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FS-2500 Bypass Oil Filter - Great Idea or Snake Oil

houdel

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Has anyone besides me noticed the four full page ads for the FS2500 Bypass Oil Filter in the latest issue of Diesel Power magazine? I perused their web site http://www.fs2500.com/ pretty thoroughly and they make some pretty impressive, if hard to believe, claims for their filter. Things like a 91% reduction in engine wear, 99% removal of particulates down to one micron in size? A Detroit Diesel OTR truck with over a half million miles, 80,000 miles on the oil and it still passes an oil analysis test? Powerstrokes with over 10K miles on the oil and it is still clear?

I'm all for extending the life of my multifuel any way I can within reason, and I have to believe that soot in the oil is the biggest source of wear. I'd seriously consider one of these if they work half as well as claimed. Does anyone on the board have any knowledge or experience to support or disprove the maker's claims? Also, the site makes no mention of price. Does anyone know how much they cost? Any and all comments graciously appreciated!
 

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devilman96

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Its the same filter as Napa's XD line (40,000 mile filters)... (IMHO)... I think they are pushing the claims a bit but a that is the theory behind synthetics period... Change the filter not the oil.
 

houdel

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Not the same at all. I believe the NAPA is an extended life full flow filter. The FS2500 is a bypass fillter wih extreme filtration. About 10% of the oil flows through the FS2500, over time all of the oil will make it through the filter. It supposedly filters to 1 micron (conventional full flow filters filter at 10 microns) so almost all particulate is removed from the filter. The maker claims 99% of particulate 1 micron and over will be removed by the FS2500, soot levels in the oil should be about 0.3% or less. In essence it is cleaning the oil to near new condition, so you are running "clean" oil all the time, or so they claim. Recommended filter cartridge change interval is 10,000 miles.
 

devilman96

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Yes... Full flow but glass and ceramic media v/s paper... There is a US Dept of Energy study on these things at... http://avt.inel.gov/pdf/oilbypass/afs_presentation2005.pdf scroll down to pages 23 24 and 25... Page 23 is the magnified oil sample on a filtration system as your asking about. Page 24 is of a standard media filter. Page 25 is of a full flow glass filter... Note the particles and note the magnifications... Not THAT big of a difference on a good quality full flow element (pages 23 and 25)...

Also scroll up and look through the results data... As where some trucks passed with flying colors on SOME of the test... But (if I am reading correctly) only one actually passed all of the expected target levels.

GM had these in testing on their Diesels a while back, I know one of the owners.... The truck was used on a plant nursery in Ft Lauderdale, FL... Nothing unusual and nothing abusive... The engine went at 40K. Chevy pulled the filtration system and dropped in a crate motor and he is still driving it today. I am a huge fan of technology and don't fight the change when it comes to these kinda things... Its a great idea but they are still yet to be perfected.
 

motorolanut

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I have heard the same claim with amsoil, just filter it through a cheese cloth and put it back in the engine..
Non the less I am a believer in semi and full synthetics. i just relgiously change the oil and filter between
3000-5000 miles depending on how hard I have run the engine.. IE towing, heavy hauling Etc.
 

houdel

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Bjorn is, as always, 100% correct, preventative maintanance is an absolute requirement. As for the US DOE study, it pertained to two other brands of bypass filters, and did not provide the absolute filtration rate for the filters in the study. And ALL of the busses in the test showed marked reduction in oil contamination, even if all busses did not pass all tests, the excursions were only slightly past the acceptable limit, much better than an engine with regular full flow filters.

I have no interest in extending my oil change intervals to 80K miles as the study indicated. I am interested in keeping my engine oil as clean as possible to minimize engine wear. It is the particulates in the oil, mostly soot, particularly those in the 10 to 60 micron size, that cause bearing, ring, crankshaft and cylinder wear. I have to believe that a filter that removes 99% of particulate down to one micron in size has to be a good deal and will lead to near infinate engine life, at least as far as the pistons, cylinders, rings, bearings, crankshaft and camshaft are concerned. However, at $549 for the basic filter, plus installation plumbing, and $29 for a replacement filter every 12K miles I'm not exactly rushing out to get one!
 

