Is the starter relay supposed to be normally closed?

[TexAndy]

So I'm trying to get this 1009 going.

I just put new batts in it and I replaced the starter relay with Oreilly part# 7018601 per the doghead mod thread.

When I turn the ignition, the relay clicks, but the starter motor doesn't activate.

With the ignition switch set to "off" and my multimeter leads on the load posts of the starter relay, I read battery voltage. When I turn the ignition switch to "Start", the coil engages and the voltage reading at the load posts on the relay drops to zero.

That seems exactly opposite of the way it should be, to me.


Also, my ignition turns without the key. I can turn it without putting the key in the lock. Don't know if that would have any bearing on the situation.

 

[doghead]

Let's clarify some things.

When I turn the ignition, the relay clicks, but the starter motor doesn't activate

Turn the ignition? Turn it to what? Key on, or to the start position?

With the ignition switch set to "off" and my multimeter leads on the load posts of the starter relay, I read battery voltage. When I turn the ignition switch to "Start", the coil engages and the voltage reading at the load posts on the relay drops to zero.

Could you refer to the wire colors, rather than "load posts"?

You said the relay clicks with the key (somewhere) and "engages" in the start position. What do you mean by engages, it's a relay, not a solenoid.

What battery voltage? 12 or 24 volts?

Can you post a picture of what you did(wire connections)?

Is your trucks wiring stock, and still using a 24 volt starter?

You should get 12V at the small purple with white tracer wire in the start position only. Test this first.

 

[TexAndy]

Red wire and solid purple wire. Reads 25V with ignition in the off position.

It's a relay. The coil engages when I turn the ignition to start. I can both hear this (and feel it, because I'm holding multimeter leads against it) and measure that it is happening by reading 12V at the black and purple/white wire when I turn the ignition.

It has stock everything except for the starter relay I just added.

Pic of the relay:

 

[doghead]

Disconnect all the wires and confirm that you have continuity between the large terminals. If that shows continuity, then your relay is wrong or bad.

The relay needs to be a normally open relay.

 

[doghead]

Is your starter turning over, or did you disconnect it for all this testing?

 

[doghead]

Red wire and solid purple wire. Reads 25V with ignition in the off position.

Your starter should be turning over if there is 25 volts at both of those wires.

 

[TexAndy]

Starter is connected but not turning over. I just got this vehicle at auction and haven't gotten it to run, yet.

Relay shows continuity... sort of. Measuring between the two big terminals in the 200k ohm range, it reads 40. Is 40k ohms continuity?

 

[Keith_J]

The two fat terminals on the relay...one will have 24 v, the other zero until the key is in start, then both will have 24 v referenced to ground. If voltage on fat terms drops to zero with key in start, trace the fat wires, one goes to back battery, the other to starter solenoid on the starter.

call me anytime , I am on bed rest per docs orders. Left arm radiculopathy sucks.

 

[doghead]

Lower your ohms range.

It should have no continuity.

Do you see what I'm saying about if the large purple wire had 25 volst to it, the starter should have been cranking.


Did it crank or start before you started?

Is the starter connected?

 

[TexAndy]

With lower range selected reads "1" aka outside the range.

The starter is connected and I agree, it should have cranked as soon as I hooked up the batteries even with the ignition in the off position. It did not.

 

[doghead]

Ok, now connect the small wires(only) and measure ohms across the large terminals.

Should see 1(infinate) with key on, and in start position it should be close to 0.

If this happens, then all is well with your relay.

Red wire and solid purple wire. Reads 25V with ignition in the off position.

Then you need to confirm that this true, if it is, it need to be addressed.

Then it is time to drop the starter and diagnose it.

 

[doghead]

How were you measuring the 25 volts at the red and purple wires?

Did you have your meter leads on them both at the same time, or one to ground and the other on one wire at a time?

 

[Keith_J]

Talked to Andy last night...he is clear on diagnosis.

For the record, hot wiring a CUCV is easy, just give the pink wire on the ip 12 volts, then connect the two larger wires on the starter relay to actuate the starter. With aftermarket relay (aka "Doghead relay mod"), a short length of 10 gauge wire can be used to jumper the main terminals of this relay.

So it is essential all terminals on this relay be insulated.

 

[doghead]

Post # 10 contradicts his previous posts.

Talked to Andy last night...he is clear on diagnosis.

Meaning what?

 

[Keith_J]

Uh, he called me around 2100 yesterday. We talked for ~30 minutes. That would be at least 7 pages of posts here

 

[doghead]

So, is discussion in this thread over then?

I'll close it so that myself and other do not waste our time replying to it.

It left some questions, in my mind.

 

[TexAndy]

It was the starter.

I pulled the starter and did the no-load test described in the 28MT starter service manual. No movement or spark with +12V across B and S and ground cable touched to frame of motor.

Then checked for continuity between the B terminal and the Motor terminal. No continuity. According to the service manual, that indicates a "break or fault in winding continuity" and calls for replacement of the solenoid.

Anyone know where I can find just a replacement solenoid? The rebuild kit linked to in the FAQ page doesn't seem to include one. Or at least, doesn't indicate so.

eta: NM, found it.
http://www.texasindustrialelectric.com/starter_solenoids.asp

 

[mkcoen]

So at this point is everything on hold until you get a new solenoid? My MKT delivery fell through until after 7/7 so I'm free but not heading that way unless needed.

 

[TexAndy]

No point in coming down here until I've got the part in. Hopefully I'll at least have it running by then.

 

[southdave]

I know J &N electic has them for about 40 bucks that was 3yrs ago.. Beeville is close to to corpus should have supply house closer that would have them in stock.