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Deuce bumper illegal in CT

ke5eua

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You are comparing passenger cars to heavy trucks even the humvee is over the 1 ton size that starts to separate the classes and the larger vehicles much more discretion and time on the additional safety features before they are mandatory.

The hmmvw is still in the class 3 weight standard.

The hmmvw is essentially a gm 3500 short bed.

My comment still stands, no military vehicle will meet a minimum federal standard set for class 1 to class 8 vehicles.

The lights automatically disqualify it for meeting it.
 

renodogs

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Reno, Nevada
The hmmvw is still in the class 3 weight standard.

The hmmvw is essentially a gm 3500 short bed.

My comment still stands, no military vehicle will meet a minimum federal standard set for class 1 to class 8 vehicles.

The lights automatically disqualify it for meeting it.
==================
Sorry brother, but you're going down a road with a dead end on this one. If you're right, you'd better tell everyone on here that their vehicle is illegal to run on the road (as built). I'm sure you'll be very popular in your zeal.

So let me mention this to you: if you were in front of me while I was on traffic patrol, do you really think I'd activate my emergency light bar to pull you over to inspect your MV for the lack of airbags, blackout light system, backup lights? Or would I follow you long enough to get enough RS to pull you over to compliment you on your rig?

That's right, the latter.
 

ke5eua

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==================
Sorry brother, but you're going down a road with a dead end on this one. If you're right, you'd better tell everyone on here that their vehicle is illegal to run on the road (as built). I'm sure you'll be very popular in your zeal.

So let me mention this to you: if you were in front of me while I was on traffic patrol, do you really think I'd activate my emergency light bar to pull you over to inspect your MV for the lack of airbags, blackout light system, backup lights? Or would I follow you long enough to get enough RS to pull you over to compliment you on your rig?

That's right, the latter.

I agree with you 100%

That is why mv's don't comply from inception, they weren't intended to be put on the highway in the beginning. They were a specialty build with exemptions.

I would imagine you would pull me over if I forgot to put my service lights on just light you would pull over any passenger car that didn't have brake lights.

Can we just agree to disagree on this one.

It's like a nascar race, nothing but going in circles.
 

EO2NMCB

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DeSoto, MO
Not true, take the m916 for instance its a 6x6 Freightliner that has a few things added on. It meets all safety spec's for a class 8 truck. The mfg's just started putting airbags in class 8 trucks in just the last few years. The CUCV's would meet safety standards at time of mfg. Ya can't just throw out blanket statements, that ALL military vehicles don't meet spec's.
 
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ke5eua

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Not true, take the m916 for instance its a 6x6 Freightliner that has a few things added on. It meets all safety spec's for a class 8 truck. The mfg's just started putting airbags in class 8 trucks in just the last few years. The CUCV's would meet safety standards at time of mfg. Ya can't just throw out blanket statements, that ALL military vehicles don't meet spec's.
The minute you add the ability to disconnect full power to all safety warning lights, no longer meets it.

Look I'm done on this. The one who originally made the statement hasn't even spoken up, and here I am defending it.

I'm not in law enforcement, just fire fighting, hold a cdl, and spent my time in the army.
 

tim292stro

Well-known member
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S.F. Bay Area/California
Renodogs, I think a point you are missing here is that the US Government via the US military originally fielded these trucks, not state government, and not a private party. There are exceptions at the Federal level (read as "act of Congress") for military vehicles as operated for the purposes of the federal government and under the Military, which meet military functional requirements and requirements for use in countries other than ours. This exception goes away once the vehicle is released from the ownership of the US Government, unless there is a specific exception on the books with a state (to date, I am not aware of an exception at the federal level). This is similar to the EPA emissions exceptions for federal vehicles that people frequently complained about the double-standard for (this article is just an example of many like it). You can whine about it all you want and demand the documentation that the poster before you show documentation to their case, but this forum is only a place of shared love of military vehicles and personal opinions - doesn't do much good in a court of law.

