Flyingvan911
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I have a pyro on my LDS. I just installed it a while back. I will try to get some numbers this weekend. Speed, rpm, boost and egt.
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Yes, 'just the distributor and high pressure pump" -- but what determines WHEN an injector squirts? When the pressure exceeds the injector pressure rating, right? Depending on the specifics of how the pump is designed that can be varied pump-to-pump. We used to hand grind new 'cam plates" (yah, I know it is more a "throttle plate" but bear with me a sec -- hold yer hp lol) for Bosch inline pumps for early FI petrol/methanol engines and the shape of the 'cam' (don't remember what Bosch called em now darn it) made a HIGE difference whether rich-lean. And THAT gents is EXACTLY what we've been trying to chase down -- when the LDS becomes 'rich' for fuel vs the LDT.The pump TM lists different part numbers but identifies no differences for the HH. It is not considered a serviceable component and is to be replaced as a unit. This is due to the lapped fit of the piston. With the exception of an older model that has an extra oil passage and that can be plugged. Hornet you may be onto something, just not sure what, if the head makes pressure and has flow capability, what else is there?
The head does not set the timing, it is just the distributor and the high pressure pump.
The short answer is "NO". Yah, the turbos were added to deal with smoke issues for which the DoD was getting grief. And the turbos drastically reduced smoke especially for engines that had been turned up -- when did WarDept/DoD go to seals on the pumps? Did they always have seals?I have seen people comment that a "Turbo does not increase power, it was done for emissions only". Is it possible that a turbo could NOT increase power? Not relivant to a LDT/LDS conversation, but it doesnt make much sense to me.
Y'all forgive me becauswe I don't know how to drive this forum properly but this quote if from TM America back 27 DEC 09 msg #21 from the thread on "max HO out of 465 multi-fuel" http://www.steelsoldiers.com/showth...f-a-465-multi-fuel/page3&highlight=hypercycle , to whit:Yes, 'just the distributor and high pressure pump" -- but what determines WHEN an injector squirts? When the pressure exceeds the injector pressure rating, right? Depending on the specifics of how the pump is designed that can be varied pump-to-pump. We used to hand grind new 'cam plates" (yah, I know it is more a "throttle plate" but bear with me a sec -- hold yer hp lol) for Bosch inline pumps for early FI petrol/methanol engines and the shape of the 'cam' (don't remember what Bosch called em now darn it) made a HIGE difference whether rich-lean. And THAT gents is EXACTLY what we've been trying to chase down -- when the LDS becomes 'rich' for fuel vs the LDT.
Both engines CAN provide enough air at low rpms but the LDT will burn pistons easily when making "the black smoke" which is HP. I'll wager that the LDS can be turned up more for fuel without having EGT problems (not enough air and/or exhaust restricted -- don't forget the exhaust) compared to the LDT. I've not seen anybody with a seriously turned up LDS but the LDS-2 sounds like such an engine and it REQUIRED other mods to keep up with the 200hp levels of the 8x8 trucks' engines. Such as better oil circ for cooling and narrowed oil clearances on the crank and (prolly) cam bearings -- all indicators of more oil press because otherwise you can't build sufficient pressure -- the excess oil just drains past the journals without going where intended. This does NOT affect journal bearing capacity with regard to crankshaft pressure s due to combustion -- that's is all determined by bearing size because these are "hydrodynamic" bearings and self-pressurize.
Engines are faar more complex than they seem and they SEEM really complex!
Even in the low compression tractors, these engines were relatively short lived:What is the DESIGN life of these engines?? How long did the military expect them to last MTBO (mean time between overhaul)??
I've been assuming that the MIL expected something similar to civilian engines but realized suddenly that that is an ASSumption on my part and I have zero data to back it up.
Does anybody KNOW what Continental was promising for engine life when these engines were first delivered? Anybody know a retired Continental or Herc engineer or perhaps a son of same?
hornet on the hunt
If you would include engine hours and mileage (if they are still connected to the engine being overhauled) that would be very helpful. The engine is my LR 110 has it's own small Hobbs meter (I still use the term -- like "Crescent wrench") that's on the fuel control solenoid for true "engine hours". I'll try to remember to PM TM America to see what the engine hours are.TM Americas motor is still running.
I have both ldt and lds motors, both run 1200 deg
when I do the head gasket job I will try to measure the heads and rockers as I am putting ldt heads on an lds.
I guess the LDS-465 referred to w/210 hp must be the -2 version. I'd sure like to know what the MTBO was intended to be and what they considered normal MTBF.I get the impression Continental engineers were just on the cusp of Multifuel engine development when the LDx-465s were introduced. Here's a snippet from a SAE paper written by a Continental Aviation & Engineering employee to explain changes over the LDS-427 model.
View attachment 401011
TM america doesn't own that truck anymore.I'll try to remember to PM TM America to see what the engine hours are.
