Generators for Dummies

[thtrev2001]

Ok, so I am prepared for the flood of replies like "use the Search button", "Download the TM's" , "If you own it you should know how to work on it", etc, I have done all of the above ,but I still have some stupid questions. My Troop has just bought an MEP-016D. It starts and runs fine (the engine), and thats about as far as I can go. I know absolutely nothing about Electricity other than I need it. I've read enough to know that I can't figure it out by myself. We have a week long camp coming up in a few months and we want to use it to run a few lights, a small chest type freezer, and maybe a medium size fan. Of course we won't have to run it 24 hours a day. My questions concern how do I test this thing to make sure it works right (without electrocuting myself) , what positions do the switches need to be in ( I think single phase, 120 volt, 60 Hz), How far can I run cords, and what size do they need to be (we want if far enough away from camp to be able to hear ourselves think), and any other questions or problems that anyone can add. The MKT I've got figured out, but the generator, I'm clueless. Any help would be appreciated.

 

[aggopian]

sewerzuk would probably have most (if not all) of the info you need.

 

[storeman]

If you are getting no AC, have you flashed the field with the starting switch held far to the right after the unit fires (fir 5 or 10 seconds?

 

[The_New_Guy]

Well, I have recently acquired a surplus MEP016D and have been sorting through some of the same things you are talking about. First, put a decent multimeter on it to test voltage and hz against the guages to make sure they are accurate. Read the directions with the multimeter for those procedures. For the fan, and probably the lights, you can use the convenience outlets on the side. The freezer, well that may require a few more amps than those fuses are good for. There is plenty of power coming off L1 and L2 posts on the back, but you need to wire it into something useful, like an outlet. Seek help for that if the freezer is mandatory. After you have verifies the guages, or have a way to check the output, just give the cord a pull and plug your ears. Oh, and don't forget a grounding rod to stick in the ground attached to the ground post on the side of the generator frame. Hope that helps!

 

[Isaac-1]

Ok here goes the quick version:

You have a MEP-016D which is a MEP-016a or c that has been retrofitted with a Yanmar diesel

I don't have any hands own experience with this model, however I do own a close cousin to it, a MEP-016b / MEP-701a which has an Onan diesel, so hopefully most of this should transfer over fairly close, I am sure someone here will correct me on minor differences.

First of all for your use you want to make sure to set the generator for 120V single phase only, this is done on my unit with a selector switch inside the control panel (don't confuse this with the voltage meter selector knob), in 120V single phase mode you will have access to the full output of the generator in one line to line connection and will not have to worry about load balancing and you will be less likely to burn it out.

Next you need get someone that knows about electricity to wire up a distribution box with breakers and outlets for you (this can be done with about $50 in parts from any hardware store, a small outdoor rated breaker box with a pair of 15-20 amp breakers, and a couple of weatherproof outdoor outlets in boxed screwed to it , as these generators have connection lugs, not outlets to connect major loads to. (the front panel outlets can only output a fraction of the power that it can generate, and do not show up on the load meter)

Extension cords need to be sized by length and number of amps being drawn, if your 100 feet away you would probably want to connect things with a pair of 100 ft. 12GA extension cords each with about half the load connected to it, 10GA would be better, but are a lot more expensive.

Also to lower the risk of being shocked, make sure to drive a ground rod and connect it to the generator ground as shown in the tech manual.

There are probably 50+ more things you need to know to be safe, but it is hard to guess what they are without knowing more details

Ike

 

[SCSG-G4]

100 feet, 20 amps load = one 10 ga. cord. But a 100 ft 10GA cord is HEAVY. I use 50 ft 10GA to run power to my pantry trucks. In that application it will handle 25-30 amps without significant voltage drop (less than 2 percent). Another thing to consider - try pointing the generator exhaust away from camp, which will lower the perceived volume a couple of decibels.

 

[thtrev2001]

Isaac-1,I haven't been able to find a TM for the "D" model, but what your saying Issac is that other than the engine, It's a "A" or "C" model? Thanks for the info

Storeman, I appreciate the help, but thats what I'm talking about, I have no idea what "flash the field" means.

SCSG-G4, I have some electrical cords from a light set I picked up at tlc (see pic) I don't know what size they are but I'll check. I let the idea about the distribution box, I'll check into that.

 

[fireman5199]

Flashing the field is turning the start control to start again for a couple seconds. It sends a shot of 24v to the generator field to get it producing power. You do this if the meters dont come up after you throttle up. Also, if this unit is like the MEP-002A dont run it at idle with no load you will damage voltage regulator.

More pics of the controls of the unit maybe helpful in walking you through the set up too.

 

[Isaac-1]

Yes, the manuals for a MEP-016a or c should cover all the details you need to know about the generator end, controls, etc., as the MEP-016d is simply an a or c where the gasoline engine has been removed and retrofitted with a 1 cylinder Yanmar diesel. The MEP-016b like I have, or its Yanmar upgrade the MEP-016e are somewhat different, with a different frame, control panel, etc.

Ike

p.s. I guess since the MEP-016d is a conversion project there seems to be some variation in how they are set up like differences in the engine paint, fuel tank, and if they get onboard batteries for electric start.

 

[steelandcanvas]

sewerzuk would probably have most (if not all) of the info you need.

And others. Ike, Gary, Keith and Tom to name a few.

 

[tigger]

The only electricity my boys get when camping is contained in a flashlight! thats the hole idea of camping! i alow no eletronic devices along while on a camp out! even the week long camp every June. sorry that is just the way i feel about it! **** i bet Pappa bear still knows how to rub 2 stones together to make fire!

