Gasoline with 10% Ethanol

[stumps]

I have used kero in the past also and found no difference.

For some reason, in my area, they really keep an eye on the kero pumps, and I definitely can't pump it right into my truck. I only have one blue can, and a bunch of red ones, so I can't fill the red ones of course since they're not blue and kero approved.

1-K kerosene doesn't have the road taxes figured into the cost. It is illegal to pump it into a motor vehicle... hence the attention they pay to the kero pumps.

-Chuck

 

[plym49]

I like the idea of using diesel or kero to cut WMO. Completely eliminates any ethanol problem.

 

[plym49]

1-K kerosene doesn't have the road taxes figured into the cost. It is illegal to pump it into a motor vehicle... hence the attention they pay to the kero pumps.

-Chuck

I would imagine that the only illegality would be if the operator does not pay the road taxes due. Of course, this is a fine point undoubtedly lost on those staffing the gas station.

 

[stumps]

I would imagine that the only illegality would be if the operator does not pay the road taxes due. Of course, this is a fine point undoubtedly lost on those staffing the gas station.

You are certainly right... However, the short hose, and the rule against allowing it to be pumped into motor vehicles is governmental. They may not tell the staff why, just that it is their tushy if they let it happen.

-Chuck

 

[saddamsnightmare]

July 16th, 2012

So we're worrying about putting 10% Ethanol gasoline in what? A Deuce? As long as your gasoline is under 25% of the fuel mixture, and you have added some oil or gear oil to lubricate the injection pump, the problem you anticipate is what, exactly? The deuce was designed to survive in a post nuclear environment, and I suppose that all you're going to do is burn a little more gasoline compared to straight gasoline.
IF you really want pain and suffering, put 10% Ethanol gasoline in some vehicle with a carb built before say, 2005..... The amount of pain that 10% of Ethanol can cause in such engines (like my Unimog has in it) far exceeds any positve value from the Ethanol in the environmental sense. What we really need are more lectric railways and railroads, to lessen our dependence on any fossil fuel not created here at home... IMHO Your mileage may vary, but the deuce can handle ethanol in small amounts....

 

[panshark]

I would imagine that the only illegality would be if the operator does not pay the road taxes due. Of course, this is a fine point undoubtedly lost on those staffing the gas station.

The best case scenario is that the illegality varies from state to state. I've been told by my state revenue department that they will accept road taxes when someone self-reports that they've fueled a highway vehicle with untaxed/dyed fuel in error, and then qualified that statement by saying that although the state revenue department will accept the taxes, it won't avoid a fine imposed by the IRS if you get your tank dipped.

If anything can be learned from the countless threads regarding taxed/untaxed fuels, it is that every person should check with the local tax and law enforcement officials where they plan on operating.

 

[dblcamaros]

So does the pump diesel you buy have any issues? I also run Lucas fuel additive every time I fuel, hopefully this will help. Because I believe that the diesel at pumps now also has ethenol in it, not? Any suggestions?

 

[wdbtchr]

I've never heard of alcohol being added to diesel, or even rumors of that. The ethanol is added to gasoline as an oxidizer since MTB has been outlawed due to ground water contamination. The problem with ethanol is mixed with WMO will absorb water from the air and separate sooner or later. This leaves the water to be sucked up as a slug to the engine. The damage is caused when water hits the injector and flashes to steam in the tip of the injector when it expands 1600 times it's volume blowing the tip apart.

So just buy an extra set of injectors and use the ethanol if you want to risk it. I don't cut my WMO and it runs just fine for me. If you live where it gets cold I would thin with diesel. I'll keep washing my E-10 for my carborated engines.

 

[dblcamaros]

ok just wandering, cause I saw a sign at the gas station that cunfused the h*** out of me. It read "use of this fuel is required on all 2011 and later diesel engines, off road vehicles and some other jargon I can't quite remember, ultra low sulfur" which wouldn't be an issue except that it was on the pump that was labeled as off road diesel, dye added. I was baffled, still am. Any thoughts?

 

[Warthog]

There have been some testing of the E-Diesel for a few years. Google Ethanol Diesel and you will find some interesting reading.

 

[dblcamaros]

Thanks I shall. But isn't that contradictory that according to that sign it was ok for tractors to run off road diesel but that I couldn't or was that sign just misplaced?

 

[dblcamaros]

OMG!!!!!!!!! I just googled ethanol diesel and found out that the gov't has been in fact adding 10-15% ethanol to diesel in select areas as a test. And according to all the posts titled " 10% ethanol in diesel? Chevy and duramax diesel forum" It has been causing all sorts of damages to motors and seals! Unreal. Thanks for the info. Wart.........knowledge is def. power! Guess I'd better pay closer attention at the pumps when fueling.

