M35a2 oils

[rustystud]

I have been using 40 w motor oil for over 3 years in a daily driver. I hope going back to gear oil helps you problem but these transmissions were designed to run on engine oil.

Wrong, Wrong, Wrong. How many times are we going to do this dance ? This time I want you to provide proof that these transmissions where suppose to be run with engine oil ! Either that or stop giving out misleading information. Many new people read this and when you give out bad information it only hurts our organization. Like the guy on Dragnet used to say " just the facts" .

EDIT: The facts are posted later on here.

 

[rustystud]

I have one other thing I want to mention. In the mornings when the temperature is in the low 40's it shifted good. As it warmed up it started to act up. In the afternoon when the temperature is in the low 80's it shifted bad all the time.

I had a large 4X4 truck once that the transfer-case used to howl in the summer if I didn't use 140W gear oil. Remember this oil is like water when it gets hot ( trust me I have the burn scars to prove it) so it's not like your running molasses in it. In the winter I would use 80/90W gear oil. Ran great for years. I tore it down after 10 years to check it out before repowering the truck with a new engine . It was in excellent shape. Sold the truck a few years later and never heard of any complaints from the guy. That was 10 years ago.

 

[rustystud]

I will be doing some tranny/transfer work and in the process changing the oils. I have been following the "oil" discussion and can relate to your hard won knowledge on oil weights. Hope the syncros and gears have survived the somewhat brief immersion in 30 weight. I presume you are going to check for "shavings" even though this was a short time. Not sure what the best procedure would be to flush the tranny of the 30 weight or if it is even needed. Perhaps Rustystud has a comment.

As long as there are no "chunks" I wouldn't worry about it.

 

[welldigger]

Wrong, Wrong, Wrong. How many times are we going to do this dance ? This time I want you to provide proof that these transmissions where suppose to be run with engine oil ! Either that or stop giving out misleading information. Many new people read this and when you give out bad information it only hurts our organization. Like the guy on Dragnet used to say " just the facts" .

Actually he's more correct than you realize. As I have stated over and over non detergent engine oil and gl-1 gear lube are just about identical. Hence why the guy who invented over dive for the deuce suggests it.

 

[rustystud]

Actually he's more correct than you realize. As I have stated over and over non detergent engine oil and gl-1 gear lube are just about identical. Hence why the guy who invented over dive for the deuce suggests it. View attachment 587270

Notice they say "MAY be used" and not "recommended to use". Also they mention many different weights of oils up to 50w in the pamphlet. They didn't say to use 30W in transmissions. I stand by all my statements. 80/90w is not engine oil ! and engine oil is not gear oil. They say in the TM's you can use gasoline in a deuce too. Are you telling me that, that is the "recommended" fuel for a deuce ? I don't think so. Just try and use gasoline as a steady diet for your deuce and see what happens. Same with this non-detergent engine oil. Use it as a steady diet and see what happens.
For the record, who is this "guy" who "invented" the overdrive for the deuce ? I'm pretty sure it was a team at Spicer who came up with it.

 

[welldigger]

Notice they say "MAY be used" and not "recommended to use". Also they mention many different weights of oils up to 50w in the pamphlet. They didn't say to use 30W in transmissions. I stand by all my statements. 80/90w is not engine oil ! and engine oil is not gear oil. They say in the TM's you can use gasoline in a deuce too. Are you telling me that, that is the "recommended" fuel for a deuce ? I don't think so. Just try and use gasoline as a steady diet for your deuce and see what happens. Same with this non-detergent engine oil. Use it as a steady diet and see what happens.

I'm not going to entertain another senseless argument over the exact labeling of oil products when over and over lube manufacturers state that non detergent engine oil is interchangeable with gl-1 gear lube. Especially when the msds is almost exactly the same if not exactly the same depending on manufacturer. They both lack any notable additive package because they are both just base oil.

I'm not trying to say that 40w is superior to whatever lube you choose to use. But to say you can't use it or that 40w, 30w, or whatever won't work just fine is false. Period. Especially with hundreds of transmissions way more advanced and complex than a spicer that specifically state to use engine oil.

Never mind the hundreds of deuce owners who run engine oil in the transmission that encounter no problems with it at all.

Do I recommend 40w as an acceptable transmission lube based on personal experience and useage? Yes I do. Is it best for every truck in every climate? Probably not. Use what works best for you.

Heck the most up to date tm states to use gl-5 gear lube. My truck didn't shift worth a darn with gl-5. With 40w it shifts perfect. Is that the case with every truck? No.

