good or great price?

[lewisaric]

Hey everybody, I`m new to the site and would just like to say from what I have saw everybody on here is very helpful and kind to other mv lovers.

I have found two deuces for sale about 15 miles from my house. One is desert tan and looks to be all original with a steel top and hercules engine. The other is black with no top no bed and has a 5`th wheel hitch on it and the guy said it has been converted to full air brakes it also has the hercules engine. I didn`t see any noticable rust. He told me both ran and that i could test drive them. He said he wanted $3500 for both and would not sell them separete. I thought It sounded like a good deal. I thought that if I got them I would restore the tan one and and bob the black one. Any help to a newbie would be great

 

[lewisaric]

Also, he said that he didn`t have titles but would give me a bill of sale for each. Can i get tltles for these trucks or can i get tags without the titles

 

[CARNAC]

Ray Charles could have seen that one coming.

I'll let the experts handle this one.

 

[WarrenD]

All states are different when it comes to titles. Some let you apply for a title and/or register without a title for vehicles over a certain age. I would suggest you check with the local DMV and see what the requirements are.
As for your original question, $3500 for both seems like a good deal, but almost too good. I'd be looking closely at condition etc.

 

[combat32]

You could do it in Arkansas(have done it myself)not sure about your state.I sure would like to see how he converted a deuce to full air brakes.Take lots of pictures of that setup if you buy them.Not a bad price at all if they are both runners.

 

[GoHot229]

Thats two red flags in my book. Three would kill the deal. It's always flakey to get un-titled vehicles, and MV's are just that nnn'thh bit more difficult to title and liscense. Sounds fishy....... For three thousand five hundered dollars he ought to be willing to come up with paperwork or something substantial , ( just to prove their his). BE WARRY, 3.5 K is 3.5 K,.......it should be worth a little effort on his part.

 

[lewisaric]

he said he has the military paperwork but its not like a regular tiltle. i looked today at both of them. The only rust in the tan one was where the steel top mates to the body of the truck. The other one didn`t have any rust that i could see, and i looked very close at both.
The black truck is a Kaiser jeep m35-a2 and has a Continental LDT-465 with turbo and has a heater that runs off of the engine coolant. It has a plate under the engine i.d. that says it was overhauled by tead in oct, 89. The tan one is an AM General M35-A2c. I couldn`t tell what it said on the engine plate other than it was a multifuel. It also has a heater and a turbo. I made a typo on the price, he wants $4500 for both not $3500. Any more info on either or both of these would help out alot. I want to find out everything I can about them. Thanks

 

[WarrenD]

Price is dependent on where you are. In this area, $4500 for 2 running deuces would be a red flag. Maybe not elsewhere. It's starting to sound a little better, but I'd still proceed cautiously and I would talk with DMV. It could be he is selling because he can't get them registered. I would want to know from the state officials would the potential issues might be.

 

[MilitaryRestoration]

Welcome to site... (first) n second this group loves pictures take some pictures and it will help others out in guiding you and giving you advice plus then you benefit more...

 

[lewisaric]

as far as pictures go, i have dial-up and my computer sucks. but i will try. And I can`t stop thanking everyone for their help. This is a great website and i`m glad i found out about it. I have never owned an mv but hopfully i soon will have one or two in my yard

 

[GoHot229]

Theres some relief that he has some....paperwork, it's mabe do-able at this point. Still at 45 or 22+ apeice its not the best of bargains, it's getting close to what you might find in the classifieds here on the forum. The second Deuce, could it really be a 5 ton? Fifth wheel and all..? I guess we here just want you to get into a Good deal and are coming up with possable mess's you might encounter. At any rate, hope you find what your after in short order.