Twinpinion

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Yep it is a good idea. It seems not many people here grasp the concept. It is very common for 18-wheelers to run a bypass filter system. It just doesn't make sense to be changing out oil every 3-5k in a truck like that. It would be very expensive considering they would have to do it twice a week on a truck with a pair of drivers switching off. So yes, great idea! Amsoil has a good kit to do just what you are talking about. There is also a kit that includes a pre-lubing device. Perfect for cold starts. And even the full whiz-bang Amsoil pre-luber kit is less than the kit you mention. Here is the cheapie:

https://www.amsoil.com/storefront/bf.aspx

BMK-12 at $114 plus hoses and filters looks like the best bet for a deuce.
 

houdel

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Better yet would be the BMK-13 at $201. It combines a full flow filter and a bypass filter in a single remote mount. Get rid of those sucky upside down stock cartridge oil filters, gain a spin-off full flow filter and almost instant oil pressure when you start your engine, no oil running down the side of your engine when you change the filters. May take a little engineering to figure out how to get rid of the old filters and base and install the Amsoil remote unit, but definitely sounds like like a winner! I wouldn't even worry about the lube precharger with this system.

BTW, the Amsoil full flow filters run $15.10 - $23.00 and the bypass filters run $35.95 - $45.70 for the sizes recommended for a 15 to 30 quart system.
 

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Twinpinion

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Oh, my bad. I thought the BMK-12 was a heavy truck version of the BMK-13. The 13 is for smaller vehicles but you're right. I like the idea ya got. There must be a truck version.

Although it looks like the BMK-13 accepts the bigger filters. Hmmm. Post it up if ya go that route. I'm thinkin' bout it too.
 

houdel

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Amsoil kind of talks out both sides of thier mouth on the BMK-13. On the Filtration System Application Guide, they list the BMK-13 for automotive/light truck/marine applications, but in the fine print in the BMK-13 installation guide, way down at the bottom, they talk about using Donaldson Endurance oil filters for heavy duty commercial and off road use. The BMK-12 is a heavy duty unit with two bypass filters, no full flow filters.

One question I have is wheather the stock Deuce oil filters run in series or parallel. If they run in parallel, then I guess you'd need two BMK-13s, one to replace each original filter, to accomodate the higher oil flow rate.

BTW, I've started another thread on this topic, "Remote Spin-Off Oil Filter for the Deuce".
 

Djfreema

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Any body familiar with the Frantz bypass filtration system. It uses toilet paper rolls as the filter. I work with a guy that swears by them and I am considering getting one. The company name might have changed but Ebay has NOS Frantz available for $104.
 

houdel

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Ken, I respect your technical knowledge, but I have to disagree with you when you say your stock Deuce filtration is "working just fine". Barely adequate maybe, just fine, I don't think so. I know you'd like to "bypass" this subject, but I think we need a "full flow" of discussion here, before we "spin off" on another topic. While I know you are technically astute, some of the readers following this thread may not be, so I will talking in simple, basic terminology, not to affront you, but to assist less astute readers. Certainly, the filtration system has worked somewhat efficiently since 1949 when the Deuce was originally designed, but IMHO the stock Deuce filtration system sucks, for two basic reasons.

1. The upside down cannisters which allow oil to drain back into the crankcase, resulting in a "dry start" after the engine has been sitting for a while. Bypass filters do not address this issue, I do have some ideas which I will try and report in a later post.

2. The cellulose filtration media (read "paper") does not do a great job of filtration.

Change your oil, pull the dipstick, and what do you see? Clear, honey colored oil. Rub some between your fingers, what does it feel like? Smooth and slick. Then run the engine a while, check the dipstick, and what do you have? Black, opaque, gritty oil. The difference is soot, unburned carbon particles which have made their way past the piston rings and into the oil. Soot particles are generally in the 5-60 micron range in size. A typical cellulose filter can trap particles down to 50-100 microns, a quality glass fiber filter a little better.

To put this in perspective, a grain of salt or a grain of fine sand is in the 40-60 micron size range. These particles pass through a typical full flow filter unimpeded. In terms of your engine's lubrication needs, a full flow filter stops the bolts, nuts, twigs and large boulders which might plug a lubrication passage and cause catastrophic engine failure, but do nothing to stop the fine grit which causes most engine wear.

The oil film between the crankshaft and its bearings, the camshaft and its bearings, and the piston skirt and rings and the cylinder wall is in the 20-40 micron range. The typical filtration system passes particulates which exceed the lubrication film thickness - essentially pumping abrasives in the oil which are larger than the protective lubrication film. The result - micro particles of cadmium and copper from the bearings, aluminum from the pistons, iron from the cylinders, and steel from the rings, crankshaft and camshaft are being constantly ground off and end up in the engine oil.

