batteries configured as you have here and a contact who does solar for a living recommended moving it as drawn to force current to travel through all batteries (both charge and discharge). It will work as you currently have it (as you have already seen in your travels), but for longevity, it was recommended to me to make the switch.

Chris

Thanks, That would be a good idea. I did that eight years ago using some of the original cables, without doing any research. My truck was missing all the batteries and the cover, so I improvised and made a new shelf for the batteries and made an aluminum cover. No more fiberglass slivers. When I built out the habitat with 8 each 200 amp hour Victron lithium batteries I made sure to do all the research and and have all the cables lengths correct and connected to pull power evenly through the battery banks. Things we learn.

 

[MatthewWBailey]

Keith,

Upon closer look, you may want to consider reconfiguring your +24 connection like this:

View attachment 927905

I had my house solar batteries configured as you have here and a contact who does solar for a living recommended moving it as drawn to force current to travel through all batteries (both charge and discharge). It will work as you currently have it (as you have already seen in your travels), but for longevity, it was recommended to me to make the switch.

Chris

Not trying to be a pest or argumentative. I'm a PE that does solar for a living since '08 (33 states). This change will not create any conditions that are measurably different. In practice, the parallel circuit will be measurably identical on either side given the conductance of the bus bar. On paper, the difference is micro ohms (micro amps), ie only the added resistance of the bus which is quite short. looks like 3/16x1"x12" which is 43 micro ohms on the table. As a comparison, typical AGMs have an internal R of 10-20 milli ohms new. That's a 1000x range difference, so if 1000A is flowing, only 1A of differential would be theoretically observed (if you have 1000A). The battery resistance controls the equation. But, if you're actually worrying about micro-ohms, then the best eye ball location would be bolting Negative, 12V and 24V to the exact center of the crossing bus bars, not the left side or right side. I'm not going to throw a fellow solar pro under the bus but sometimes humans revert to eye-ball engineering simply due to attrition.

 

[Keith Knight]

Interesting, love math. So based on that I’ll probably leave it alone.

 

[aw113sgte]

Not trying to be a pest or argumentative. I'm a PE that does solar for a living since '08 (33 states). This change will not create any conditions that are measurably different. In practice, the parallel circuit will be measurably identical on either side given the conductance of the bus bar. On paper, the difference is micro ohms (micro amps), ie only the added resistance of the bus which is quite short. looks like 3/16x1"x12" which is 43 micro ohms on the table. As a comparison, typical AGMs have an internal R of 10-20 milli ohms new. That's a 1000x range difference, so if 1000A is flowing, only 1A of differential would be theoretically observed (if you have 1000A). The battery resistance controls the equation. But, if you're actually worrying about micro-ohms, then the best eye ball location would be bolting Negative, 12V and 24V to the exact center of the crossing bus bars, not the left side or right side. I'm not going to throw a fellow solar pro under the bus but sometimes humans revert to eye-ball engineering simply due to attrition.

Thank you for the educated info. When I started reading into RV solar systems (have a victron system) it was amazing the number of uneducated, unscientific group think is out there. The whole ferrule, lugs, crimping discussions are other areas of claims with no data.