Axle (s) rebuild thread, gears and lockers

[ramdough]

Got front and rear in today. Noticed I had a bad u joint cup so I ordered a new one.



I will have to finish next week for part to arrive. In the mean time, I will be doing CTIS and inner hub seals next.

 

[ramdough]

Got front and rear in today. Noticed I had a bad u joint cup so I ordered a new one.

View attachment 913686

I will have to finish next week for part to arrive. In the mean time, I will be doing CTIS and inner hub seals next.

Noticed something….

My air line port for the intermediate diff had a plastic plug that was broken. Inside, I can see rust.

Sprayed a small amount of Wd40 then put the air line on. Is there an easy way to check to see if it is frozen or functional? My guess is if no have a problem, it means my intermediate may not lock up.


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[aw113sgte]

Noticed something….

My air line port for the intermediate diff had a plastic plug that was broken. Inside, I can see rust.

Sprayed a small amount of Wd40 then put the air line on. Is there an easy way to check to see if it is frozen or functional? My guess is if no have a problem, it means my intermediate may not lock up.


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Jack up one intermediate tire off the ground and it should spin freely, engage the lock and it should not.

 

[fuzzytoaster]

I have not driven the 3.07's. I love the changes Eco Hubs made to our M1078A1: significant noise reduction, simpler wheel hubs, less gear lash and loss of efficiency, more pep, smoother gear changes and lower rpm's at speed. The 3.07's only offer the last, and marginally.

In the exhibit below M1078 ECO HUBS and M1078 3.07 only offer a comparison of the 3.90's with EcoHubs to the 3.07's. The only crawl ratio advantage is in first; and the losses in 6th and 7th gears is significant as 1,600 rpms is where our Caterpillar engine powerband resides. Even if not looking for open road speeds over 50mph with the 3.07's you are pushing your engine hard beyond the powerband. With the EcoHubs our engines cruise smoothly at 60 in 6th gear around 1,600 rpm's. There in the powerband we see fewer downshifts and cooler engine temperatures.

View attachment 912797

I like that chart and it confirms my feelings on ECO hubs - the 1:1 ratio is too tall for our trucks and isn't worth the compromise in my opinion.
ramdough has it right with his 3.07 gears as the Cat 3126 recommended highway cruise rpm is 2000rpm for economy up to 2200 rpm for performance. Max is 2400 rpm sustainable with a minimum of 1800 rpm. With the 3.07s that put him about 65 mph in 7th gear with room to speed up and slow down before down shifting and a max of 69 mph sustained with a top of 72~ mph if he went all out. Plenty fast.

If he had ECO hubs and stayed in the proper rpm range of 2000-2200 he would be doing either 46 mph in 4th gear or 67 in 5th. 6th gear would be in the bottom of the power band doing low rpm cruising or he'd be doing about 90 mph (I'd like to see it!) and forget 7th gear almost all together unless you're coasting across Kansas trying to save fuel. The Cat will not like doing 1400 rpm as it's too far below the power band.

ramdough keep up the good work man!

 

[ramdough]

I like that chart and it confirms my feelings on ECO hubs - the 1:1 ratio is too tall for our trucks and isn't worth the compromise in my opinion.
ramdough has it right with his 3.07 gears as the Cat 3126 recommended highway cruise rpm is 2000rpm for economy up to 2200 rpm for performance. Max is 2400 rpm sustainable with a minimum of 1800 rpm. With the 3.07s that put him about 65 mph in 7th gear with room to speed up and slow down before down shifting and a max of 69 mph sustained with a top of 72~ mph if he went all out. Plenty fast.

If he had ECO hubs and stayed in the proper rpm range of 2000-2200 he would be doing either 46 mph in 4th gear or 67 in 5th. 6th gear would be in the bottom of the power band doing low rpm cruising or he'd be doing about 90 mph (I'd like to see it!) and forget 7th gear almost all together unless you're coasting across Kansas trying to save fuel. The Cat will not like doing 1400 rpm as it's too far below the power band.

ramdough keep up the good work man!

@fuzzytoaster well that makes me feel better.

Either way, this is not an Eco hub thread. I appreciate those that offered opinions, but I am pretty well set in what I am doing ….. at least for now.


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[ramdough]

Jack up one intermediate tire off the ground and it should spin freely, engage the lock and it should not.

Right now, I am waiting on a new u joint but I will try when it is all hooked up.

So just to clarify. Chock tires, jack up one intermediate tire, Start truck, put in mode, remove parking brake, spin lifted tire?

Do the Detroit lockers cause any issues here since I am manually trying to spin them unlocked…. I have less torque than rolling tires.


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[aw113sgte]

Right now, I am waiting on a new u joint but I will try when it is all hooked up.

So just to clarify. Chock tires, jack up one intermediate tire, Start truck, put in mode, remove parking brake, spin lifted tire?

Do the Detroit lockers cause any issues here since I am manually trying to spin them unlocked…. I have less torque than rolling tires.


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Correct, and with the lockers, if they default to locked, I would remove them from the equation by lifting up both intermediate axel tires if you have to. However if they are unlocked and you lift both tires, one will sping forward and the other back while the driveshaft doesn't spin (depending on drag in the system) and you won't learn if mode works.
With mode off, you will be able to see the transmission driveshaft spinning when you turn the tire, pushing mode should lock that so you can't spin it.