O and gl-1 isn't 80w-90. I never said that.

 

[Aussie Bloke]

G'day everyone,.....

I just got back from a 35 mile joy ride and the transmission is shifting perfectly. Now I can say with 100% certainty that the 30 weight oil was the cause of my problem.

Well this says it all for me,....

I think we can agree that in an emergency situation where no other oil is available we can use 30W (40-50W better) oil to get going again until we can get hold of 80W-90.



Aussie.

 

[rustystud]

I just deleted this whole post as the information was incorrect. I have since learned 50W engine oil is OK for manual transmissions.

 

[Another Ahab]

Deuces.

With Overdrive Transmissions.

At 40 Paces.

 

[Another Ahab]

Hey. Just kidding.

 

[mobileauto2000]

Rustystud.

I did not just pull the motor oil stuff out of thin air. Someone posted the Spicer documentation on this site. I have had no luck finding it to link to this thread. After I read that Spicer recommended 30, 40 or 50w engine oil I decided to try it. I went with 40w because it was what was available. After a few weeks my transmission shifted with out grinding gears and was much easier to get into second coming to a stop. This is why I want people to know that engine oil is ok because others may have the same shifting problems I did and switching to 40w fixed it.

I know you are looking out for the members here so I take no offence. I wish I could find that lube order from Spicer. If someone knows where it is please post it up.

 

[FLYWHEEL]

Hi all, I may make myself look stupid here ( but someones got to say it) if it says gear oil on the tin, surely that's what it is for, and if it says engine oil that is the place to put it, The clues in the name.

 

[rustystud]

View attachment Scan.pdfOK I found out something today. First I have to eat a little "crow" and say to "welldigger" (Jake) that he was right. To a point.
I called Spicer Technical assistance and Tremec Technical assistance today and asked what oils do they recommend.
The guy at Spicer said they no longer make any manuals transmissions or oils. They sold that whole division to "Tremec" . So after calling Tremec I talked with a nice gentleman who said I was right about the oils. The only problem was I was right in "my day" . In todays oils they recommend that you use 50w oil in all manual transmissions. Though some of the newest Roadranger transmissions are coming out with 40W from the factory. This oil can be regular engine oil as long as it's a straight weight. So yes you can use engine oils in transmissions. He provided me with a list of suppliers that are OEM approved. This also answers my question about using 50W like I was planning on doing later this year. If you are experiencing problems with your synchros he recommended you use a GL5 80/90W oil. It must be GL5 rated though. Any other oil can actually eat your yellow metal synchros.

 

[rustystud]

View attachment Scan0009.pdf Here's the second page. For some reason I did not upload with the first page. As you can see over half the oils recommended are synthetic. I will be going to use the "Shell SPIRAX S6 GME 50" in my deuce later this year.

 

[Another Ahab]

OK I found out something today. First I have to eat a little "crow" and say to "welldigger" (Jake) that he was right. To a point.
So after calling Tremec I talked with a nice gentleman who said I was right about the oils. The only problem was I was right in "my day" ..

Thank you, rustystud, for going to the trouble to make the calls and nail down a final kind of answer. Some folk don't go that distance and instead just blow smoke with arguments, and that's no fun.

 

[welldigger]

I'm not an ase certified master mechanic but I did stay at a holiday Inn express once.

 

[rustystud]

I'm not an ase certified master mechanic but I did stay at a holiday Inn express once.

The way things have gone lately, that's just as good ! and with my certification and $5.00 I can buy a Starbucks coffee !

 

[rustystud]

I feel like a 1800 century Doctor who has just been informed of the new treatment for patients. It goes something like this; "What do you mean Blood letting is no longer an acceptable form of treatment ? How else are you going to get the evil humors out of the body ? " .
What else is going to change ? When will this madness end ?!?!?!

 

[Big Dumb Truck]

Look on the bright side, my transmission was saved because of this conversation. I'm positive that if I had kept driving it with 30 weight in it, it would be scrap soon.

 

[welldigger]

I feel like a 1800 century Doctor who has just been informed of the new treatment for patients. It goes something like this; "What do you mean Blood letting is no longer an acceptable form of treatment ? How else are you going to get the evil humors out of the body ? " .
What else is going to change ? When will this madness end ?!?!?!

Man I'm with you. If your not confused enough already my f350 with the zf-650 takes atf. As does many other heavy duty gear boxes.

If you don't think about it then it makes sense lol.