G749 preservation

[Another Ahab]

What USMC 00-08 says is all true.

I'm a bit sensitized from a fireworks episode of a buddy of mine who happens to be an architect. Years ago on a Fourth of July, he's playing with his son in the yard with fireworks. Lights one (I don't know what it was), the fuse burns down, but it doesn't go off. He waits a little. Picks it up. Holds it up to where he can see it better....he lost his eye. Just like that. One second he had perfect vision; in the next he's down to one eye.

He cut a mean figure. He wore a black eye patch. Said it was great for his business. He'd go to social functions and said everybody would be talking about him (you know politely and quietly, but noticing him for sure). He said he got more business that way (" ...lost his eye to a firecracker; he's an architect....).

We were camping together once (this is years ago). My cousin was with us, we're making small talk at the fire. The man claimed the eyepatch was a ladies magnet also (he was a bit of a rake; never divorced, but then I believe I heard that momma had her sure of fun to match his. There are lots of ways to work a marriage). My cousin asked if he'd trade all that (the constant business, the don juan living), and he didn't hesitate. What he said was "Life with one-eye is good, but life with two eyes? It's always better". He wasn't bitter. He was just matter-of-fact. I haven't seen the man in years.

 

[Another Ahab]

Umm. Sorry about that:

 

[m1010plowboy]

Brother, that shell looks like it's still crimped (meaning the casing is still full of powder). You just want to treat it with respect until you know the whole story there.

Maybe the primer is already fired as you mention (..."center in the bottom has a dent in it..."). But that might still be a live round. You cannot be too careful ever around live ordnance. Please. Just saying. Nobody ever wants anybody hurt.

I'm not an armorer, and somebody else here likely knows a whole let better than me. But you do want to be careful. Funny things happen sometimes (but they don't always end up being "funny" is the problem, you know what I mean?).

That's why I asked...Safety First, thanks for the feedback gents. I play guitar so can't afford to lose a digit, or an eye. Avoiding injury and pain is my middle name. M1010plowavoidinginjuryandpainboy

Haven't had any experience with a shell like this so even though Letsled was sure it was empty, I've never seen a shell with the firing pin tapped and the shell still intact.

So these things just make a bang noise and the tip stays crimped like this or was this one a dud?

 

[USMC 00-08]

They don't even make that big of a bang. We always had a lot of them that were duds when I was in the service. Some didn't open that far even when they did fire. I wouldn't worry about that one hurting anyone, but make your own decision. That is just me.

 

[Another Ahab]

Haven't had any experience with a shell like this so even though Letsled was sure it was empty, I've never seen a shell with the firing pin tapped and the shell still intact.

They don't even make that big of a bang. We always had a lot of them that were duds when I was in the service. Some didn't open that far even when they did fire. I wouldn't worry about that one hurting anyone, but make your own decision. That is just me.

USMC 00-08 makes a good point, and likely it is nothing to worry about.

But consider that if you treat all suspicious ordnance like it's live, there's little chance you'll ever have to tell yourself later:

- "I wish I hadn't done that".

And letsled might be right, that casing MIGHT be empty. But if you can't SEE that it's empty (crimped closed ike that), you can't really KNOW.

If that casing is 7.62mm, and it looks like it could be, and if it has a full powder charge inside of it, then the gases from its discharge are capable of pushing a 100 grain piece of lead at close to 2,300 feet per second, and brother that "ain't hay". And if any soft tissue (like an eye or a finger) is nearby in the path of that escaping gas, guess which of the two (gas or tissue) is likely to "win".

You will never regret being careful.

But NOT being careful: there will always be a probability of regret.

Cool little model by the way (your "ammo carrier")!

 

[m1010plowboy]

We've been going fast at work and at the G749 farm, moving things around for better access, checking anti-freeze, oiling and turning engines, painting and prepping for a model shoot this weekend.



Back in the big City, the MVPA meets every Saturday unless there is an event. This weekend was extra special when Goose was asked if she could go for lunch with a retired member of the 15th Service Battalion. The Battalion invited some of the old members to lunch which turned out to be a massive turkey and beef dinner....from 1300 to 1500hrs, sharp.



The Iltis that was invited was also with the 15th Battalion at one time. 2- M135's and the Iltis staged for about 50 members that told a pile of stories about the deuce.

They had some real nice 14:00 - 20 tires on display.



Also on display in front of the armory is an M135 so Goose and Gizmo had to jump in for some rare G749 gathering photos. Something about 3 truck displays that gets me motivated.