 

[Isaac-1]

One more note, you said you plan to use this generator for lighting, I suggest using CF bulbs as they are a lot more efficient 13W CF = 60W traditional bulb, this can make a big difference when you only have 3KW to work with.

Ike

 

[thtrev2001]

How do I respond to that with out being "snarky", as my Grandmother used to call it. As a Scoutmaster for 21 years, 22 in January, I too, do not allow my scouts the use of electronic devices. I know how much of a distraction they can be. We typically don't bring a generator along with us, yes, even for week long campouts. I applaud you for teaching those young men that they can survive with out the usual comforts of home. However, this camp is a little different. We will be rebuilding trails, 2 fire watch towers, fences and removing a lot of cactus from a wildlife management area of about 16,000 acres. All of which was destroyed in a wildfire recently. The Young men will be working 12 hour days for 6 straight days. I've been tasked with feeding about 155 youth and adults with our MKT. While yes they could survive cooking over camp fires, we felt that since they will be doing such strenuous work in 90-100 degree weather (think June in South Texas) we should feed them so that they could spend more time working and less time cooking and cleaning. Hence the MKT and generator (we need lights in the morning since they will be up before light for breakfast, a freezer to store some of the supplies in and a fan to keep the bugs down in the MKT. Thanks for volunteering your time to help raise decent, honest, respectful young men.

Isaac, yep, I had actually looked at some LED light tubes that I could hang from the roof of the MKT. They are only about $30 and I think I would only need two. They have like 25 LEDs in each one, would that be less watts than CF lights?

 

[Isaac-1]

On a watts per light output CF and LED are going to both be in the same ballpark, the newest design ultra high output LED's are better than CF, but they are still very costly. If you are going to go the LED route, I suggest you wait until the last minute to buy, brighter and cheaper LED bulbs are coming on the market in the next few months. The MEP-016d should be more than enough generator for your needs, I use my MEP-016b / 701a for household backup power, and it provides enough to run a small-mid side chest freezer, standard refrigerator, as well as an 8,000 & 11,000 btu window airconditioner, plus a few CF lights. From a practical view for your uses this means in addition to the loads you have mentioned there is enough excess to power either a microwave oven or a coffee pot, or even a plug in electric grill/fry pot at any given time, but not all at once.

Ike

p.s. One other thing that you may want to check on, many national forests, etc. require generators to be equiped with a USDA certified spark arrestor, this is something many cheaper generators do not have, I think the civilian version of the Yanmar L70 comes with one, not sure about the MEP retrofit version though, although I suspect it does

 

[thtrev2001]

Thats great news, here are a few pics I just took. I understand the Volt selector knob should be on V1-2, and the current selector to 1-1, is that correct then I can hard wire into the post a 10ga cord and run that to a junction box with breakers and a couple of outlets, then I just have to adjust the idle speed of the engine to match 60 hz. what would be the configuration of the hard wire cord into the posts...that part confuses me?

 

[Isaac-1]

Ok, the volt / amp selector switchs shown in your first 2 photos are just for selecting metering, NOT for selecting output. If it is like my MEP-016b there is an output selector knob INSIDE the control box to select between 120/208v 3 phase, 120v only 3 phase, 120v only single phase, and 240V only single phase, you will want this knob set for 120V only SINGLE Phase, this should NEVER be switched while the generator is running, I suspect this is why they hid it inside the box. You also want something bigger than 10 ga to run from the output lugs to the breaker box, rated output for this generator is around 32 amps at 120V, real world may be more considering the military tend to under rate, I think the on board breakers are rated around 45 amps single phase, so you want either #6 or #8 wire depending on the length of the run to the breaker box and type of wire used. #10 SO cable ( probably SOOW or SEOW in this case, flexible extension cord) is good for only 30 amps, #8 is rated at 40 amps, and #6 is rated at 50, this is a bit over simplified, but should have you in the right ballpark, again assuming no more than 100 foot run, more than that may need up sizing more to avoid too much voltage drop.

Ike

 

[thtrev2001]

I'm thinking the run should be 50 ft, So if the inside knob is set correctly, the outside knobs really don't affect the output, its just for the meters. I've looked for the TMs for this genset and can't find anything. Any suggestions on how to wire the posts. I've did a search and found several people making "convenience boxes" would that be the same thing as the outlet box that was mentioned earlier....
As for the grounding rod, do you really need to stick a 4ft copper rod into the ground, or is there another way to do it...have you seen the price of copper recently

I appreciate everyones help and patience

 

[Isaac-1]

Here is a link to some of the TM's

Military Generators ==> MEP 016C

In 120V 1 phase only mode I think output is between L1 and L2, double check this though

have to run now

Ike

ps Copper plated 8 ft ground rods are about $10 at any hardware store

 

[Keith_J]

Oh, Boy Scouts? As an Eagle Scout in the area with a bit of generator smarts, I will volunteer to help out. Without bribery of that addictive caramel corn nut mix... Good thing that stuff is $20 per can, I would be HUGE if price were less

 

[SCSG-G4]

Grounding rods are generally copper plated steel, not solid copper. So, yes, you need a ground rod. PM me your address and I'll see if I can get you a piece of 6GA wire for the ground - generator to ground rod.

Check with CARNAC on a distribution box - he had one at the GA Rally that he was thinking about selling. It has four locking plugs on it (L5-20's) and you could run 240 V into it. Floridason has the correct cables to go into it - I would suggest getting three of those, as they are only 25 ft long. I bought six from him and knocked one connector end off Cable appears to be 4GA and it's actually three phase (black, red, blue) with neutral (white) and four 12GA green wires tied together as ground.

Here's what one of the boxes looks like > see attachments. This is the one that was sold to Pete (pctrans). CARNAC's is green. I have a picture of the cable, but can't find it.