CDL required to drive 5 ton?

[quickfarms]

This should be a forum topic by itself it comes up so much. Commercial Driver's License CDL. Think about it or search for one of my many responses from years past. Some states (California) have different classes of private driver's licenses but if you are not operating commercially you do not need a CDL.

California non commercial liscenses are for RV's.

The real issue is if you are driving out of class the LEO can and will have your vehicle towed and impounded. Arguing with a LEO is a recipe for getting a ticket. The cost for the tow and impound could be as much as school to get your CDL.

 

[rickf]

I have a CDL A with all the endorsements except hazmat and that one is a nightmare I do not want. I keep it for the main reason that I already had it for when I did drive commercially. Couple things to keep in mind. EXPENSIVE!!! Mine is 150.00 plus for three years, at least that was two years ago. You guys that drink................ the breathalyzer is .02! That is countrywide. Does not matter if you are driving a commercial vehicle or not, if you have a CDL then you have to abide by the DUI laws for a CDL. Most of the people I know that is one beer in an hour for a 200 lb. person will put you on the limit. Two will definitely put you over.

Rick

 

[ntxcop]

Since the thread is here, I thought I'd list the TEXAS requirements in the thread for anyone from the LONE STAR STATE that may read this.

If you live in another state, I can't tell you how/what is required, but if you're reading this thread and live in TEXAS, this is for you:

In TEXAS, the driver's license requirement is determined by the GVWR of the vehicle you're driving. It's covered in the Texas Transportation Code (Texas Transportation Code 521.081, 521.082, and 521,083). The GVWR is determined by the weight of the vehicle plus the weight of the maximum load the vehicle can carry or pull.

In TEXAS, the standard driver's license is a CLASS C driver's license. The CLASS C driver's license allows you to drive a vehicle with a GVWR up to 26,000 lbs (25,999 or less).

A CLASS B driver's license allows you to drive a vehicle with a GVWR of 26,000 lbs or more, PLUS carry a load or pull a trailer that weighs up to 10,000 lbs (9,999 lbs). (25,999 lbs + up to 10,000 lbs cargo (9,999 lbs) equals 35,998 lbs total).

A Class A allows you to drive a vehicle with GVWR of 26,000 or more PLUS carry a load or pull a trailer that weighs 10,000 lbs or more. (36,000 lbs or MORE total)

SO, in TEXAS, if you want to drive an M923 5-Ton CARGO truck, which weighs 22,000 lbs and can carry (+) 10,000 lbs of cargo, (=) 32,000 lbs which is MORE than 26,000 lbs, and less than 36,000 lbs, you will need a CLASS B driver's license.


Clear as mud....

NOW, having been a police officer for 13 years, I can tell you, I've never ONCE asked what the GVWR was of a vehicle. BUT, we have Commercial Vehicle Officers that DO ask those type of questions, not to mention Texas State Troopers, that ALSO ask those questions. SO, you can chance it if you want, and you may even get by if a patrol officer in a big city stops you. BUT, if a Commercial Vehicle Officer, or State Trooper stops you, you're looking at a BIG fine. I just bought a 5 Ton two weeks ago, and had it pulled to my driveway. I'm studying now for my Class B driver's license and will get it BEFORE I drive my truck.

It's your call......

 

[jonesal]

Other considerations:

1) What do you do if you cross state lines to a state that requires a CDL and you don't have one? BIG trouble. Well, if you get caught of course.

2) No one has mentioned IFTA licenses. This discussion gets even more dizzying. Isn't it true that some states require IFTA stickers IF you have a CDL and cross state lines (automatic)? If you don't have a CDL and go to a state that requires CDL AND IFTA, and you don't have them, BIGGER trouble?

3) I think a CDL is a good credential (that hopefully shows a minimum level of competency) to have.

In SD, no CDL needed for 5 ton. If I have my CDL, IFTA is automatic if I cross state lines... But I'm at the mercy of other state laws if I don't have a CDL and I go to the in-laws in Colorado to pick up some personal items.

Al Jones
'84 M932

 

[rickf]

IFTA should only come into play if you are hauling freight commercially.
Anything that falls under ICC jurisdiction.

 

[juanprado]

Louisiana CDL Requirements

Louisiana is similar to Texas and based on weight:

Legalize below:

DEFINITIONS & AGE REQUIREMENTS
The class of driver's license needed depends on the kind of vehicle being driven. Drivers may also be required to have appropriate endorsement(s) on their Commercial Driver's License.