 

[lewisaric]

The dash plate on both trucks said they were 2 1/2 ton 6x6. The only difference in the model number is the one with the fith wheel is a m35a2 and the other is a m35a2c. the hitch itself is a fontane no-slack, I could tell it was added. But what caught my eye was that the gladhands were at the rear of the frame and not at the back of the cab. I figured it was used to just move trailers around the yard. He said he said it was like that when he bought it. As far as buying one from the classifieds on here or anywhere else I would have to pay to have them shipped to me and most are outside of driving distance for me to just go look at. There are a few around here for sale that i`m going to check out. And I`m sure if everything checks out on them I could talk him down. Bottom line, cash talks better than i do.

 

[wreckerman893]

I have never seen a deuce converted to straight air brakes.
Look at the axles....if there is air brake chambers on each wheel then they have been converted (maybe using FMTV axles).
There should also be two valves on the dash...one red labeled EMERGENCY and one yellow labeled SERVICE.
Remember...BUYER BEWARE.

 

[Recovry4x4]

Many moons ago Memphis Equip was selling air brake conversions for deuce axles. The conversions far exceeded the cost of a deuce. I'd sure like to see pics, find that would be awesome.

 

[lewisaric]

Ididn`t even think about the control knobs for the brakes. It does not have them so no it doesn`t have air brakes. But how do the gladhands work. I thought they were for air brakes, but all deuces have them so I don`t know. Could someone enlighten me on this.

 

[LanceRobson]

The standard brake system is air assisted hydraulics. The air pressure increases the work done when you step on the brake pedal. That's why all of the trucks have glad hands. Even if there is no air pressure, all the braking power is there, you just need about 10 times the pedal pressure to use it!

A true air brake will have an air canister at each end of the axle, usually about 8-10 inches across and 8-10 inches high. Each will have an air line running to it and a rod sticking out the lower end that is attached to the mechanical linkage of the brake drum. Modern air brakes use air pressure to compress a spring in the can and pull the brakes off and if air pressure is lost the spring in the can applies the brakes and stops the vehicle.

A truck with true air brakes will not have a hydraulic master cylinder under the driver side cab floor. You can check by looking under the truck and following the linkage from the brake pedal. Air air brake system will have a linkage to an air valve, often above the cab floor under the pedal.

I'd love to have air brakes on the deuce I use for road trips.

Lance

EDIT: A true air brake truck should have a pull out knob on the dash to dump the air from the cans in order to set the parking brakes. The tractor should have a trailer brake valve that look like a turn signal switch with air lines running to it, typically on the right side of the steering column. That is used to lock the trailer brakes so you can back under the trailer without pushing it all over the parking lot.

 

[lewisaric]

lance i`m confused aren`t the gladhands the things that the lines to a trailer(pigtails) conect to or are they something different?

 

[LanceRobson]

Yes, they are for the trailer brakes. The thing I was trying to get across is that a truck's having glad hands does not mean the truck has air brakes. Air brakes use air pressure to either apply or release the brakes (depending on when the truck was made) and do not use hydraulics.

Early air brakes used air pressure to apply the brakes but lost stopping ability when you lost air pressure.

Modern air brakes use air pressure to release springs that, in turn, lock the brakes in the absence of air. This is done in a spring brake canister attached with a linkage to the brake at the wheel. When air pressure builds up, the spring is pulled off and the brakes release. When pressure is lost, the brakes lock up. Much safer.

A truck with modern air brakes will have a barking brake switch, usually a pull out knob on the dash, that dump the air from the spring brake canisters. The tractor would normally have a trailer brake control lever, usually on the right side of the steering column, to lock the trailer brakes to allow you to back under it.

As designed, the M44 series trucks (including the two you are looking at) have air assisted hydraulic brakes. Since the trailers were built the same way the glad hands provide air to apply the trailer brakes. In the event of a loss of air pressure the deuce still has full braking ability, albeit with much more pedal pressure needed. They are not air brakes nor does the operator require an "air brake" endorsement on their license.

The whole point is this: Glad hands do not equate to "air brakes" Only the absence of hydraulic components and presence of only air powered components would define an air brake truck.

Lance

 

[lewisaric]

thanks lance. i understand now