 

[m1010plowboy]

That 3 truck layout is such a big motivator we moved George up the hill near Gracie for the upcoming model shoot and clean it up. Good friends with big equipment really help in this hobby.



A few more big 14:00 20 tire pics, Gizmo, Goose and the MP Iltis.

 

[Section8]

A crop of green in a field of green! Looks perty!!
I would love to have the cannon to terrorize my neighbors with.
The 1400 series tires would be nice to beef up my truck to!!
I would take the shell to the local RCMP detachment for disposal. If your unsure about it and want to be safe it would be easiest to have them take care of it. My 2 cents.
If you shake it can you hear the powder inside moving? I know when I do reloads you can hear the powder moving around in the case if you give a gentle shake.

 

[Another Ahab]

Haven't had any experience with a shell like this so even though Letsled was sure it was empty, I've never seen a shell with the firing pin tapped and the shell still intact.

I would take the shell to the local RCMP detachment for disposal. If your unsure about it and want to be safe it would be easiest to have them take care of it. My 2 cents.
If you shake it can you hear the powder inside moving? I know when I do reloads you can hear the powder moving around in the case if you give a gentle shake.

Here's the thing about that (shaking a shell to hear if there's powder inside):

- My brother and me, and a neighbor two houses down had a thing when we were about 13-14 years old of making bombs.

- We took used CO2 cartridges, filled them with shotgun powder and used hot wax to fix a fuse inside of them for lighting.

- By the grace of God, all three of us escaped that era with all of our eyes and fingers preserved and intact; miracles DO happen.

- Though the neighbor later had a bad experience with a train, but that's another story.

- Anyway, we would fill those cartridges to the brim with the powder. And what's deceiving is the powder is so light by weight that even when you held one of those full cartridges in your hand, you couldn't tell they were full: the weight of the powder was so insignificant your hand couldn't perceive it.

- But the bombs were VERY effective. We'd put them under these big trash cans of our neighbor, and these were the old-school heavy steel type cans, the kind that weighed like 20-25 pounds (real "ash cans" like the old G.I. Cans). From where we lit them those cans would travel a good 40-50 feet vertically. We did all this in his driveway in the back which was a story below grade, and there were times the trash can would clear the roof of his house and roll into the front yard (so you're talking a basement, a first story, a second story, and then up over the attic and the roof).

- Shells are typically full-to-the-brim of powder, so "shaking" them won't necessarily produce a noise. And modern powder is deceptively powerful even though it is so imperceptibly light.

JUST BE CAREFUL. You will never have reason to regret being too careful. But there are moments when you can regret not being careful enough. That's all. The End.

 

[Juskatla]

Those are great pictures. I particularly like the setup of the M135CDN on the bridge section. Its a great way to display a monument vehicle. The group shot is great as there are less and less of these runners around. What armoury is the 15 Circus Bn located at these days? Looks like a new building behind but I can't quite make out the name. In the old days, I made a few stops a Ortona Armoury to visit some Loyal Edmonton Regt friends. The deuces were only 20 years old then, barley out of their teens...

On a different topic, Brian Asbury is advertising an M135 and M211 cargo box for sale, along with some gov't rebuilt axles for any of you out there in Ontario...

 

[m1010plowboy]

Those are great pictures. I particularly like the setup of the M135CDN on the bridge section. Its a great way to display a monument vehicle. The group shot is great as there are less and less of these runners around. What armoury is the 15 Circus Bn located at these days? Looks like a new building behind but I can't quite make out the name. In the old days, I made a few stops a Ortona Armoury to visit some Loyal Edmonton Regt friends. The deuces were only 20 years old then, barley out of their teens...

On a different topic, Brian Asbury is advertising an M135 and M211 cargo box for sale, along with some gov't rebuilt axles for any of you out there in Ontario...

Good hearing from you except every time I see Vancouver in your moniker I'm going to spend some money. The ocean calls me and I know it won't stop until I can smell it. Haven't been out west for a 2 summers and it makes me cranky........expect a visit!

That arnoury is the Phillip Debney armoury near Roper road. It's hard to believe you're old enough to remember Ortona. We were talking about tunnels, bunkers and gun ranges and got a few stories about Ortona so you'll have to plug in any info you can about your visits there. Apparently there was a nice view of the river and rumors about hardening that we still need to confirm.

I think about Asbury daily but it's raining deuces right now with today's find of 3 - M211's hiding up around Redwater. These are the first ones I found with the Perfection Heater under the hood. We know one of them came out of the 1st Service Battalion so we're thinking it's important enough to try and rescue.




