Brake issues on a M35A2

[wsucougarx]

LOL, actually the one you want is like 1200 pages long. I'd just download what you need for right now, print it off and take it out to your truck. You can check ebay for the paper manuals. This website is an invaluable resource. I got my first truck AUG08. So far I have owned 4 of these awesome machines. This website will help you with everything and anything. One recommendation is to use the search engine on this site for anything you've got questions on. There are plenty of personal photos of guys documenting step by steps on everything ranging from bleeding brakes to replacing wheel bearings etc etc. Everyone in here to help each other out

 

[wsucougarx]

Yah, but seriously though. Because these particular trucks have sat for 5-10 years without use, you'll want to pull each hub off and replace or rebuild all the wheel cylinders. These trucks come equipt w/single brake systems. In other words, if you loose just ONE wheel cylinder you won't have brakes and that little parking brake handle next to the driver seat may slow you down a little but wont do any panic stops for you.

 

[cranetruck]

Searching the TM can be frustrating at times and the index is not any where near complete, so I wouldn't blame you for asking a specific question here.
The brake system is shown in the image below. Note how the master cylinder (MC) output is boosted by the Airpak (Air hydraulic cylinder).
The top of master cylinder is a plug, which needs to be unscrewed for access using an short open end 3/4 inch wrench. Make sure the vent line is disconnected first.
I find it best to use a small funnel and a flashlight to help in this operation. The very best way to bleed the brakes is by using pressure bleeder hooked up to the MC. Look for more on that by using the search function...
You can use DOT 3 or DOT 5, either fluid works well, but DOT 3 is a lot less expensive and available everywhere.

 

[randyscycle]

I'm going to second Chicklin's response.

When I bought my deuce, the owner told me that the low pedal and lack of stopping was just because the "brakes need to be bled."

I knew better anyway, and pulled all ten tires and six drums. What I found was that most of the wheel cylinders were locked solid. The shoes hadn't touched some of the drums in a long time. The rubber lines were all rotten. The steel lines were questionable. The fluid was a mixture of goo, and water and rust. The shoes on three of the wheels had been wet for so long the lining had deteriorated and fallen off. Oh, and most of the wheel bearings were shot anf the seals were rotten too. From the outside the truck didn't look bad and ran well. Everything got replaced or rebuilt and the system flushed and beld thoroughly.

Given that you have only a single master cylinder, and a huge question mark about the brakes, do yourself and other motorists a favor and have a look inside the wheels. You'll feel a whole lot better when you go to apply the brakes knowing they will work.

 

[Ferroequinologist]

Hello, and welcome to the site!
Many of the guys (and some girls) on here are super knowledgable, and better yet, love to help.

I agree that the best thing you could do for your truck and yourself is to purchase the hard copies of the TMs. It is soooooo much easier to take the book with you than bring the deuce inside to the computer screen...

This thread may help you as well, and show you the cap.

http://www.steelsoldiers.com/deuce/30937-brake-pressure-bleeder.html

The search isn't always perfect, but it is alot better now than it used to be.

Again, welcome!

 

[Chevytruck]

welcome to the site!

i was about to mention the pressure bleeder... LOL

 

[Wild Horse Hans]

I have to agree with everyone here. This site will help you along and everyone here is willing to help a new person and to show you how to do things right.
The manuals are the single most important purchase or download you can do. They are at times hard to find info in, but once found will guide you step by step through pretty much anything you could need to know.
Welcome to the hobby and best of luck with your new trucks!!!!
Hans

 

[poppop]

I have a Duece on blocks now with all the drums pulled. This truck had sat for a long time and the master cylinders were rusted so bad they could not be saved. I pulled the airpac last week to ckeck it. The last owner had put DOT 3 in it on top of DOT 5. I think that is why the Master was junk. The airpac looked like it had been replaced just before the truck was surplused and cleaned up nice. I re-used all parts and will not know if it leaks until I finish. The wheel cylinders appeared to still have DOT 5 in them and were cruded up but cleaned up well with the hone. I rebuilt each wheel cylinder with kits from ODIRON and re-installed. I am waiting on new wheel seals to finish the job. If your truck sat for a long time you really need to go thru the whole system and freshen it up. Make sure the adjusters are free while you have the drums off. I am going to use DOT 3 in this truck because it will become a farm truck and DOT 3 is much cheaper. The two kinds are not compatable so now is a good time to make the switch. the Government used DOT 5 because it does not mix with water. Since many of these trucks would sit for long periods of time between uses that protected the componets from rust. On a truck used on a regular basis it is not so important.