Would sure like to know what they had in mind when discussing those more powerful configurations. Would be absolutely thrilled if I could get anywhere near 500ft/lbs out of my LDS.I get the impression Continental engineers were just on the cusp of Multifuel engine development when the LDx-465s were introduced. Here's a snippet from a SAE paper written by a Continental Aviation & Engineering employee to explain changes over the LDS-427 model.
View attachment 401011
Just so. That's why I put a little mini-hourmeter on the engine itself. Pull the engine and the hourmeter goes with it. Tyvek pocket tag attached for rebuild data for when the times eventually comes along.TM america doesn't own that truck anymore.
My motors are not original to the trucks, I put them in there. No way to tell hrs and milage. Anyone here can tell you I have put thousands of miles on the LDS one though.
Looks like this engine is about maxed out as far as EGT is concerned.Speed-mph; RPM; Boost; EGT, Engine Temp
6) 55; 2,450; 12; 1,032; 160
Level highway.
7) 50; 2,200; 13; 1,085; 165
Highway. Going up a substantial hill. (I-635 north between I-70 and I-35 in Kansas City.) Gradually slowing down the the pedal all the way down.
8- 45; 1,900; 12; 1,192; 165
The slowest point just before the hill starts to level off. Pedal still all the way down.
Good data Time stamps would be perfect lol! Seriously though thank you for gathering the data. Looks like a healthy engine operating under design load. EGT didn't peak real fast and stayed same under cruising load until you got well into the hill and slowed to 45. Boost stayed down as did EGT under light load. 12 psi boost is the high end of spec from the TM. 55 mph @ 2450 rpm: was that against the governor or just full pedal?Here it is...
LDS pyro/boost info.
I drove the deuce some today and with the help of Soldier B and a camera I got some numbers to report. Since I am a novice at diesel engine workings I will leave it up to the experts on the site to draw conclusions and interpret the data. The outside temp was 30 degrees I started the deuce and let it warm up. I then drove about four miles on the side streets to let it warm up everything else. Then I hit the highway. Here are the numbers and what was going on at that moment.
Speed-mph; RPM; Boost; EGT, Engine Temp
1) 0; 750; 0; 250; 150
I let the engine warm up all that it would. About 10 min time.
2) 0; 1,200; 0; 262; 150
After the engine starts and the oil gets flowing I pull the hand throttle and let the engine warm up at about this rpm.
3) 40; 1,750; 9; 1,057; 160
On the street going up a slight grade.
4) 0; 750; 0; 357; 160
Stopped at a red light.
5) 55; 2,450; 8; 891; 160
On the highway. Slight downgrade.
6) 55; 2,450; 12; 1,032; 160
Level highway.
7) 50; 2,200; 13; 1,085; 165
Highway. Going up a substantial hill. (I-635 south between I-70 and I-35 in Kansas City.) Gradually slowing down the the pedal all the way down.
8- 45; 1,900; 12; 1,192; 165
The slowest point just before the hill starts to level off. Pedal still all the way down.
9) 55; 2,450; 5; 708; 160
Going down the other side of the hill.
10) 0; 700; 0; 477; 160
At a red light at the bottom of the off ramp from the highway.
11) 0; 700; 0; 242; 150
I parked the deuce for the day and let it idle for five minutes before shut down.
The columns of numbers didn't come out right.
Excellent data. Thanks again! I love the 'temp' gauge setup. My first Land Rover has such a temp setup for about five years My excuse is "I was in college" and I'm stickin to it!I have not modified any settings of the IP or engine except to add spin-on oil filter adapters. I changed my fuel filters this summer and they have less than 1,000 miles on them so the engine is getting as much fuel as the IP will allow. It also has the stock deuce air filter. No muffler yet. The engine is a LDS-465-1A with a C turbo. And the whistler screams on the highway. Rotella 15W40 oil. I have never had a hiccup out of the engine. (Except for delaying changing the primary filter. Changed it and everything was back to normal.) The truck has 45,265 miles and 1,526 hours on the engine if the gauges are original.
The whole drive was 45 minutes or less. 10 minutes or so warming up while doing pre-trip checks.
It is a M35A2 with 9.00x20 NDT’s. The truck was empty with bows and tarp on. As well as the winter cover over the grill. The boost gauge is a basic yet quality one from the auto parts store. I used copper tubing instead of the plastic it came with. I temporarily bolted it to the bottom of the dash using one of the empty bolt holes below the instrument panel. The pyro is a 24vdc Auber off of Ebay. It came with the probe which it into the manifold about 1/2" or a little more. The meter is tie-strapped to the rifle mount for now. I have a piece of metal to make a mount for both. It will also hold switches for a back-up light and an IR lamp for the front.
2,450 at 55 is my max speed by self control. The engine and truck will go up to 2,900 and just over 60 mph with the pedal on the floor on level highway. We only did this once just to see what it would do.
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