Our inconsistency showed up again with two different, triple-bar light styles drilled into the back of the box. Real groovy finding 3 trucks that need to be out by spring so looks like we may add to the herd.



Also found this cool aluminum tank that appears "water-buffalo ish" but looks like a slide in style. Has anyone seen these before?

 

[m1010plowboy]

A few more pics.



One truck had some welding mods in the back so not sure if they have a military story or if it's from after service life. The bows were set high with a few boards added over the length so we're thinking these girls hauled cargo.

 

[Juskatla]

Dave, You have all the luck finding these old girls. The one is definitely marked for 1 SVC BN, which when I was around this stuff, were at Sarcee in Calgary before everyone went off to Edmonton. On the Ortona visits, I have to say its more than a few years ago. There were a number of reasons I visited but lets just say a few involved the officers mess and dancing beauties in a time when that was not only considered correct but was expected... I'll have to scrape the gray matter and see what I can recall. It was a long time ago. Do you know what the fate of the Ortona Armoury is/was? All my connections from that time are lost or gone from this world. Sucks getting old.

I'd think a visit to Vancouver Island would be way better than Vancouver because you never know what is hiding in some of the north end logging company bone yards. Many old deuces went to logging shows around Port Hardy and up the coast. Unfortunately, most were worked to death. About 10 years ago there was a small herd forming near the Comox Air base but they dispersed without leaving a forwarding address. I saved a couple of M37s from there before they went to the crusher. Both are still sleeping beside the house. One deuce beauty that came for a visit there was restored by Rob Roy who was active with the Comox Air Force Museum. I haven't seen Rob post on the usual forums in later years but he would be a great contact out here. His deuce was saved from the loggers death because it had been a kitchen deuce and was set a side. It would be interesting for Rob to tell the rest of the story and update where the deuce is today.

 

[USMC 00-08]

I sure wish we could find stuff like that down here.

 

[m1010plowboy]

. Do you know what the fate of the Ortona Armoury is/was?

We had a downtown meeting so I decided to cruise into the valley to peak at the Armoury. It was bizarre seeing this old Dodge with the loud speakers on top out front. Across the street was a hummer so the pics have a bit of fake MV, Civil Defence and early 1900's history.



The armoury got picked up by the Arts community. I'm going to try to get inside and get some photos of how it looks now. It's a historical/ heritage building so she'' be around for a long time.

 

[m1010plowboy]

I sure wish we could find stuff like that down here.

How many more trucks do you want? We feel very lucky but at the same time it's a burden because we can't save them all. We are going after a grant to see if one of the M211's can be preserved for somebody's kid in the far future so we'll see.

Had a chance to oil and turn a few more engines and we're seeing how the corrosion can build up inside a cylinder. Found this funky bottle with a long tube to make things easier. Also lubing up the ends of the wires so they don't bind up when we pull them off.



This is the top of a piston that sat uncovered for a long time before we got it. In the second pic you can peek in the spark-plug hole and see how things go bad even in a sealed engine. This just reinforces the need to have those G749 long term hoarding kids pull the plugs, oil the cylinders and spin the crank to turn the engines over.



Found another cracked exhaust manifold on the G749 farm so that makes the trucks in the bush look more attractive. Just need that corporate philanthropist sponsor to jump in and share the cost!

 

[1944mb]

The seizing of the 302 is something that still draws my curosity...I've got other engines that have sat for years without issue. Oh well, looks to be a fact of life. Nice work, I'm sure it gets to be a chore as the corral fill up. digging the stubby wrench-when I turned wrenches for a living, the stubby set was always a favorite. So do these trucks find you or do you find them? Starting to get chilly up your way? Wouldn't mind taking a spin to Alberta and seeing the ponies in the corral .... Last I was there you didnt need a passport!

 

[Another Ahab]

Wouldn't mind taking a spin to Alberta and seeing the ponies in the corral .... Last I was there you didnt need a passport!

I remember that era (I used to roll up summers with a buddy into Quebec for wilderness canoeing).

I'm guessing that you're another Spring Chicken, just like me!

 

[USMC 00-08]

How many more trucks do you want?

I don't want anymore. Just looking for parts. Mainly the hard to get down here stuff like heaters, intake/exhaust manifolds, etc.

 

[gentrysgarage]

Plowboy,
I am soo jealous of your OD Green Iron magnet
And I can't find a set of M135 axles nearby, you walk 100-200 feet into the woods and stumble across another complete G749.........some guys have all the luck! LOL!!!!