A bypass filter is designed to tap off a portion of the oil flow, usually 10% or so, through a high efficiency particulate filter, typically removing 99% of all particulate 1 micron or smaller, and returning the cleaned oil to the crankcase. Typically, after an hour or so, 100% of the engine oil has passed through the bypass filter, and essentially all particulate has been removed from the oil.

The end result - using a bypass filter, all significant particulate matter is removed from the engine oil, and you are running on "clean" engine oil all the time. Bearing, crankshaft, camshaft, cylinder, piston and piston ring wear are reduced significantly , to near zero levels.

Right now I have a lot on my Deuce's to do list - install pyrometer and boost gauges, replace a leaking knuckle boot, and a few other repairs. Once that is done I have to do an oil change, run it for a while with new oil until it gets grundgy, and then I'll install a bypass filter. I'll do an oil analysis of the old oil, the new oil after it has been run a while, and again after the new oil has been run with the bypass filter in place long enough to do what it is supposed to do. I'll post the results here and you can draw you own conclusions. I just hope the bypass filter works as well as advertised. This will probably take a couple of months before all the testing is done, so please be patient!

I'm not really concerned about extended oil changes, at 5-10K annual mileage on my Deuce, I'll do at least an annual oil and filter change anyhow. It is the claimed 90% reducttion in engine wear that has my interest!
 

Recovry4x4

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Lee, while I certainly agree that bypass filtration works wonderfully, and by the way, the Frantz is a cool system and does as advertised, I'm just not ready to take that plunge. I'm also aware that it can filter down to the 1 to 2 micron range and that can do nothing but good things to the deuce. For as little as I drive these trucks (10,000 miles annually max) there's no way I can justify the install. If I were doing a half million miles a year then maybe so. As it is, I'll bet at the rate of driving I do, these trucks will be running after I'm pushing up daisies. As far as the barely adequate oiling system, I respectfully differ on opinion. I've been around these trucks for a while now and don't hear too many oil related failures. Most of the oil related failures are lack of oil. I can't see how anyone with even a remote sense of maintenance couldn't get a lifetime of use out of one of these. I can't count the number of 60's era detroits I've seen with a million and a half miles on them. They run paper filtration. On the subject of the inverted cannisters, I agree that there is a worthy point with that but I wonder how many folks follow procedure with that. On cold starts you're supposed to crank it over a bit with the fuel shut off to check for hydrostaic lock. Deuces have the ability to crank over without starting if you so choose. On my cold starts, the truck gets a couple of 4 or 5 second cranks before the fuel is turned on. I don't see the long peiods of dry start that most folks report. Last but not least, you would be hard pressed to find anything on my trucks thats not original military. I'm a bit anal like that and in no way trying to impose my views on anyone but thats the way my trucks are. I'm not throwing stones at anyone working towards improving the filtration system at all, just question if the return justfies the effort, thats all.
 

houdel

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Ken - We do think alike. I respect your philosophy on the stock filtration system and keeping your trucks as original as possible. Yes, that filtration system has been around for 50+ years and has served admireably in that time; but the military does do frequent rebuilds on the multifiuel engine, usually in the tens of thousands mileage range vs hundreds of thousands to half of a million miles or more on long haul trucks running bypass filters.

I have no problems installing improved technology components on my vehicle (such as the pyrometer/boost pressure gauges and a bypass filter) as long as they are inobtrusive in nature and done in a manner that looks as though it was a military retrofit. I am NOT into rolled and pleated interior trim, Recaro seats, elaborate glossy paint schemes and sound systems with megawatt amplifiers, etc. I do want my military truck to LOOK like a military truck. I even puke at the thought of a bobbed Deuce, even when done in a military appearing manor!

And I DO do a hydrostatic check every time I start my engine, and idle my engine a few minutes to cool off the turbo before shutting it down. But I do notice a good 5-10 second lag time from when I start the engine until the oil pressure starts to build up. I intend to find a way to solve that situation and install a bypass filter so my grandkids can drive my Deuce with the original engine still in place!
 

Recovry4x4

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Agreed! Thats why I love this forum over so many others. Differences of opinions cab be voiced without soft skinned individuals getting flakey.
 
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