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Detroit Lockers

my69camaro

Member
82
4
8
Location
La Porte Indiana
I run my deuces for hours on end at redline without issue. From what I've seen they are tractor motors and designed to run all day under load... Now that being said operator error can total mess stuff up, you downshift and wrap the thing up to 3,200rpm I can see a problem there..


I let my truck warm up, cool down, and try to start it as little as possible. I'd rather let it idle 15min here and 30min there rather that constant shutdowns and refires.

YMMV....

Now some people will tell you if your truck hits 2,700rpm for more that a few seconds your rods will exit the block, your dog will die, and complain that you shouldn't be trying to go so fast anyway. ;-)
 
How many splines are on the shafts for a deuce? I bought this huge detroit locker with 40 splines off ebay last year for a mere $79. The guy said it had 35 splines, so I thought it might work on a 14 bolt I had laying around out of a '78 K20. Now I have this huge paperweight that I am hoping to turn into gold...
I've recently bought 4 deuces, but still waiting on the EUC to return from limbo @ BC, and I also have an XM813. Anyone know the spline count on those axles?
 

kc5mzd

Member
481
1
16
Location
Texas
I wouldn't plan on running a multifuel over 2000 rpm for any extended time. The trucks have "max speed 35" painted on the dash for a reason. I would not drive an m35 I plan on keeping over 45 - 50 mph on the freeway. Most of the people saying to run them at their redline have the resources to deal with a thrown rod. There is a very big difference between redlining and running at WOT all day.
 

kc5mzd

Member
481
1
16
Location
Texas
Oh yeah on the lockers, If you are planning to drive on asphalt covered with ice and snow I would not get a locker. If I did get a locker I would put it in front and drive with axle disengaged as long as I was on asphalt. When a locker spins on ice you will end up in a ditch. Hopefully with a locker you will be able to get back out - unless there was something between you and the ditch...
 

LanceRobson

Well-known member
1,638
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Location
Pinnacle, Stokes County, NC
There is a lot of god info in this thread and some varied opinions.

The 35 MPH max speed deal was a unit choice and was probably driven by local road conditions (think unpaved tank trails at Camp Swampy) or accident history and was not a service wide policy.

Most major commands used a 50 MPH max speed as a matter of policy or regulation. This was not usually a safety issue. It was done to allow some "catch up speed" for the inevitable times when the convoy did the accordion thing. If the unit march speed was at or near the redline, no one could catch up without over speeding the engine or breaking the then 55 MPH national speed limit.

As already stated the engine was originally designed for agricultural use and will tolerate working at the red line for extended periods very well. However, that assumes the valves are correctly adjusted, the cooling system is properly maintained, the injector timing, air filter, oil system, fuel filters and fuel system are all correct etc. If you and the truck are new to each other, how do you know?

I have no issue with running the rucks for an extended time at or near the red line but I have spent the last 34 years around them. Especially for someone without a good bit of experience with these trucks and with the particular truck they are driving I would not advise pushing it that hard.

The military services select and train operators, not drivers. The distinction is important. We should be operating the truck, not just driving it. The sounds, smells and vibrations coupled with our personal knowledge of the particular truck will tell us more and give us far more information or warning of impending issues, than the gauges will.

I'd recommend a couple of hours of moderate speed operation with frequent checks (per the Operators Manual's checklist) before pushing the truck hard.

If you show up at the vehicle location, perform some checks, jump in it and drive without stops you are asking for trouble. Typical issues that won't show up when the truck is stationary are things like bad bearings, rear main seal leaks, air compressor leaks, flat spots in belts that turn into cord ruptures etc. If the truck is new to you I'd recommend a stop within 10 minutes to check wheel bearings, tire inflation, lug nuts and the rest of the truck and then stop every hour until you are really comfortable with the truck's running condition.

Lastly, consider these two facts.

All of the MVs currently available to us as collectors were desinged when either road conditions or the national speed limit kept vehicle speed lower than today. The wheels, tires, brakes and steering were all designed for lower speeds.

The stopping distance of an unloaded truck is often longer than the stopping distance of a loaded truck. The brakes are designed to stop it loaded and if you hit them hard when it's empty you dramatically increase the probability of locking the brakes and loosing control. This is one of the things stressed in heavy vehicle operator training. When most of the vehicles around you can stop in a much shorter distance than you can it really increases the chance of you parking on a car.

Lance
 

mark salanco

New member
Steel Soldiers Supporter
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Location
greenville sc
I took my bobbed duce on a 2,000 mile road trip last september, had no trouble at all, but i did keep the RPMs down around 2200-2400. I do have the micheline XML 395/85/R20s on it, so my speed was about 55-57mph. Gonna do the trip again this fall.
 

mark salanco

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greenville sc
The biger tires that i run on my truck give me about 14% more speed in 5th gear than a stock size tire, so if your running a stock size tire at 48mph thats equivelent to 54mph at the same RPM on my truck..sounds about right.
 

Darwin T

Active member
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Location
Port Arthur, Texas
Thanks Broman. I appreciate the feedback. I did a search and didn't find quite what I was looking for. I'm considering my options for getting an M35 home. I would prefer to drive it rather than ship it. I just didn't know if driving it on the open road would cause a catastophic failure.
i can't say it won't fail, but, a 2,000 mile fuel bill would scare me. my frist deuce (M109a3) 273 mile trip (tip #1 don't trust fuel gauge). my second deuce (M35a2) 855 mile trip GA to TX (trip #2 spring seat not box seat). my third deuce (M35a2) 421 mile trip in the duece (trip #3 don't drive rental car 300 miles to pick up deuce and drive deuce 421 miles home in the same day). but by all means get you a steel soldier or 12.
 

