HMMVW need help with Injection pump

[Jan Micka]

Hi guys,
have bought army surplus humvee that was suposed to run but after a year it got to Europe it is not running. Seems there is red stuff in the tank which smells anything but diesel. I have worked on some, but it seems to me the metering valve is stuck or the plungers are stuck with gunk. Of course the ip lid is secured by special bolts with 5 star pattern and a nipple in the middle which I do not have. My question is if the metering valve moves and opens the fuel to enter the low pressure side of the pump- housing I should be getting a little amount of fuel from the return line on the IP, correct? The reason I am asking is to verify somehow without taking the IP lid off to know if the metering valve is free to the point the fuel problem is not there. I plan to connect a 8 bar electric fuel pump to the intake fuel line to the IP and try to start it. If only the plungers are stuck it should have good chance to free them up. However if the metering valve is stuck it wont have any effect. It is around 32 degrees here so cold to work on the humvee outside.
Thanks for any imput.
With regards
Jan Micka

 

[TOBASH]

This could be anything from stuck check valves to a bad fuel pump to a bad injection pump. I would suggest by first removing the check valve and then reading we have a dozen recent issues with injection pumps that have been posted because they will tell you exactly how to proceed.

I will also tell you to immediately drain your fuel tank and clean or replace the strainer/sock that covers the intake pipe

 

[Action]

Isnt off road diesel red ?

 

[blutow]

Isnt off road diesel red ?

I received my truck for yermo earlier this month and it had exactly 5 gallons of bright red off-road diesel in it. It smelled just like any other diesel and everything was really clean, so probably a different situation than what this truck is dealing with. I would recommend draining the tank at minimum and taking a peak through the sender unit access port on top.

I put fresh diesel and a couple flavors of fuel treatment in mine and so far, so good. Still holding my breath hoping the IP doesn't crap out after sitting so long, I have only run a few gallons of fuel through it since I can't drive it on public roads yet.

 

[REF]

Here in California we have off road diesel.
It is the same as regular diesel except it was sold without road use tax (mostly used for tractors in ag) . So to identify it from regular Diesel they put red die in it. This makes it easy for the powers to be to fine you ( to death) if they find red diesel in your pickup ( on the road without paying the tax).

 

[Mogman]

Here in California we have off road diesel.
It is the same as regular diesel except it was sold without road use tax (mostly used for tractors in ag) . So to identify it from regular Diesel they put red die in it. This makes it easy for the powers to be to fine you ( to death) if they find red diesel in your pickup ( on the road without paying the tax).

Probably the same anywhere, RED in Texas also,

 

[Retiredwarhorses]

It’s Agricultural diesel, known as AG Gas…military uses it, but GP may use it also trying to start trucks.
Snapped shafts on these injection pumps is normal, I replace a pump a week in the shop, it’s quite tediou, just finished one Saturday, will do another on a lineup of 6 more with same issue…lather, rinse, repeat.

 

[Mogman]

In Texas like in CA it is also called off road diesel, can be used in AG equipment, construction equipment, anything that would not be required to pay on road fuel tax.
Here is the clincher, it leaves a residue in the tailpipe that can be immediately detected by law enforcement simply by swabbing the pipe.
Being cought on the road with that residue is bad news, they can and have charged the driver/owner for the estimated tax for every mile shown on the odometer of that vehicle and or a stiff "fine", and it stays for a LONG time after switching back to regular taxed diesel.

The good news in all of this is it is very rare to get tested, they do like hitting the livestock auction barns and snagging all the farmers trucks in the parking lot, somewhat of a concentrated and captive audience.

BTW I have an off road diesel permit and run it in all my tractors etc, and I also have several on road diesel trucks, only a moron in my position would use red diesel in an on road vehicle as the state has the right to inspect all my equipment on demand as part of the agreement to have the permit.

EDIT, actually I have not heard of any "raids" lately at the auction barns, we are a nation of law and it may have been pointed out that law enforcement did not really have "probable cause" to randomly search the tailpipes at the auction barns.

 

[juanprado]

Not sure if the same specs are used in Europe on fuel?