R.S. 32:408 B.(2)(a) and 405.1:
Class A Commercial Driver's License - Combination Vehicles
Age Requirements: 18 years or above for intrastate and 21 years or above for interstate.
Permits the operation of all vehicles within Classes B, C, D, and E, with any appropriate endorsements and any combination of vehicles with a gross combination weight rating of 26,001 pounds or more, provided that the gross vehicle weight rating of the vehicle or vehicles being towed is in excess of 10, 000 pounds.

• If the pulling unit of the combination vehicle is 26,000 pounds or less, a restriction (55 - No 18-wheelers) must be added to the license.
• If vehicle being towed has a GVWR of 10,000 pounds or less, it is not taken into consideration.

R.S. 32:408 B.(2)(b) and 405.1:
Class B Commercial Driver's License - Heavy Straight Vehicle
Age Requirements: 18 years or above for intrastate and 21 years or above for interstate.
Permits the operation of any vehicle within Classes C, D, and E, with any appropriate endorsement(s) plus any single vehicle with a gross vehicle weight rating of twenty-six thousand and one or more pounds. A "straight vehicle" is defined for the purpose of this class as being one that does not bend or have a moveable joint in its frame between the driver seat and the cargo or passenger compartment.

R.S. 32:408 B.(2)(c) and 405.1:
Class C Commercial Driver's License - Light Vehicle
Age Requirements: 18 years or above for intrastate and 21 years or above for interstate.
Permits the operation of any vehicle within Classes D and E, with any appropriate endorsement(s), plus any single vehicle less than 26,001 pounds GVWR.
This group includes vehicles designed to transport 16 or more passengers, including the driver, and which are not within the definition of a Group A or B vehicle, and vehicles used in the transportation of placarded amounts of hazardous materials.

Special Note for Commercial Driver's Licenses
R.S. 32:408 (3)
Applicable Endorsements:
"T" Double/Triple Trailers
"P" Passenger
"N" Tank Vehicles
"H" Hazardous Materials * (issued only to persons 21 years of age or above)*
"X" Combination Tank Vehicles and Hazardous Materials
"M" Motorcycle
"S" School Bus

R.S. 32:408 B. (2)(d) and 405.1:
Class "D" Chauffeurs Driver's License
Age Requirements: 17 years or above.
Permits the operation of all vehicles included in Class E plus any single motor vehicle used in commerce to transport passengers or property if the motor vehicle has a gross vehicle weight rating of 10,001 or more pounds but less than 26,001 pounds, or any combination of vehicles used in commerce to transport passengers or property if the vehicle has a combined vehicle weight rating of 10,001 or more pounds but less than 26,001 pounds (inclusive of a towed unit with a gross vehicle weight rating of more than 10,000 pounds); or any vehicle designed or utilized for the transportation of passengers for hire or fee; and not utilized in the transportation of materials found to be hazardous under the provisions of the Hazardous Materials Transportation Act which requires the vehicle to bear a placard under the provision of Hazardous Materials Regulations (49 CFR Part 172, Subpart F).

NOTE: As long as the combined gross vehicle weight rating (truck and trailer) is less than 26,001 pounds you can operate with Class D.

Webpage:
CLASSES OF LICENSE AND AGE REQUIREMENTS

 

[BigWill1985]

To be honest with you guys, I don't really see the issue with getting a CDL. Yes, it's a small hassle, but it's honestly not that tough. I started the process to get my Class B CDL this past week. Took a 50 question exam (with ~10mins study time right before taking it, as I didn't even have the book to look at before then), and I passed it with flying colors. Now, just a 30 day wait followed by a pre-drive inspection and driving test. Only cost me $3 for the exam/permit, and a little of my time.

I figure it'll keep me out of trouble in the long run by not even having to waste my time explain the arguments above.

~Will Courtier~

 

[DeuceNewb]

so after research and seeing the replies here, I will need a class A regular license because the main reason for me getting the 5ton is to bob it and then use it to tow my boat. If I didn't have to tow my boat (10,500lbs on trailer without fuel) then i would just be getting a class B.