If you are street-ing a truck that does not meet FMVSS or state regulations (even for the year it was built), and you get pulled over or fail to pass a safety inspection - just remember, YOU as a private owner (even if you're active in the military) don't have a special exception from Congress to run your truck on the road (unless you ARE in the military AND actively conducting military business). If the DMV for the state you are registering your truck in shows you a law that says that YOU must modify your vehicle after the fact if it doesn't meet a criteria (as the CT law the earlier posted submitted DOES), and the DMV person actually shows you the law on the books in printed text, I would expect one of two things: 1) No registration if it doesn't meet the criteria, or 2) YOU modify your truck to meet the standard and then get your valid registration. This is the same reason I backed down from wanting to install USS Cobra MRAP seats in my CUCV project - yes they are used in trucks that the US Military runs on the road currently (again under a Congressional exception), but the 5-point seat-belts built into the seats don't meet the CFR code for street-legal vehicles (the shoulder belt meets the lap belt within 6" of the torso center line, a release that twists instead of a single push-button with the word "PRESS" on it to release the belt, and there are more than one hole for a tab to insert into a buckle). Until I succeed in getting the Federal regulations amended to allow for what I and thousands of racers consider an improved safety device than a single shoulder belt - I plan on accommodating the existing laws on the books. This is the same reason I am setting up the wiring so that I cannot black-out the lighting using the blackout light switch unless I specifically remove a jumper block under the hood - the practical equivalent of removing a fuse or a lightbulb - to avoid the possibility of being cited for running a vehicle where the lights can be disabled from the cab.

I'd like you to separate this in your mind from an LEO recognizing a military vehicle on the road, appreciating it for what it is and the nice person you are, and electing to not inspect and enforce laws - and not having an LEO who just found out her husband was sleeping with her brother, throwing the book at you, and impounding your ride in the middle of the desert. Personally it is my opinion that extra caution should be exercised by all on this forum so that we can continue to have our hobby - people who want everyone else to not have military vehicles don't just stop thinking that when a neighbor's truck gets impounded, they keep building their case, because again in my opinion they have little else to do with their lives. Showing a willingness to "pick a fight" with anyone who suggested otherwise, and having a hair-trigger for wanting to litigate your position, in my opinion makes you an easy target for those who want to set you off and tie you up in courts for years at your expense (all the while saying to the clamoring reporters: "Look how aggressive he is, I don't want him to have a military weapon like a truck or tank!!!").

It's a constant threat, like a politician that loses an election by a land-slide and just doesn't get the memo that nobody but their campaign team wants them in charge of anything, and runs again next time.

[EDIT] Moderator, the original point has been resolved I believe except the follow-up from the original poster about the outcome, and I think this thread went way off-topic. Can we lock this one up in the best interest of the community? [/EDIT]
 
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acesneights1

Member
1,449
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20
Location
CT
Umm, even military vehicles today don't meet minimum safety requirements.

Where are the airbags, reinforcement in the doors for side impact?

Lights can be completely disabled, yep that doesn't meet minimum safety standards.

The military has a list of specifications that need to be meet and the lowest bidder meets them.
That is for Passenger vehicles. Trucks do not need airbags etc. Most if not all manufacturers have them now but in the early 2000's GM still did not put airbags in the 1 tons on the passenger side.
 

acesneights1

Member
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23
20
Location
CT
I have been in PM with the OP and have given him the advice he needs.If he follows it , he should be fine without any modifications.
 

ke5eua

Well-known member
2,568
41
48
Location
Baton Rouge (Central), LA
Renodogs, I think a point you are missing here is that the US Government via the US military originally fielded these trucks, not state government, and not a private party. There are exceptions at the Federal level (read as "act of Congress") for military vehicles as operated for the purposes of the federal government and under the Military, which meet military functional requirements and requirements for use in countries other than ours. This exception goes away once the vehicle is released from the ownership of the US Government, unless there is a specific exception on the books with a state (to date, I am not aware of an exception at the federal level). This is similar to the EPA emissions exceptions for federal vehicles that people frequently complained about the double-standard for (this article is just an example of many like it). You can whine about it all you want and demand the documentation that the poster before you show documentation to their case, but this forum is only a place of shared love of military vehicles and personal opinions - doesn't do much good in a court of law.