Dot and public safety motor carrier state police are more likely to check for dye at truck stops at weight stations and safety inspections.

 

[Jan Micka]

I have fuel coming to the IP, so lift pump is good, but nothing going to the injectors. I have had luck in the past with just freeing the metering valve that was stuck, glued with gunk. I need to take the lid off and see the metering valve if it moves and start from there.

 

[Jan Micka]

Does anybody know what size the torx TS 5 star is on the ip cover please? 3 bolts that secure it. Thank you.

 

[TOBASH]

Guys...SOP is to drain the tank, not because it is red but because it is potentially old and bad.

Red is for heater oil, kerosene, and off road Diesel. That doesn't change the SOP.

Clean your tank, change your sock, make sure the check valves are ok, make sure the mechanical lifter is ok, make sure the IP is ok, make sure there are no air bubbles, makse sure the filters are all new, and go go go.

 

[TNDRIVER]

Isnt off road diesel red ?

Yes

 

[dilvoy]

Does anybody know what size the torx TS 5 star is on the ip cover please? 3 bolts that secure it. Thank you.

I was never able to find a socket that fit those special bolts. I have hit the little pin in the center to snap it off and then use a screw driver to unscrew them and also in a desperate time, a nice sharp chisel and hammer to tap the bolts around a bit until I could grab them with a pair of diagonal cutters. They are not in very tightly. I don't think you will be able to do anything once you get that top cover off to get your engine started unless it is to change the fuel stop solenoid though.

 

[Jan Micka]

You get to the metering valve, which usually does not move freely and is stuck in off position.

I was never able to find a socket that fit those special bolts. I have hit the little pin in the center to snap it off and then use a screw driver to unscrew them and also in a desperate time, a nice sharp chisel and hammer to tap the bolts around a bit until I could grab them with a pair of diagonal cutters. They are not in very tightly. I don't think you will be able to do anything once you get that top cover off to get your engine started unless it is to change the fuel stop solenoid though.

You get access to the metering valve that could be stuck in off position, had that happen. Once it moves freely, I fill the filter with atf and wire in electric pump to supply the ip with pressure. The vane transfer pump inside the ip even increases it and starting the engine with wot should free the plungers if they are stuck. That is the plan.

 

[Mogman]

I was never able to find a socket that fit those special bolts. I have hit the little pin in the center to snap it off and then use a screw driver to unscrew them and also in a desperate time, a nice sharp chisel and hammer to tap the bolts around a bit until I could grab them with a pair of diagonal cutters. They are not in very tightly. I don't think you will be able to do anything once you get that top cover off to get your engine started unless it is to change the fuel stop solenoid though.

Just search your favorite auction site for "security torx bit set" unless you have a local Harbor Freight

 

[Mullaney]

I was never able to find a socket that fit those special bolts. I have hit the little pin in the center to snap it off and then use a screw driver to unscrew them and also in a desperate time, a nice sharp chisel and hammer to tap the bolts around a bit until I could grab them with a pair of diagonal cutters. They are not in very tightly. I don't think you will be able to do anything once you get that top cover off to get your engine started unless it is to change the fuel stop solenoid though.

.
Like @Mogman suggested "security" torx bit is what you are looking for...

 

[86humv]

The Torx bit is a special one...It has a 5 point star and hole rather than the normal 6 point star with hole like whats in most stores...I had ordered them on line years ago..
I have the harbor freight kit....It don't have the one you need.
Look up 5 point security torx.

 

[Mogman]

The Torx bit is a special one...It has a 5 point star and hole rather than the normal 6 point star with hole like whats in most stores...I had ordered them on line years ago..
I have the harbor freight kit....It don't have the one you need.
Look up 5 point security torx.

OK good to know!!! thanks RWH!!! They are available on all the auction sites.

 

[OBX]

OK good to know!!! thanks RWH!!! They are available on all the auction sites.

Torx T25 Tamper Resistant. All the auto parts stores I checked with said I was mistaken about it having 5 points. Ultimately had to order from eBay. About ten dollars, free delivery.