alternative steering options the deuce

[mikew]

I used hydro assist from a used fire truck . Retains the M35a2 steering box, control valve in place of the drag link .

This is the drag link steering valve that Ford used on the '75-'77 4x4 F250. Seems to be used on many other applications too.

This drag link is used to control a hydraulic ram mounted on the axle for hydro assist.

I'm trying to find a cheap used one to do some measurements, I'm not sure how long or how sturdy it is.

 

[booger]

Here are the pictures ,Pm if i can be of any help !!! Have a great and safe day,Dave

Very interesting Dave. This may be the best compromise between cutting the frame for an inside the frame PS box and no mechanical connection with a full hydraulic system. Did you do this installation yourself ? I still have a lot more questions. Like, who has some information on how the 'Garrison System' actually works ( whats going on inside) I'm looking around for the right year truck in the bone yards that may have this setup.

Thanks again,
Greg

 

[ProviderDriver]

Not to highjack the thread, but don't be afraid of anything PROPERLY fabricated and welded. Using the right alloys, weld technique, welding rod etc, the finished product will be as strong as anything else.

FWIW, I oxy/acetylene welded aircraft fuselages made from 4130 tubing and then flew them doing aerobatics pulling over 7 G's... I wouldn't sweat it if it is done right. And very little metal on military equipment is heat treated. Mild steel is the norm on anything they have (for the most part) due to the need for it to be combat field repairable. (At least in all the surplus flight line and aircraft support equipment I deal with)

 

[VP17IFT]

Great info, I've been looking at the diffrent methods for addidng power steering on my deuce and this thread is making me lean toward the hydro assist. Now I just need to find the right parts.

 

[deathrowdave]

Did all of the installation myself. Had the steering arm welded by a nuke certified welder at work. The control valve just senses the direction you are trying to turn the wheels and sends fluid to that side of the cylinder . Very simple in operation, easy to rebuild just 4 o rings in the control valve. There were many large delivery (Mid '70s soft drink) trucks used this type of steering, should be able to locate one. I may still have the drawing for the axle bracket . I will check and try to locate . The axle bracket can also be welded to the axle rather than bolted .

 

[Heath_h49008]

It's a bigger version of the old ford power steering.... just like early mustangs. Funky.

Did you change the castor at all? Most non-PS axles ran positive as a way to make steering easier in the old stuff. It always felt squirrely to me...

 

[JasonS]

Just want to point out that these valves came with two different size ball studs. Garrison told me that they can supply (machine) ball studs to mate the valves to the deuce steering components. That way you woulnd't have to weld things together.

 

[deathrowdave]

The reason I modified the steering arm is that the Garrison Control Valve must run in a parallel line with the ground. The OEM M35a2 drag link is some what S shaped to make up the difference in height in pittman arm and steering arm. With the power assist control valve and hydraulic cylinder there is no where near as much loaded force on the steering arm as stock OEM arm, the hydraulic cylinder is what has all the steering load force on it not the steering arm as in stock configuration. The truck that I took the Garrison Assist from had a ball stud welded to the forged axle by Garrison Steering , for the stationary end of the cylinder !!!

 

[booger]

Just want to point out that these valves came with two different size ball studs. Garrison told me that they can supply (machine) ball studs to mate the valves to the deuce steering components. That way you woulnd't have to weld things together.

You talked with Garrison? Recently? Do they have a tech support line? Do you have the contact information?

Thanks,
Greg

 

[booger]

Did all of the installation myself. Had the steering arm welded by a nuke certified welder at work. The control valve just senses the direction you are trying to turn the wheels and sends fluid to that side of the cylinder . Very simple in operation, easy to rebuild just 4 o rings in the control valve. There were many large delivery (Mid '70s soft drink) trucks used this type of steering, should be able to locate one. I may still have the drawing for the axle bracket . I will check and try to locate . The axle bracket can also be welded to the axle rather than bolted .

Dave,

That's some great information, glad I stumbled across this thread. I'm searching for a donor.

Greg

 

[booger]

It's a bigger version of the old ford power steering.... just like early mustangs. Funky.

Did you change the castor at all? Most non-PS axles ran positive as a way to make steering easier in the old stuff. It always felt squirrely to me...

I think that's bass akwards...positive caster, top ball joint back, steers hard and centers better, Negative caster, top ball joint straight up or forward, steers easier and feels squirley

 

[JasonS]

The reason I modified the steering arm is that the Garrison Control Valve must run in a parallel line with the ground. The OEM M35a2 drag link is some what S shaped to make up the difference in height in pittman arm and steering arm. With the power assist control valve and hydraulic cylinder there is no where near as much loaded force on the steering arm as stock OEM arm, the hydraulic cylinder is what has all the steering load force on it not the steering arm as in stock configuration. The truck that I took the Garrison Assist from had a ball stud welded to the forged axle by Garrison Steering , for the stationary end of the cylinder !!!

Garrison advertises that they will custom make an S shaped end for the valve to keep it parallel. They really offer ALL of the parts to do this swap.

You talked with Garrison? Recently? Do they have a tech support line? Do you have the contact information?

Thanks,
Greg

About Garrison Manufacturing 800-203-1894

Yes, I have called and talked to tech support over the summer. I decided not to go with their valve since repair parts are unique to them and new valves are very expensive. In the end, I went with the HF 54 which I believe to be simpler and uses more off-the-shelf parts.

 

[deathrowdave]

What ever works is great !!! The donor truck had a straight control valve , so I had to adapt to overcome the challenge !!!! For the amount invested mine works great so far !!!! Easy to adapt no major effort basic bolt together . As I said it may not be the best but hard to beat for $75.00 investment , works great for me !!! Once you have ridden a hand jockey knuckle for a while anything easy is the greatest !!! Have fun , be safe and let me know if I can be any further help.

 

[booger]

What ever works is great !!! The donor truck had a straight control valve , so I had to adapt to overcome the challenge !!!! For the amount invested mine works great so far !!!! Easy to adapt no major effort basic bolt together . As I said it may not be the best but hard to beat for $75.00 investment , works great for me !!! Once you have ridden a hand jockey knuckle for a while anything easy is the greatest !!! Have fun , be safe and let me know if I can be any further help.

"hand jockey knuckle" right on. No front brake of course !

I still haven't come across a Garrison assist set up or a HF 54 box. I'd like to get my hands on a donor truck so I can get all of the parts and rebuild them rather than start buying a piece at a time and spend way too much. There must be somebody in Arizona that has what I need. I'll just keep looking.

Greg