Growler battery size?

[BPinFL]

My M1161 is on the way from Yermo to Florida. Want to have batteries waiting when I unload. What group size are they?
Thanks, BP

 

[W427]

@BPinFL - The spec is BCI group 34/78. Also use a VRLA/SLA type, AGM or Gel. 34/78 means it has both top (34 type) and side (78 type) terminals, however I have not seen ITVs use the side terminals in service. I imagine the /78 spec is to allow sharing (stocking one number) for other equipment. I found AGM 34s at a good price (about $400/pair with taxes and fees) with much better warranty, so I'm using those.

Quick note on battery type; the VRLA (Vent-Regulated Lead-Acid) or "sealed" is important to us, as the vehicles have effectively closed battery compartments with no provision for normal venting or spill containment that the cheaper flooded lead acid batteries may produce. Normal flooded-cell venting, battery failure or vibration and tip-angles in service could release liquid acid, acid vapor, and dangerous gasses. Using conventional lead-acid batteries might cause damage to the vehicle.

The VRLA/SLA batteries are limited on recharge current (amps), and warranties are typically limited and short (read the fine print!). Very high charge rates can cause venting of electrolyte, which is not only bad as described above, but also substantially shortens battery life. The high charge rates can be seen in situations such as low batteries being recharged by the alternator at-speed. Also, there is no provision for balancing charge on the series dual-batteries, reducing performance and again reducing battery life. So, my suggestion is to completely top-off the batteries independently before use, in order to avoid high charge rates and minimize charge imbalance. Test each battery often, in order to spot issues, and to use your limited warranty while it is still in-effect.

 

[BPinFL]

@BPinFL - The spec is BCI group 34/78. Also use a VRLA/SLA type, AGM or Gel. 34/78 means it has both top (34 type) and side (78 type) terminals, however I have not seen ITVs use the side terminals in service. I imagine the /78 spec is to allow sharing (stocking one number) for other equipment. I found AGM 34s at a good price (about $400/pair with taxes and fees) with much better warranty, so I'm using those.

Quick note on battery type; the VRLA (Vent-Regulated Lead-Acid) or "sealed" is important to us, as the vehicles have effectively closed battery compartments with no provision for normal venting or spill containment that the cheaper flooded lead acid batteries may produce. Normal flooded-cell venting, battery failure or vibration and tip-angles in service could release liquid acid, acid vapor, and dangerous gasses. Using conventional lead-acid batteries might cause damage to the vehicle.

The VRLA/SLA batteries are limited on recharge current (amps), and warranties are typically limited and short (read the fine print!). Very high charge rates can cause venting of electrolyte, which is not only bad as described above, but also substantially shortens battery life. The high charge rates can be seen in situations such as low batteries being recharged by the alternator at-speed. Also, there is no provision for balancing charge on the series dual-batteries, reducing performance and again reducing battery life. So, my suggestion is to completely top-off the batteries independently before use, in order to avoid high charge rates and minimize charge imbalance. Test each battery often, in order to spot issues, and to use your limited warranty while it is still in-effect.

Thanks man, good info for sure, BP out

 

[m1161]

@BPinFL - The spec is BCI group 34/78. Also use a VRLA/SLA type, AGM or Gel. 34/78 means it has both top (34 type) and side (78 type) terminals, however I have not seen ITVs use the side terminals in service. I imagine the /78 spec is to allow sharing (stocking one number) for other equipment. I found AGM 34s at a good price (about $400/pair with taxes and fees) with much better warranty, so I'm using those.

Quick note on battery type; the VRLA (Vent-Regulated Lead-Acid) or "sealed" is important to us, as the vehicles have effectively closed battery compartments with no provision for normal venting or spill containment that the cheaper flooded lead acid batteries may produce. Normal flooded-cell venting, battery failure or vibration and tip-angles in service could release liquid acid, acid vapor, and dangerous gasses. Using conventional lead-acid batteries might cause damage to the vehicle.

The VRLA/SLA batteries are limited on recharge current (amps), and warranties are typically limited and short (read the fine print!). Very high charge rates can cause venting of electrolyte, which is not only bad as described above, but also substantially shortens battery life. The high charge rates can be seen in situations such as low batteries being recharged by the alternator at-speed. Also, there is no provision for balancing charge on the series dual-batteries, reducing performance and again reducing battery life. So, my suggestion is to completely top-off the batteries independently before use, in order to avoid high charge rates and minimize charge imbalance. Test each battery often, in order to spot issues, and to use your limited warranty while it is still in-effect.

My M1161 is on the way from Yermo to Florida. Want to have batteries waiting when I unload. What group size are they?
Thanks, BP

FWIW, my 1161's arrived with "off the shelf" batteries.
While pursuing the parts under the lid in the back, I found and researched a black unit with lots of heat disapating fins. It's designed to regulate the currents going into the two series connected batteries. In particular, according to the data, when one of the batteries is used to supply 12 volts during the 24 volt operation. Some of those relays mounted under the instrument panel are rated at 12 volts !

Maybe "they" considered the vent holes on the forward most cover adequate venting. If you're replacing batteries, be careful not to drop the hold-down rods thru the floor! ! They're not easy to find and retrieve once you're under the machine :>)

 

[W427]

FWIW, my 1161's arrived with "off the shelf" batteries.
While pursuing the parts under the lid in the back, I found and researched a black unit with lots of heat disapating fins. It's designed to regulate the currents going into the two series connected batteries. In particular, according to the data, when one of the batteries is used to supply 12 volts during the 24 volt operation. Some of those relays mounted under the instrument panel are rated at 12 volts !
...

Yes, there is info on the "other" ITV forum on that electronic unit (and the updated version), which functions as a voltage converter from 24V to 12V, in order to maintain battery balance. This avoids the use of one battery to supply 12V. The transmission appears to be the primary average consumer of 12V power, but as you say, there are a number of 12V consumers in the ITVs. No wondering why the converter is so large and has cooling fins!

[EDIT] BTW, the in-service ITV photos I've seen have been commercial OTS batteries (various brands) of either group 34 or 34/78, and always the AGM sealed type.

One GovPlanet guy in CA said they used to put regular flooded lead-acid batteries in some before sale, but didn't do that anymore. The GA location may have done that for a while also. Hope that helps!

 

[MarDetCVN70]

2 red top Optima batteries work great in mine.