 

[Goose2448]

Everyone should be required to get a CDL if you are driving anything bigger than shoes. The Reg driving test is a freaking joke. I have my Class A, no airbrakes or class 8 trucks(I took the test in a Chevy 3500 and 20K Gooseneck). Its not hard if your not brain dead. Also remember if your GVW is over 26,001 pounds even if your trailer is 500 pounds, you need a Class A. My rule is no beer in the truck period. I dont drink(not even old enough) but most of the guys I work with do. Now if you were to go out of state, then they would have to recognize your states laws on this. But if you have a CDL, its all the same nation wide. Its like here in Florida all you need to drive one of those diesel pusher RV's with air brakes is a Class E(reg) lic. They did that because all the blue hairs complained. Last point, if your boat weighs more then 10K, you need a CDL to tow that, or a non CDL class A if your state has that.

 

[rickf]

10,500 lb. boat. That is one big boat to trailer!

Rick

 

[Dukeman]

Yeah, I want to see a picture of the boat. MV's and boats, oh yeah!

 

[sanmigmike]

Use to fly with a FA that was from a farm family. Told me that in California she drove tractor trailer rigs (if I used the wrong terms forgive me, I was a pilot not a truck driver) including two trailers with a basic driver's license. Since it was not for hire, and only doing work with it associated with the farm she didn't need one and never had any problems. Of course looking back she wishes that she had got a CDL for the simple you never know when you might need one...

 

[sanmigmike]

A good point poppo- a Farmer is a commercial driver- in other words he is driving for a (his) business.

The bottom is to find the exemptions in your state regarding CDL. Keep a copy of those with you- IF they are applicable to you. When you travel to another state- you are obligated to find out their regulations.

I choose NOT to have a CDL, and am very careful to NOT ENGAGE in anything "Commercial". I don't know nor care what anybody else does, but that's what I do.

Okay I read your point but...doing something for hire is different than doing something that is incidental to your business. If driving as part of work would require a CDL then all those pizza guys would need a CDL or almost any salesman. Now in flying there is a giant difference between airline flying and hauling people around for a corporation. As a retired airline pilot I got to see the FAA a lot. Rode with us a lot. Saw them at airports a lot. Our rules were a lot different from the guys flying business jets or any sort of business aircraft since while the pilots needed commercial tickets (for the simple reason they were being paid to fly...not the type of flying they were doing) since the business aircraft was not usually "For hire". It was considered incident to the business...not the reason for the business. So a friend of mine that has done that type of work for years has never had a Fed on board...no line checks, no route checks and I don't seem to recall him ever getting a ramp check. Mercifully flying is pretty much a Fed problem so you don't have to deal with 50+ sets of rules. Of course the lack of Fed attention to corporate aviation might be part of the reason for the difference in accident rates? In the case of the farmer...his business is farming, not hauling stuff. Any hauling he would do that would not require a CDL would be directly related to his or her farming. Hauling his stuff or picking up stuff for his farm but not hauling for others and of course getting paid for doing the hauling for others would be the real deal breaker. I see the point that having a CDL could lead to more problems with you being required to have a CDL and paperwork that might come with a commercial operation versus just driving your rig to a show across a state line like a motor home... The paperwork required for a Part 91 General Aviation flight is a lot different and a lot less than for a Part 135 or Part 121 flight including a lot more on the crew so if you could avoid that it would not be a bad idea in my mind. I've found the FAA caught more people in pencil problems than real problems since finding a paperwork error is a lot easier than finding so many other types of problems. One of the terms we used to use was "pencil whipping" sure it isn't unique to the airline biz.

 

[ryan77]

In Illinois you need a class b cdl with air brakes! Thats what the guy at the dmv told me! I took the class b written and the air brake endorsement test. I have the permit now i have to take the driving portion! Its not that hard to get and is only $60.00. Better safe then sorry!!

 

[Rkrug]

I drive my M923 with out a CDL (registered as a farm truck)but plan on getting one as soon as I can.

 

[Rkrug]

Trucks work grate for pulling boats! here is a picture of the 923 pulling my dads sailboat.

 

[commandojeff]

When you have a CDL, you instantly put yourself at a higher risk. When you get a simple traffic ticket, even in your everyday driver, you must get it fixed or risk losing your CDL. This could cause you problems in the future if you ever had to get a job that required one. Not to mention any sort of DWI. You will lose it immediately. Could cost you a lot more money than what it costs to get the CDL in the first place. If you don't NEED it, don't get it. You should also know that the amount of points added to your license for an offense is sometimes double that if you don't have one.

