HOL-GAR CE-106-AC/WK 9 EP Genset

[chenz1938]

Thank you Allen1 You're the best.
I found and purchase the primer pump on Ebay. (Lucky).
However I'm missing two plates that are both shown in two of the photos you sent me.
For both I would need the dimensions of both plates (L x W ) as well as clear pictures of the information that is written on them.
The first plate is the RED warning plate and the second is the Alternating Current Generator No. 16757 etc. etc. behind or near the fuel filter.
I will post pictures of all the vehicles including the generator that my cousin Gerardo in ITALY has restored; he is very close to finishing the HOL-GAR. You will be amazed!
As always with much gratitude,
Vinny

 

[jonesal]

The red warning plate is 3-3/4" x 1-7/8" in size. It was glued to the right side of the block behind the carburetor. I mounted it on the plate you see and bolted in plain view - see note below.



The generator plate is 6-1/2" x 4-1/2" in size.



Please note that internal components for this military standard engine (FS162), for example crankshaft bearings, are different than the more common F162. For some reason (?high mortality?), the sizes are different and the tolerances are more strict.

Al Jones
Brookings, SD

 

[oldgenset]

INformation about HOL-GAR CE-106-AC/WK 9 EP Genset

I have a chance to pick up a Hol-Gar Ce106 generator. CAn anyone tell me the similarities between it and a newer Mep-003A?
Is the Hol-Gar also a very stable power unit like the MEP-003a Stable voltage and Stable 60hz Frequency?
How does it compare fuel consumption wise to the Diesel MEp-003a.
How about reliability?

I have 2 choices the MEP-003a is about 4 times the money as the Hol-Gar, But will the Hol-Gar do as good of job?
I will be using it for Emergency backup for my whole house .
Thank You.

 

[Another Ahab]

I have a chance to pick up a Hol-Gar Ce106 generator. .
How about reliability?

I have 2 choices the MEP-003a is about 4 times the money as the Hol-Gar, But will the Hol-Gar do as good of job?
I will be using it for Emergency backup for my whole house .
Thank You.

It can't figure that the Hol-Gar unit (at 25% of the cost) is going to be everything that the MEP-003a is.

I could see how maybe if the unit was 10% less in cost, but at 75% less in cost!? It just doesn't compute. Does it?

 

[jonesal]

Your questions are pretty vague. What does "a good job" mean to you? The main similarity is they are both military. Not being a smart butt, but that's about where the similarities stop. The Holgar is gasoline -MEPs are diesel. The Holgar has no electronics what-so-ever. Both AC and DC voltage regulators are mechanical. My Holgar has rock solid frequency stability. It's very reliable but I keep it inside, plugged into a battery minder, start it twice a year, etc. etc. It's a fuel hog by today's standards if you are running it full on. Keep in mind although it's only rated to 10kW, I've had mine on a load bank up to 18kW and it wasn't even struggling yet. I can imagine it was sucking gas pretty good. Mine has been totally reliable but I disassembled every nut and bolt and rebuilt it. I last used it last spring when I found our power lines in the driveway. Pulled it over, plugged it in and it went on like a scalded rabbit. Hope that information helps.

Since my last posts, I have found the correct cover, installed a 20 gallon fuel cell, installed the correct generator hookup at the pole and many other goodies. I'll try and post more later.



Al Jones

 

[Another Ahab]

. Mine has been totally reliable but I disassembled every nut and bolt and rebuilt it. I last used it last spring when I found our power lines in the driveway. Pulled it over, plugged it in and it went on like a scalded rabbit. Hope that information helps.
Al Jones

It's the mature trees in our area coming down in high winds that typically cause all our power failures.

What brings the power lines down in your area; the same thing?

 

[jonesal]

Oh, and some may ask, why the 100 amp set up at the pole? I over sized it in case the Holgar wasn't up to the task and I had to upgrade to a bigger genny. We have a ground source heat pump (aka "geothermal") that pulls 140 amps to start and then backs off to 14 amps when running. I saw no change in frequency when the compressor kicked (and pumps, etc.) - the amp gauge jumped of course but given it's analog, I have no way of telling what the genny pulled (and I've been meaning to put the voltage/amperage data logger on the genny but have not had time). There are 10 fingers on the regulator armature so it reacts pretty fast. There was no change in engine rpms but when I measured the geo years ago, it only pulled the high amperage for less than a second. I thought the main breaker on the genny might kick but it didn't. More detail that prolly necessary but its gives some detail for the technophytes.

