Allright Pros, need some help! Brake question

[Vanniek71]

Finally found a Deuce that's local to me for sale, ad says "needs new master cylinder" (I have searched and read in here and know its pretty easy to change out on the spot as several have done it in parking lots, and I have no qalms with doing that at all)

I called and talked to the guy selling it, and asked him what the symptoms of the brakes were...he said "They don't work at all"

My question is: Is that generally a master cylinder? Could it just be low brake fluid?
Are there other things that could cause the brakes not to work on a deuce?

I have found parts, a new MS is only like $100 for deuces, or there are rebuild kits for like $25...should I go with new, or would a rebuild kit likely solve the issue? I also have read there are 3 or so different kind of MS that may have been used.....if I buy a new one (if the truck is even something I want) can I put any of the 3 in place of whatever's there? or does it need to match?

I am trying to get down to look at the truck sometime today or tomorrow, I know already to check the brake lines etc, but with a bad master cylinder (at least in my normal sized vehicle situations) there is no way to just look and see if its bad.

Any input/advice would be awesome!

thanks guys, look forward to joining the deuce owners ranks soon!

 

[Westech]

well just like any other car/truck out there, there could be MANY things that can cause the brakes not to work.

Master cylinder,
Air pack/booster,
low/out of fluid,
broken line, Hard or rubber
bad wheel cylinder,
Shoes way out of adjustment,

There is no one answer that is your fix all.

 

[Vanniek71]

well just like any other car/truck out there, there could be MANY things that can cause the brakes not to work.

Master cylinder,
Air pack/booster,
low/out of fluid,
broken line, Hard or rubber
bad wheel cylinder,
Shoes way out of adjustment,

There is no one answer that is your fix all.

Yep figured as much, which is why I am on here asking the folks that know.

Once I get to talk to the guy and actually see the truck I will have a lot more info. He says its a master cylinder, but until I can look at it I'm a skeptic.

A bad wheel cylinder wouldn't cause all the brakes not to work though would it?

And shoes way out of adjustment...that would be extremely rare I would venture to guess since it would take all of them to be that way for none of the brakes to work correct?

From what I gathered, the brakes worked, and then just stopped working. On a normal car I would check fluids, lines and then master cylinder. But we all know the deuce isn't just a normal car, so I want to go in informed as much as I can!

 

[73m819]

Where in colorado are you, we have members in that state, see if somebody is close , then you two GO LOOK at the truck, that is THE ONLY way to kKNOW what is wrong with the brakes

 

[Vanniek71]

The Deuce is in Arvada, roughly 15 mins from Denver.

 

[drgreg]

It has single circuit brakes, probably, so one bad wheel cylinder would affect the entire system. Check for fluid in the reservior, if it is empty at minimum you will need to add fluid and bleed the system. The TMs will be of great help.

 

[Warthog]

It may need to only have the air pack bleed.

 

[Heavysteven]

Anybodies guess on this one, it could be a single issue or a combination of problems. I would start by pressure bleeding it at least.

 

[Vanniek71]

It may need to only have the air pack bleed.

Been reading the TM's good on how to bleed the hydraulics, can someone guide me to where bleeding the air pack is?

 

[Warthog]

Been reading the TM's good on how to bleed the hydraulics, can someone guide me to where bleeding the air pack is?

Check the TM 9-2320-361-20 Technical Manual.

Chapter 8-12,
Page 8-33,
Item #19

 

[Westech]

Same spot on how to bleed the breaks.

 

[Warthog]

Give me a breaks or is that brakes........

 

[Vanniek71]

is that 1 3 - 2 0 . A I R S Y S T E M P R E S S U R E V E N T I N G . ?


^^^ sorry that's a copy and paste, is why it looks weird

 

[Westech]

Give me a breaks or is that brakes........

Depends on how I type it lol. it can mean the same thing from time to time....
to too two

 

[NoLeftTurns]

Hey, I am a newbie also, but I am in Arvada. I would love to check out the truck with you and would be happy to lend a hand if possible. If you read my other posts I have a similar issue with no brakes on the deuce I am in the process of purchasing. I have just started the degree program here on SS, so maybe in 4-5 years I'll know what the **** I am doing. Would love to learn alongside someone else also. I have recently seen posts from OldFart in cenntennial, he seems to know his stuff. I'd try him if you need technical expertise. I am looking at a similar problem and was plannig to do the same - replace MC, bleed and give it a try. Seems the onlything different than a passenger car is bleeding the airpack. I will be available this weekend so PM me if interested.

 

[swbradley1]

You can make your own power bleeder but this is what I use, or you can just do a soldier A and B.

StoreFront -- Motive Products Online Store



The wheel cylinders have a nasty habit of leaking out from non-use. If it were me (and I have one that needs it) I'd fill it with DOT 5 and push the pedal a few times and crawl under and look for a leak.

If you put new wheel cylinders on it make sure they have the correct (as opposed to allowing aire to be sucked in) style of spring on the cups.

 

[poppop]

Usually when the master is no good it leaks out the front boot. If it has fluid and is not leaking take the line loose from it and hold your finger over it while someone pumps the petal. If you get pressure then that probably is not the problem. If the airpac is no good you still should have a hard petal. These brakes are air assist hydralic brakes. If a line or wheel cylinder is bad enought to have no petal then you should see brake fluid leaking badly somewhere. Before you add fluid you need to determine if the system had silicone DOT 5 in it or had been changed to DOT 3. They will not mix.

 

[Vanniek71]

How can I tell the difference between Dot 5 or Dot 3?

If thats the case and the fluid was mixed, will that cause total brake failure? And if so do I just keep bleeding the Dot 3 out until the brake work, or is it a huge process to get all that wrong fluid out? (Well other than the process of bleeding everything)

 

[porkysplace]

Read this thread it will tell you how to tell the difference ;Brake fluid -how to tell which kind you have DOT 3 or DOT 5

 

[pa.rich]

My guess is bad wheel cylinder ,leading to low fluid. Most of these old trucks need new wheel cylinders, on the average.