Other way, jack up the on tire and put in drive, tire will spin (unless locker is engaged). Put in mode and it will drive off the jack

 

[hike]

I like that chart and it confirms my feelings on ECO hubs - the 1:1 ratio is too tall for our trucks and isn't worth the compromise in my opinion.
ramdough has it right with his 3.07 gears as the Cat 3126 recommended highway cruise rpm is 2000rpm for economy up to 2200 rpm for performance. Max is 2400 rpm sustainable with a minimum of 1800 rpm. With the 3.07s that put him about 65 mph in 7th gear with room to speed up and slow down before down shifting and a max of 69 mph sustained with a top of 72~ mph if he went all out. Plenty fast.

If he had ECO hubs and stayed in the proper rpm range of 2000-2200 he would be doing either 46 mph in 4th gear or 67 in 5th. 6th gear would be in the bottom of the power band doing low rpm cruising or he'd be doing about 90 mph (I'd like to see it!) and forget 7th gear almost all together unless you're coasting across Kansas trying to save fuel. The Cat will not like doing 1400 rpm as it's too far below the power band.

ramdough keep up the good work man!

I agree EcoHubs with the 3.07's are too tall.

I am enjoying watching @ramdough work—

 

[ramdough]

Any concerns with running my engine while the front wheels are off and I am in jack stands?

I have done it with cars, but these trucks are more vibrating and heavy.

Wheels are chocked.


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[ramdough]

Also, do I need to do anything to get the intermediate axle to have oil in the torque divider? I assume that is fully drained.


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[aw113sgte]

Any concerns with running my engine while the front wheels are off and I am in jack stands?

I have done it with cars, but these trucks are more vibrating and heavy.

Wheels are chocked.


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All depends on the quality of your jack stands. I haven't found it to vibrate excessively that I can't have it on a jack stand while running.

 

[ramdough]

All depends on the quality of your jack stands. I haven't found it to vibrate excessively that I can't have it on a jack stand while running.

I have the 22 ton Harbor Freight ones. The saddle does not wrap the axle at all.


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[ramdough]

I agree EcoHubs with the 3.07's are too tall.

I am enjoying watching @ramdough work—

I did not plan on doing both. I already had the 3.07’s with dual lockers in storage before the Eco Hubs existed.


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[GeneralDisorder]

I have the 22 ton Harbor Freight ones. The saddle does not wrap the axle at all.

I wouldn't trust anything from HF to hold up a 20k lb truck.

The military uses these for FMTV's:

Heavy Duty Jack Stand - 7 Ton

Before there was CC Military Surplus, there was Central City Manufacturing. CCMI Makes a number of great items for the US Government that you can also buy, including these Military Grade automotive jack stands used for Tank's, APC's, and Humvee's! Made to strict U.S. Government Specifications...

www.ccmilitary.com

 

[ramdough]

I wouldn't trust anything from HF to hold up a 20k lb truck.

The military uses these for FMTV's:

Heavy Duty Jack Stand - 7 Ton

Before there was CC Military Surplus, there was Central City Manufacturing. CCMI Makes a number of great items for the US Government that you can also buy, including these Military Grade automotive jack stands used for Tank's, APC's, and Humvee's! Made to strict U.S. Government Specifications...

www.ccmilitary.com

Normally I agree, but the design of these is pretty hard to screw up and there is a huge over rating.

22 Ton Heavy Duty Jack Stands with Locking Pin, Yellow

Amazing deals on this 22T Heavy Duty Jack Stands Yellow at Harbor Freight. Quality tools & low prices.

www.harborfreight.com

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[GeneralDisorder]

Normally I agree, but the design of these is pretty hard to screw up and there is a huge over rating.

22 Ton Heavy Duty Jack Stands with Locking Pin, Yellow

Amazing deals on this 22T Heavy Duty Jack Stands Yellow at Harbor Freight. Quality tools & low prices.

www.harborfreight.com

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19" vs. 31" height - and USA made for $60 more. No comparison IMO.

 

[aw113sgte]

I wouldn't trust anything from HF to hold up a 20k lb truck.

The military uses these for FMTV's:

Heavy Duty Jack Stand - 7 Ton

Before there was CC Military Surplus, there was Central City Manufacturing. CCMI Makes a number of great items for the US Government that you can also buy, including these Military Grade automotive jack stands used for Tank's, APC's, and Humvee's! Made to strict U.S. Government Specifications...

www.ccmilitary.com

Watch out on asphalt with this style, the sharp legs can sink in.

 

[ramdough]

19" vs. 31" height - and USA made for $60 more. No comparison IMO.

I don’t need the height….You are comparing 7 tons capacity with a ratcheting lift made from thin bent steel to a 1” pin with all thick gusseted and welded steel. They are apples and oranges.

Granted the ones you pointed out have a place and are nice…. The HF ones I am using are stronger, simpler, and do the job. I actually would trust the HF design more.


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[Mullaney]

I don’t need the height….You are comparing 7 tons capacity with a ratcheting lift made from thin bent steel to a 1” pin with all thick gusseted and welded steel. They are apples and oranges.

Granted the ones you pointed out have a place and are nice…. The HF ones I am using are stronger, simpler, and do the job. I actually would trust the HF design more.


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.
Chinese vs American Made.
Seems to me that $60 more might keep an American working...

 

[ramdough]

.
Chinese vs American Made.
Seems to me that $60 more might keep an American working...

Sure, but we are talking about two different products. The American 22 ton jack stands are $400 more. I am not a business that needs these stands every day. If the difference was $60, then I would have bought them. At $550, I would have made my own, but at $150 from HF, it was not worth my time.

If you want to save American jobs, vote!

Let’s get back on topic please.


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