If you are street-ing a truck that does not meet FMVSS or state regulations (even for the year it was built), and you get pulled over or fail to pass a safety inspection - just remember, YOU as a private owner (even if you're active in the military) don't have a special exception from Congress to run your truck on the road (unless you ARE in the military AND actively conducting military business). If the DMV for the state you are registering your truck in shows you a law that says that YOU must modify your vehicle after the fact if it doesn't meet a criteria (as the CT law the earlier posted submitted DOES), and the DMV person actually shows you the law on the books in printed text, I would expect one of two things: 1) No registration if it doesn't meet the criteria, or 2) YOU modify your truck to meet the standard and then get your valid registration. This is the same reason I backed down from wanting to install USS Cobra MRAP seats in my CUCV project - yes they are used in trucks that the US Military runs on the road currently (again under a Congressional exception), but the 5-point seat-belts built into the seats don't meet the CFR code for street-legal vehicles (the shoulder belt meets the lap belt within 6" of the torso center line, a release that twists instead of a single push-button with the word "PRESS" on it to release the belt, and there are more than one hole for a tab to insert into a buckle). Until I succeed in getting the Federal regulations amended to allow for what I and thousands of racers consider an improved safety device than a single shoulder belt - I plan on accommodating the existing laws on the books. This is the same reason I am setting up the wiring so that I cannot black-out the lighting using the blackout light switch unless I specifically remove a jumper block under the hood - the practical equivalent of removing a fuse or a lightbulb - to avoid the possibility of being cited for running a vehicle where the lights can be disabled from the cab.

I'd like you to separate this in your mind from an LEO recognizing a military vehicle on the road, appreciating it for what it is and the nice person you are, and electing to not inspect and enforce laws - and not having an LEO who just found out her husband was sleeping with her brother, throwing the book at you, and impounding your ride in the middle of the desert. Personally it is my opinion that extra caution should be exercised by all on this forum so that we can continue to have our hobby - people who want everyone else to not have military vehicles don't just stop thinking that when a neighbor's truck gets impounded, they keep building their case, because again in my opinion they have little else to do with their lives. Showing a willingness to "pick a fight" with anyone who suggested otherwise, and having a hair-trigger for wanting to litigate your position, in my opinion makes you an easy target for those who want to set you off and tie you up in courts for years at your expense (all the while saying to the clamoring reporters: "Look how aggressive he is, I don't want him to have a military weapon like a truck or tank!!!").

It's a constant threat, like a politician that loses an election by a land-slide and just doesn't get the memo that nobody but their campaign team wants them in charge of anything, and runs again next time.

[EDIT] Moderator, the original point has been resolved I believe except the follow-up from the original poster about the outcome, and I think this thread went way off-topic. Can we lock this one up in the best interest of the community? [/EDIT]
Thank you.

+1 on locking it, it is spiraling down hill with no hopes of going back to the original topic.
 

m1010plowboy

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Bumper for big trucks

The previous owner PO of this truck had it inspected in Alberta Canada in 81'. The bumper and a few other items made it a commercially registered vehicle. If a bumper is a solution, this is an option. I don't like the look and neither do some purists however it was the right thing to do to leave it on. It's mounted in the back of the original bumpers with some heavy C-channel and gusseted up to the frame.

It's real handy for holding extra lights and this one is strong enough for pulling, not that it would ever do that.

886.JPG872.JPGP4220618.jpgmvpa jp 2012 winter 09 960.jpgmvpa jp 2012 winter 09 609.JPGmvpa jp 2012 winter 09 599.JPG

Just not sure where to mount the jet.

P2010305.jpg
 

Robo McDuff

In memorial Ron - 73M819
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In the Netherlands and I think under EU law, in general a vehicle has to fulfill the requirements at the day of first registration. That is, if you drive a 1952-type Deuce or 5-ton but your specific truck was registered in 1973 (like mine) than you have to fulfill the 1973 rules.

There are a few exceptions and the rear safeguard is one of them. Regardless date of manufacturing, you need a safe-guard bar to stop people running under your truck from the rear. There are very specific rules for, like how high the body is above the ground etc.

It was discussed when making my truck street legit. I was lucky with my M51A2 dump truck with short wheel base. I think the argument was that the end of the vehicle body is less than 75 cm (say 30") from the rear end of the rear tires. No bar needed, the tires will stop most of the car before the dump bed will hit the windscreen of the vehicle hitting me from behind. That is, unless he/she is driving way to hard; some people are beyond help.

edit: might be 50 cm, that is, 20 inch between the end of the tires and the end of the body.
 