Sure you are showing the officer that you are "experienced". But you are held at a higher responsibility and you will be punished worse. Just some things everyone might want to consider before feverishly getting your CDL.

 

[Tow4]

Florida follows the federal standards and does require a CDL for trucks with GVWR as specified in the statute. What we need to remember is the GVWR is what the truck is rated for, not what you have it tagged for. A 5 ton of any type is capable of more than 26,000 lbs GVWR, and in Florida would require a CDL A or B depending on the vehicle unless it's tagged as an RV.

I agree that most of us with historically tagged vehicles can get by without the CDL if our state requires one unless we run into picky LEO. You might get a ticket; hopefully they would let you call your buddy with a CDL to drive your truck home. I would worry about having an accident and THEN getting a ticket for improper/no license (maybe a LEO can chime in and tell us what type of ticket that would be). I'm sure your insurance company would waste no time trying to get out of paying the claim.

 

[zebedee]

Factually Jeff, I quite agree with your statements.. However I like to look at it a little differently.

Personally, I see the voluntary aquisition of a CDL as the striving to better ones self. Being held to a higher standard is the result or even reward of putting in a greater effort.
Why should I want to "get off" lighter when I commit a driving offence if I was at fault. Don't break the law and there won't be the punishment.

Professional drivers have to have a CDL inorder to do their job. They do see themselves as better drivers and talk down to and about "four wheelers" who are often the cause of many a 'truck involved' accident even though it was not the truck drivers fault - however due to the higher standard expected, it is often taken that if they weren't there then they wouldn't have been involved.

My CDL is not necessary - in NY a historic vehicle - any weight, with or without air breaks, that is not used COMMERCIALLY, does not need a CDL. But when I am driving my car I try to do so in a 'professional' manner. Yes, there are times when I should be paying more attention and d@mn glad that I wasn't in my 36000# "toy" or else the situation would not be pretty, but I'd like to think that those times are few and far between and getting rarer.

Motorcyclists are at a greater exposure whilst riding than car drivers, so they too have to drive better to avoid 'others' that will harm them even though they themselves, in their steel cage, would not be hurt. and yes I have that licence too.

Many years ago I took and passed the Advanced Driving Test in the UK - 100% voluntary and is like comparing getting a doctorate to the SAT's. My choice, my right and yes, it heaps a load more responcibility on my shoulders.

Your points are very valid and true, however if a potential CDL test taker is not doing it for the right reasons - read 'professionalism' or needing it for work or a personal life goal then don't do it - it will cost you a lot, not just $s if you mess up. I would rather the ill intentioned not buy a big toy if they can't act responcibly. Heck, I'd rather all the purple rinces have to have a CDL(re named "Large Vehicle Licence") to drive a whopping great RV!

It's almost the same as joining the Marines and not accepting the fact that you may well get shot at!

This is my opinion, I am not dismissing yours, just putting out the potential 'other side' of the coin for a healthy debate for those that may not have thought things through thoroughly......

"Keep it green (or khaki) and keep it safe"

 

[commandojeff]

zebedee - I totally agree as well. I was posting that because I don't think anyone else here has posted something about it. I merely wanted to produce an open mind in others. I do not need a CDL in MO as long as I'm not using it for commercial purposes. I choose not to, but that doesn't mean I am unsafe in the truck. I check over everything before I drive it. I always slow down and test my brakes before I have to stop just to give me extra time if I needed to make an emergency stop. I like to perform professionally and reflect a positive image of military vehicles to the public. I have been doing so for a long time without any problems. The LEO in my area usually just wave as we drive by.

Like you said, those RV drivers are scary... Same goes for some people renting large moving trucks to move to a different home. If you have never driven a truck that big, why would you put your entire goods from your house (that might be very expensive) and drive on the road like everything is normal? I have been cutoff many times by careless large vehicle operators and it is very scary. I highly doubt anyone that has been on here for some time would do that. There is no time for a cell phone in those situations. I steer clear of those large vehicles. That's why you don't get cutoff constantly by truckers, because they are professionals!

That was a little bit of ranting on my part. The way I look at the CDL thing is this. If you feel safer with one and want to get one, then get one. There is nothing you can read online that should influence your decision. The more comfortable you are the better.

Jeff