 

[m16ty]

It is air over hydraulics.

A deuce dosen't have air over hyd brakes. It's air assisted hyd. A deuce works just like any other hyd brake system other than it has a air booster to help with the brakes where most vehicles use a vaccume or hyd booster.

 

[Mt Doom Field Owner]

I am a new M35A2 (71 model) owner having picked one up from a fellow forum member that is in very good condition only needing one leaking wheel cylinder to be replaced. I ordered and received a new cylinger for $35 from Memphis Equipment online and got it next day (Memphis to Cullman Alabama). I have a truck shop here that says it's a piece of cake to replace the cylinder and their mechanic apparently has spent some time under Dueces in his past ... I want to ask you fellow members what it should approximately cost to have a wheel cylinder (rear back set of wheels, passenger side) replaced? I know it can vary from job to job, state to state but if you have had this job done or have done it yourself, about how long (hours) did it take and what would be a reasonable price for the job? I have not gotten a quote yet but want to be braced for it or to say... HECK NO! $$$$$$ I won't pay that much!!!! or hopefully I will find myself saying... "YOU THE MAN!! Get on with the job!"
Thanks for your honest imput. If this is all I have to have done right away I will consider myself REALLY lucky!!! Mt. Doom Fieldowner

 

[doghead]

I would expect to pay for 3-4 hours labor(minimum) and supplies of course(dot5).

Up here that would be about a $250-$300 bill, I would guess.


I would be sure to offer the TM info to them also, they need to know about sealing the key way. Also a good time to repack the bearings while its apart, and even change out the 2 seals.

 

[G-Force]

And seriously think about doing the rest of your wheel cylinders.......just for peace of mind. if one was leaking usually the rest won't be far behind.

 

[poppop]

A shop with the right tools to work on large trucks should be able to do the job in less than two hours. Really probably only an hour. You don't have to remove the wheels from the hub. Take off spindle nuts and with wheels on wheel dolly roll wheels out. Remove shoes and bad cylinder, clean as needed, replce cylinder and shoes, repack bearings, roll wheels back in place and secure. You may want to replace the seals while it is apart. I recently learned that these trucks are different from most large trucks in that there lube is from grease instead of gear oil from the diffs. Other trucks have one seal that keep the oil in and off the shoes. These trucks have two seals that keep the oil away from the bearings. Also when the nuts are replaceed you need to seal the keyway on the spindle with RTV silicone to keep oil from entering there.

 

[dittle]

1 hour tops for the work. You can have the axels and wheels/hubs off and back on in 15 minutes. After that its 2 bolts to remove the cylinders and 1 threaded connection for the line. Bleeding will take as long to do as replacing the cylinder.

 

[doghead]

You speedy guys need to remember he has a leaking wheel cylinder. It will take time to clean everything up also. A good thorough job cannot be done in an hour.

 

[olly69]

Hey guys, I bought a Deuce about a year ago, and replaced a leaky wheel cyl. on the rear axle. I replaced it with a new one, added the aux. resevoir, bled the brakes and she worked.
This summer the pedal went to the floor again#@! What I found out is that I hadn't tightened the nut where the brake line enters the wheel cylinder on the back. Easy fix, just tighten it, right, add fluid and bleed again. Well the truck stops fine, but when I checked the front brakes, there was no fluid coming out the bleeders? How is that possible? Any ideas?

 

[gimpyrobb]

The soft lines can go bad and swell shut. I'd start there.

 

[18operator]

I've had the soft lines swell shut on my pick-up. When I did the wheel cylinders on my Deuce, I took some clean mig welding wire .030" and gently thread it into the flexible lines. Measure the line then measure the amount of wire threaded into it. If it matches or is longer than the soft line, that particular line is free of obstruction. Might be a bizarre way to check, but it worked for me. If you have any doubts, replace the line. Better safe than sorry.

 

[Big Dumb Truck]

If your brakes are out of adjustment, you will get very little fluid out of the bleeder.
It's not a bad idea to pull a front wheel and drum and have someone push the break pedal for you while you watch the break pads for movement. That will definitely let you know where you stand.

 

[gimpyrobb]

If you do that, tie a rope around the pads!