Darwin T

Active member
1,185
10
38
Location
Port Arthur, Texas
around 51 to 53 MPH is where mine like to cruise. from GA to TX i passed 2 trucks. both were dullies pulling trailers and were loaded past the max. 19.5 hours of A$$ numbing drive time only stopping for fuel and at night. once you get your truck and get use to it, if yo can't get in it and drive it anywhere, sell it and get you one that you can. if it won't get you there it is no good.
 

HammerBilt

New member
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Location
VA
I realize this is an old thread (and the original poster has probably already made a decision regarding locker selection) but while there was a lot of info on speed and reliability not a lot was said about the lockers.
The stock "Open" differential is designed to allow both tires to turn freely while going around a curve. In this situation the tire on the outside of the curve is covering more distance than the inner and thusly is going faster. If power is applied while in a curve that power goes to the tire with the least traction (the outer) and all is well generally. A locker can perform like an open differential (allowing different wheel speeds through a turn) provided that no power is being applied. In this event a bit of chatter might be heard but is generally minimal and not a lot to worry about. On the otherhand when power is applied the locker does its job and ties both axlehafts together giving equal power to both axles. If this is done while the vehicle is travelling in a straight line or offroad this is again usually not a concern and is in fact the reason to have a locker. Both wheels have full power not just the one with the least traction (as with the open differential). However in a turn if power is applied both axles will go from having different speeds to the same suddenly. This often causes the inner wheel to spin, and lose traction. This in turn can cause the rear of the vehicle to "walk" to the side or in a worst case scenario cause the vehicle to spinout. The low traction environment of a snow or ice covered road makes this more likely. The best way to avoid this is to take your foot off the pedal before entering a turn and not reapplying until after the vehicle is going straight again. Detroit style lockers are considered "automatic" lockers because they automatically perfrom as described above all the time, automatically. Selectable lockers such as the ARB Airlocker can operate as a fully open differential or a full locker with the press of a button. The advantage of the automatic is its simplicity (not a whole lot can go wrong with it) and its ruggedness. The selectables' advantage is that the operator decides how he/she wants it to operate. It downside is its usually higher price and more complicated design means it may prove less rugged. A lose of air pressure renders it an open differential. Hope this helps. Even knowing all this I'm still not sure which way I'm going. Maybe a combo of both.
 

Karl kostman

Well-known member
Steel Soldiers Supporter
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Fargo ND
This has turned into a GOOD thread, I will add my two cents here also, I run my Deuce down the highway at 2000 to 2200 RPM in down shifting I try to never let it exceed 2300 RPM max, at that RPM my cruise speed is from 48 to 50 MPH wiht stock wheels/tires and I have no problem with that. As far as lockers go I wouls start with tires and if you get really serious single out the duals and put all more appropriate tires. I live in ND and yes we do get snow here, I run stock NDTs and have stock duals on the truck, I just drop the air pressure in the reas down to 20 psi in the winter, its still not the absolute greatest answer but it sure helps a lot, lockers would be nice at times but just done know enough about them to help you there
KK
 

chestypuller1371

New member
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Location
Butte Alaska
im going to get lockers for all axles. probably do 2 arbs and a detroit, might just do 3 arbs one each year for 3 years make it affordable. i have run arb and detroit combo front arb and detroit rear or welded on my offroad trucks for years, and thats the cats mmeow as long as you maintain your air line to arb... ive also ran detroit front and rear on a street truck. you have to be careful on ice with all detroits as if you floor it the whole vehicle goes to the right.
 

rustystud

Well-known member
9,280
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Location
Woodinville, Washington
im going to get lockers for all axles. probably do 2 arbs and a detroit, might just do 3 arbs one each year for 3 years make it affordable. i have run arb and detroit combo front arb and detroit rear or welded on my offroad trucks for years, and thats the cats mmeow as long as you maintain your air line to arb... ive also ran detroit front and rear on a street truck. you have to be careful on ice with all detroits as if you floor it the whole vehicle goes to the right.
Agree ! ARB lockers are the way to go with a deuce. The rear axles are already squirrely when turning corners. So why add trouble with Detroit Lockers .
 

Colibri

New member
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0
0
Location
Conroe,Texas
Reviving an old thread here, I got my m35a2 a few months ago and had Detroit lockers installed in both rears. It is a real bear to drive on paved roads that are anything but straight and turning corners/intersections are down right difficult. If I had to drive this thing anywhere snow or ice was a reality the rear auto lockers would have been a huge mistake. Off-road I've loved it, it spends most of its life on rutted out dirt roads through steep hills and it climbs them without ever breaking a sweat. Going to do an arb up front soon.
 

HanksDeuce

Well-known member
1,081
242
63
Location
Prairieville, LA
Couldn't you just buy a pair of lockout hubs and free up the binding of the detroit lockers from the rear? Not sure where you would put both of them. One on alternating sides of each rear axle (middle axle driver side, rear axle pass side)? Or for gas mileage both on the middle axle? :D
 
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