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ke5eua

Well-known member
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Location
Baton Rouge (Central), LA
I did not ask for a smart comment I asked for the law you keep throwing up. I am a cop
Code of Federal Regulations



Title 49 - Transportation


Volume: 5Date: 2004-10-01Original Date: 2004-10-01Title: Section 571.108 - Standard No. 108; Lamps, reflective devices, and associated equipment.Context: Title 49 - Transportation. Subtitle B - Other Regulations Relating To Transportation (Continued). CHAPTER V - NATIONAL HIGHWAY TRAFFICSAFETY ADMINISTRATION, DEPARTMENTOF TRANSPORTATION. PART 571 - FEDERAL MOTOR VEHICLE SAFETY STANDARDS. Subpart B - Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standards.

http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/CFR-2004-title49-vol5/xml/CFR-2004-title49-vol5-sec571-108.xml

S3.Application. This standard applies to:(a) Passenger cars, multipurpose passenger vehicles, trucks, buses, trailers (except pole trailers and trailer converter dollies), and motorcycles;(b) Retroreflective sheeting and reflex reflectors manufactured to conform to S5.7 of this standard; and(c) Lamps, reflective devices, and associated equipment for replacement of like equipment on vehicles to which this standard applies.
S5.5Special wiring requirements.S.5.5.1Each vehicle shall have a means of switching between lower and upper beams that conforms to SAE Recommended Practice J564a Headlamp Beam Switching, April 1964 or to SAE Recommended Practice J565b, Semi-Automatic Headlamp Beam Switching Devices, February 1969. Except as provided in S5.5.8, the lower and upper beams shall not be energized simultaneously except momentarily for temporary signalling purposes or during switching between beams.S5.5.2Each vehicle shall have a means for indicating to the driver when the upper beams of the headlamps are on that conforms to SAE Recommended Practice J564a, April 1964, except that the signal color need not be red.S5.5.3 The taillamps on each vehicle shall be activated when the headlamps are activated in a steady-burning state, but need not be activated if the headlamps are activated at less than full intensity as permitted by paragraph S5.5.11(a).S5.5.4The stop lamps on each vehicle shall be activated upon application of the service brakes. The high-mounted stop lamp on each vehicle shall be activated only upon application of the service brakes.S5.5.5The vehicular hazard warning signal operating unit on each vehicle shall operate independently of the ignition or equivalent switch, and when activated, shall cause to flash simultaneously sufficient turn signal lamps to meet, as a minimum, the turn signal lamp photometric requirements of this standard.S5.5.6Each vehicle equipped with a turn signal operating unit shall also have an illuminated pilot indicator. Failure of one or more turn signal lamps to operate shall be indicated in accordance with SAE Standard J588e, Turn Signal Lamps, September 1970, except when a variable-load turn signal flasher is used on a truck, bus, or multipurpose passenger vehicle 80 or more inches in overall width, on a truck that is capable of accommodating a slide-in camper, or on any vehicle equipped to tow trailers.
Now, if I turn off the light switch the brake light will not activate upon activating the service brake.



 
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ke5eua

Well-known member
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Baton Rouge (Central), LA
Also, I'm sorry if I seem a little cross. Today has been a bad day. Had to drive an hour and to Mcomb, MS to deliver a motorcycle only to have the party call me and tell me they would be another 2-3 hours. Sitting in a wal-mart parking lot for 3 hours really puts you in a mood, then having to drive back home.

So to CSM Davis, and everybody else, I apologize. I will edit my last post, as I realize it was a little on the titter totter of bad.

For the reference above, that is the first thing that highlighted when I searched for brakes.

I'm going to go back outside, as this is how I feel right now.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-FucbvoFFy0&feature=kp
 
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Csm Davis

Well-known member
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Location
Hattiesburg, Mississippi
The minute you add the ability to disconnect full power to all safety warning lights, no longer meets it.

I'm not in law enforcement, just fire fighting, hold a cdl, and spent my time in the army.
Okay show me where that ability to switch the lights off is listed in that law. Yes you have to have lights to drive but it doesn't say you can't turn them off when of road.
 
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