Al Jones

 

[jonesal]

It's the mature trees in our area coming down in high winds that typically cause all our power failures.

What brings the power lines down in your area; the same thing?

Ya, a big wind storm came through and pushed some tress down over the high tension lines. We have 10 acres of trees next to the main line that were planted in the late 1800s so that probably qualifies as mature. The great thing is everything is going underground so that problem will get fixed in the next few years.

 

[Guyfang]

The last time I saw one of these sets was 1973. Man, your pictures look great! Simply great. What a lovely piece of work. You need to take a bow.

 

[rustystud]

It's the mature trees in our area coming down in high winds that typically cause all our power failures.

What brings the power lines down in your area; the same thing?

What happens around here is all the new construction. They remove a ton of trees and leave the nicest to be all pretty pretty ! What they forget is these trees grew up with the surrounding trees as support in wind storms. Without there fellow brethren to help block the wind they get the full force and since they never developed the root system needed to withstand the wind by themselves they fall over. This happens all the time out here now. Also Hemlocks are notorious for having delicate root systems. If you drive over them with a dozer or back-hoe they might look OK for several years but in reality you destroyed the roots and there dying. I have had over 8 Hemlocks drop over because of this. My neighbor was a "arborist" professor at the University of Washington. He had a lot to say about me clearing my land 20 years ago.

 

[oldgenset]

I know that my questions were broad and a little vague. I didn't know for sure if this thread was active or not. As far as the price difference, A Mep-003a is running and is about $3,000.
The Hol-Gar needs some work to get it to reliable running. Probably a carb rebuild and tank cleaning and tuneup and the case needs some work like hatches hinges and locks repaired. There is also a little rust on the frame. I am very familiar with Gas Engines but have only tinkered a little with Diesel. I currently have a 10kw (You may laugh) china made POS. After only about 200 hours it is dripping all all over the ground. I also know that the frequency is all over the place. We were hit severely with storms that took out power for 3 days a few weeks back(again). So I have heard a lot about the military gensets. I did not even know there was a gas powered, 10kw, 1800 rpm unit until I heard of this machine. I use the genset to power my house and the china one eats about 14 gal in 24 hours. I also have some nince electronics I don't want destroyed. Again, That Is why I am asking about fuel consumption. I know I can work on Gas units, and I know Diesel is more economical and maybe more reliable. I have little income, So I am looking to get the most unit for the least amount of money. Time I got. Money, Not so Much.
Thank you all for your input.

 

[Another Ahab]

Again, That Is why I am asking about fuel consumption. I know I can work on Gas units, and I know Diesel is more economical and maybe more reliable. I have little income, So I am looking to get the most unit for the least amount of money. Time I got. Money, Not so Much.
Thank you all for your input.

Hey, oldgenset; can't remember if I told you welcome, so welcome (memory: the second thing to go they say).

Henrico puts you in Richmond, is that right?

 

[jonesal]

I did not measure fuel consumption on the Holgar when it was on the load bank so I can't tell you what it is. At the rated load, I suspect it is more than your Chinese unit as it was never built for fuel efficiency. However, if the load is bouncing around, it may be the same. Given the cost of fuel for two days (or even a week) I would think fuel consumption as a residential backup unit would not figure that high in your decision. I went with gas because I keep 500 gallons of bulk fuel at my place for my older vehicles, tractors, etc. which are all gas. I can't give you much more help in your purchase decision. As mentioned above, the Holgar was a labor of love as I took infinitely more pleasure in getting it up and running than I did/do using it.

As a post script, we now have a diesel heater in our new shop (Choctaw H-140 - search for my thread on this sweet unit) and a new(er) diesel tractor. Now I'm trying to figure out how to keep 50 to 100 gals of bulk diesel on site. I'm tired of lugging 5 gallon Scepter cans of diesel home!

