MEP-802A ac circuit interrupter relay issue

[Xlandscaper]

Hey guys so I start my generator, let it warm up, flip the switch and there and I notice that the green circuit open/closed bulb starts to fade out. I got power out of the terminals and the gauge shows my load percentage. So I puus to test and nothing... I shut the machine down, take the bulb out it investigate and everything seems in order so I fire it up again an now the bulb stays off and there is no power going to the lugs!!! It was just working before?? So I flip the switch 10-15 times and voila it produces power. So the next few days when I go to use it it won't produce power again. Convince outlets work but nothing from the lugs. I downloaded the TM and tested the switch and that checks out fine and proceed to check the ac circuit interrupter relay and it seems to be bad. I am not getting continuity (with the jumper wire connected) to a1/a2, b1/b2, c1/c2 but I do get it on 11/12. Anyone know how this thing crapped out? Is it fixable? Where can I get a replacement? Also, before all the testing I replaced the push to test bulb and tried it again, it lit for a few seconds then looks like it fried out same goes with the battle short! Any thoughts on that? Thanks for the help guys.

 

[DieselAddict]

Do you hear the relay click when you flip the switch each time?

 

[Xlandscaper]

When the machine is off?

 

[Guyfang]

I think Diesel Addict ment running. Most of the time you can hear and feel it. Doesn't ALWAYS mean it's working properly, but if it doesn't do anything, it is one troubleshooting steep closer to fixing it. Have you troubleshot IAW, (In Accordance With) the troubleshooting diagram in the -24 manual?

When you say AC interrupter relay, you mean K-1?

 

[Xlandscaper]

Yes, I went along with the 24TM. The ac circuit interrupter relay is (4) in the diagnosis diagram not sure if it's k-1... I tested both the switch on the panel (which checked out ok) then removed the top panel from the set to gain access to the relay and tested it as per the TM and as far as I believe it failed the 2nd portion on the test where u connect a jumper from the starting relay to X on the ac circuit interrupter relay

 

[Guyfang]

You can take the relay out, (and yes, its K-1) to test it on your workbench. When you take it apart, you might find that it has water in it, or has at some time previously, had water in it. There is a very good thread in the forum which describes how this was done and how the relay was repaired. After taking out the K-1, remove it from its container. Then take two wires from your 24 volt source, and touch the X&Y terminals. See it it works. Just because it jumps or thumps, dosnt mean its closing properly. But if it does move, then you need to check the individual contacts. When you tested it with the jumper, did it thump/clunk?

 

[Xlandscaper]

I'm so glad you guys are here and know whats going on! When I tested it with the jumper it didn't do a dam thing. Just sat there like a brick. I'm gonna go grab the machine now and see if I can get it out n try to disassemble it

 

[Xlandscaper]

Ok so K-1 is out and disassembled and it looks brand new! Doesn't look like it's seen a drop of water at all. Also x/y when contacted with 24v does thump/ clunk

 

[Xlandscaper]

How would one go about testing each contact point? Do I just give it voltage at x/y and check for continuity between the poles or is there something different I should do?

 

[Xlandscaper]

Ok so I took the whol relay apart and out of continues fiddling with it it seems that the magnet isn't strong enough to pull down the contact poles. I sanded everything down a bit to clean the it up a bit and to make the best possible contact, then re assembled it and installed it back into the generator. Well it still doesn't work and I think I may need a new relay. I do hear the audible "click" now that Diesel addict was talking about but I think the pull just isn't strong enough to complete the circuit. Anyone know anything more?

 

[Dewie38]

Is it a Magnetek or a Contact Industries contactor?

 

[Guyfang]

Slow down partner. Before you put it back into the set, would have been a good time to test all the contacts. I would have used two wires with alligator clips on them. Connect the one side to 24 volts, and the other side to X&Y. It would hopefully go klunk. Leave the wires on. Then take a multimeter and measure across the A1 to A2 for continuity. And so on. all three output terminals. Then the last set of contacts for the light on the panel. Make sure your 24 volt source is charged up.

 

[Xlandscaper]

Is it a Magnetek or a Contact Industries contactor?

Its the Magtek one Jag-6008

 

[Xlandscaper]

Slow down partner. Before you put it back into the set, would have been a good time to test all the contacts. I would have used two wires with alligator clips on them. Connect the one side to 24 volts, and the other side to X&Y. It would hopefully go klunk. Leave the wires on. Then take a multimeter and measure across the A1 to A2 for continuity. And so on. all three output terminals. Then the last set of contacts for the light on the panel. Make sure your 24 volt source is charged up.

I did test every termial. From what I can see when I had it all apart and would apply voltage is that the contacts don't fully touch the points when voltage is applied. When I push down on the middle contact pad rocker thing a little bit it fully makes contact and it completes the circuit and I get contanuity across all the points. What would happen if I cut 1 coil off the spring in there to help it take up so,em of the travel?

 

[csheath]

I would spray it with WD40 and blow the excess off then try it again.

 

[Xlandscaper]

Ok so I removed the cover again and started the set to test it on the generator and nothing. So I took a block of wood and when flipping the circuit to closed it clicks but doesn't fully close. So just to test I pushed down on top of the open relay with the wood and instant power. I'm at the end with this thing. Frustration has set in. The machine only has 27 original hours when I got it and only has 42 now.

 

[DieselAddict]

Sorry to drop off suddenly. Work got busy.

If cleaning it and exercising it doesn't solve the problem quickly the best thing is to replace it. Bad contacts can cause a fire. You don't want to play around with that.

 

[Guyfang]

Is your 24 volts, really 24 volts? If the batteries are not up to snuff, then you need to correct that. Remember, nothing works right without the proper voltage.

K-1 Relay-Part Number: 88-21066, NSN: 6110-01-367-8921. The part fits every gen set from 5 KW to 60 KW in the TQG family. It also fits the MEP-004 and MEP-005A. So finding one should not be a problem. Below is listed the various manufacturers.

Cost to the gov: $208.00

CONTACT INDUSTRIES INC.

25 INDUSTRIAL DR

MANSFIELD

OH

44903-8699

UNITED STATES

AMETEK INC.

DIV AMETEK PRESTOLITE SWITCH

2166 LAUREL VLY DR

TOLEDO

OH

43614-2034

UNITED STATES

PRESTOLITE ELECTRIC INCORPORATED

46200 PORT ST

PLYMOUTH

MI

48170-6048

UNITED STATES

DEPARTMENT OF DEFENSE PROJECT

MANAGER-MOBILE ELECTRIC POWER

10205 BURBECK RD SUITE 105

FORT BELVOIR

VA

22060-5863

UNITED STATES

PRESTOLITE ELECTRIC INC

HWY 20 W

2205

DECATUR

AL

35609-2205

UNITED STATES

EATON CORPORATION

DBA FLUID POWER DIV DIV POWER AND

LOAD MANAGEMENT SYSTEMS

2250 WHITFIELD AVE

SARASOTA

FL

34243-3926

UNITED STATES

 

[Dewie38]

sorry, it was Ametek not Magnetek.
We had issues with the Ametek contactors and had to replace them in the field with new Contact Industries.
The contacts do not make when the coil is energized.
The indicator light would come on and you would think the contacts were closed but there was some kind of inserts that would come unseated with the clunking of the contactor over some time. The whole insides would end up being shifted and not making contact.

 

[Guyfang]

Dewie, you are worth your weight in gold!