 

[panshark]

some stations in my town have two handles at the diesel pump (or maybe 3). I think you can choose from regular diesel, a biodiesel blend and an offroad diesel. The offroad pump holster has placards warning about running dyed/untaxed diesel. Could this be the case in your situation?

 

[Ford Mechanic]

ok just wandering, cause I saw a sign at the gas station that cunfused the h*** out of me. It read "use of this fuel is required on all 2011 and later diesel engines, off road vehicles and some other jargon I can't quite remember, ultra low sulfur" which wouldn't be an issue except that it was on the pump that was labeled as off road diesel, dye added. I was baffled, still am. Any thoughts?

all diesel that you get now is ultra low sulfur due to epa pollution requirments and will work in any other diesil engine. but we have been having problems with it due to it has less lubricity for the injectors. most folks use an additive to help with this. ford even makes makes one that they recommend to use in all their diesel engine, it's also a cetane booster. it really makes a night and day differance in the 6.0l diesel. the cetane levels on the pumps here are lower than what ford offically required for the engines also.

the low sulfur diesel replaced the regular kind of like the unleaded gas replaced leaded gas a long time ago. if you happen to get a hold of some regular diesel DO NOT put it in your new 6.7l ford diesel engine $$$$$ it will kill the particulate filters in the exaust!!!!!

 

[dblcamaros]

no......it was exactly as I have stated above. That's why I was so befuddled.

 

[panshark]

I checked out the multi-diesel station in my town today. Yep, there's 3 different diesel handles (and 1 gasoline). Green is "regular" ULSD, yellow is Biodiesel and Red is Off-road only. I think they've changed the red-handled pump a bit, I noticed it is now placarded "pre-pay inside only, between 6a.m. and midnight."

What color is the pump handle in question, and ultimately, what color diesel does it produce?

 

[Speedwoble]

OMG!!!!!!!!! I just googled ethanol diesel and found out that the gov't has been in fact adding 10-15% ethanol to diesel in select areas as a test. And according to all the posts titled " 10% ethanol in diesel? Chevy and duramax diesel forum" It has been causing all sorts of damages to motors and seals! Unreal. Thanks for the info. Wart.........knowledge is def. power! Guess I'd better pay closer attention at the pumps when fueling.

You are jumping to conclusions. The study referenced was dealing with fleets. They have done E-diesel tests with fleets. The EPA will not allow a blend unless they approve it.

 

[BiffJ]

I checked out the multi-diesel station in my town today. Yep, there's 3 different diesel handles (and 1 gasoline). Green is "regular" ULSD, yellow is Biodiesel and Red is Off-road only. I think they've changed the red-handled pump a bit, I noticed it is now placarded "pre-pay inside only, between 6a.m. and midnight."

What color is the pump handle in question, and ultimately, what color diesel does it produce?

Pump handle colors vary from location to location. You can't depend on the color of the pump or handle to determine fuel type. Sometimes we see yellow handles other times green and travelling around the country in our diesel VW Jetta we see red, yellow, green, blue, white(dirty white), orange and any other color the stations want to use. Even among stations of the same brand we see variation in the colors. Some BP stations use yellow for diesel while others use green. Right now there is no standard and no real way to tell by color of the pump, handle or sign what type of fuel is going to come out.

The warning with the 2009 date is simply stating that as of 2009 all new diesels are required to use the Ultra Low Sulfur Diesel fuel and should not be fueled with Low sulfur diesel or older non controlled fuel.

Frank

 

[Tanner]

Many gas pumps have a sticker on them stating something about 'Pump May contains Gasoline with up to 10% Ethanol', or similar.

Not all states require the pumps to be labeled. All pump gas made these days has ethanol added, especially for the summer. Ethanol has even been found in pumps that don't state that their gas is ethanol-enhanced -

NC had a statute requiring gas stations to place a sticker on pumps denoting Ethanol-enhanced fuels - statute expired in 2009; stickers on pumps are voluntary, so you have no guarantee that the gas you buy is ethanol-free. Gas being sold in NC is based on 'reformulated gasoline base stock', which already has ethanol in it. The fuel depots add additional ethanol at terminal when they fill up fuel tanker truck for delivery to gas stations, called 'splash fueling' or 'splash mixing', Lack of a sticker does not ensure gas without ethanol is being dispensed from pump...

My research into fuels has shown info from the petroleum industry stating that the amount of Ethanol in the fuel batch can vary depending on the blending method used and the base stock process method used, e.g., 'conventional gasoline base stocks' vs 'reformulated gasoline base stocks'

Bottom line: lack of a sticker on gas pump does not guarantee no Ethanol in fuel...

'Tanner'