Al Jones

 

[jonesal]

Here are some pics to finish things out.

Proper disconnects (see switch handle in other photos) from the supply and what feeds the genny connection.


This makes it easy to set up. I bought all the parts new off ePay for 1/5 to 1/10 the cost of new from, say, Graybar.


The back end. I need to install heat shield I made so that the exhaust dump doesn't melt the cover. I carry onboard tool just in case.



Control panel. Cover must be kept open during operation.


And I'll post a separate thread on the trailer rebuild.


Al Jones

 

[jonesal]

I don't get the "Attached Thumbnails" on the last post tried to fix it but can't figure it out...?

Al Jones

 

[oldgenset]

I appreciate the welcome.
Yep, your memory is still intact. lol. I am in the Richmond Va area.

 

[oldgenset]

a little more info and a few more questions

Well even though its been pouring rain for 4 days. I did get an chance tocheck out the hol-gar. It will be a work in progress. But it does appear to be 95% intact. The electrics panel,when I opened it is being used for winter storage for nuts. Gotta love woodland critters. That said, the wiring does not appear to be damaged by them. It may actually make a decent running generator without to much effort. I do have some concerns. The Carb probably needs a rebuild kit, The governor has caulk sealant so it has been gone in. My biggest issue right now is what is the availability of parts?

The motor can be turned over by hand, at least some, so I don't think its frozen. I do see the rotor buttom begin to move when I hand cranked it.

It is missing the bendix unit for the starter. Does anyone know a current part number and where I may get it from?

Thanks.

 

[oldgenset]

Well even though its been pouring rain for 4 days. I did get an chance tocheck out the hol-gar. It will be a work in progress. But it does appear to be 95% intact. The electrics panel,when I opened it is being used for winter storage for nuts. Gotta love woodland critters. That said, the wiring does not appear to be damaged by them. It may actually make a decent running generator without to much effort. I do have some concerns. The Carb probably needs a rebuild kit, The governor has caulk sealant so it has been gone in. My biggest issue right now is what is the availability of parts?

The motor can be turned over by hand, at least some, so I don't think its frozen. I do see the rotor buttom begin to move when I hand cranked it.

It is missing the bendix unit for the starter. Does anyone know a current part number and where I may get it from?

Thanks.

I have been reviewing some pictures on here about the generator. Something odd has just struck me. All of the pics I have seen online show that the engine has a magneto. Here is my question. Do any of you know why this particular one has a distributor setting on it? I look at the pics and the 4 ignition wires come out the left side of the magneto. But not on this engine, it has a distributor. Could this be a jury rig item?
Thanks

 

[jonesal]

See http://www.steelsoldiers.com/showthread.php?36147-Gen-Set-CE-106-AC-WK-9 for the list of TMs.
For parts use the -35P. Sometimes you get lucky and find it, sometimes you have to dig in and find an equivalent replacement.

The distributor is not correct for the FS162 however is correct for the F162. The F162 was used on everything from pumps to welders to... The FS162 has the "hole in the head" for a distributor so who knows what you have. See previous warning about the military standard engine. The mag is obviously used to start the genset with a dead battery. I tried it and it actually works pretty good.

As far as a bendix, your search for parts begins! If you buy the genset, let me know and I'll try and post the pages for the starter. It's a shunt starter so be aware of that.

Carb Kit for Marvel Schebler TSX820, Tomco 5356
Ohio Carbon Industries has brushes
Full Engine Gasket Set, Victor Rinz FS1634A to Napa FPG FS7183PT
...etc...

I can't find any stater information at the moment.

And I was able to finally collect the correct shielded mag ignition wires. Note the Slick mag is a female, not male making it very weird. There's a guy in Chicago that ?was? selling NOS mags for $75 which is more than a good deal. You can search for him on google.

Good luck.

Al Jones

 

[jonesal]

One other thing that just struck me, use the wiring diagram ON the genset. The wiring diagram in my TM is close but I think it's generic. The one on the side of my genset must match my serial number and has been exact. I removed mine and keep it off the genny so it doesn't fade any more than it has.





Al Jones