MEP-804A Crank duration

[Guyfang]

Some times the gasket is very hard to dislodge. Tap harder. Its only two bolts. If you have them out, the starter WILL come out.

 

[Evvy Fesler]

Okay, thanks. We needed confidence. There’s a gasket? Missed that in the parts layout.

 

[Guyfang]

Sometimes. Sometimes its a liquid gasket. And sometimes its just hard to come out. Leave the bolt/ nut on, loose, and wack it one with a sand hammer. Dead blow hammer. With the bolt/nut still on, the starter will not fall down, nor will you have your candy snatchers in the way,. So then give it a "Sharp" wack!

 

[Evvy Fesler]

37-minutes from when Guy posted the above, the old one is out and the new one is installed. The generator engine starts the way that it should. Yay!

This thread isn’t closed yet. I took a lot of pictures, which I’ll go through and post later tonight. My mechanic duties temporarily over, it’s time to shower and put supper on the table.

Thank you all and TTYL!

 

[Guyfang]

37 min? That long?!!

Whats for dinner? May have to come over sometime.

 

[Evvy Fesler]

It’s summer. Brats, sour kraut warmed in beer, and German potato salad. What else would anyone have on a hot Sunday night?

 

[Guyfang]

If you lived in Germany, Tex-Mex sounds REAL GOOD!

 

[Guyfang]

But yes, I will be right over!!

 

[Evvy Fesler]

This post closes out this thread. I learned a handful of valuable lessons that I want to share. Let's start with an admission that I never learn this one because I make this mistake over and over again. Rule #1 - Let the problem talk to you! When I started researching what I thought was a crank duration problem, I landed on that idea because of threads on this website that I had read. I got caught up in MPU (Magnetic Pickup Unit) and relays, and RPMs and... and... and... A lot of these threads didn't finish so I don't know their outcomes, something that I'll talk about shortly. Because I let myself get caught up in the overwhelming research I forgot my own Rule #2 - Don't confuse symptoms with root cause. Just because I had what appeared to be similar symptoms as other threads didn't mean that their root cause was my root cause, Rule #3 - reach out to your trusted mentors. Thanks to all of you who put up with me as I worked my way through this. You kept pulling me back into focus, something obviously noticed by all but me!

Let the problem talk to you. I've heard the Bendix mechanism (named after Mr. Bendix) wind out on other bad starters. Why wasn't this started the same as all of the others? Because it was military? Because it has a Start switch that's also meant to flash the generator? No! It was just like any other starter. Maybe the solenoid or maybe the starter. $100 later I had a rebuilt one that works/fits the Isuzu C240 engine, arguable one of the more successful 4-cylinder diesel motors made. There's literally millions of them made over the years. Starters are easy to get,

As you read a couple of posts ago, I was in the middle of removing it when I ran into a problem. If you were to tell me that women aren't as capable as men are, I'd challenge... "have you met me?" But... I'll be the first to admit that I'm not as strong! When the starter didn't come out, I looked again at the parts manual and at the replacement. Two bolts. Count them! Actually one was a stud. With stud nut loosened almost all the way and bottom bolt out, this thing should have come out. Easily. Not so! Thanks Guy for your patient coaching. He told me to make sure the top nut was on the stud, but "very loose" and then give it a "smart tap." Yeah well... that's where Evvy isn't as strong as Guy is! Now I have to work smarter not harder. A 2x4 solved the problem. No, I didn't whack it with a 2x4. Well actually, I did. Here's how. The casting on the starter sticks up and mounts the solenoid. I was able to run a length of 2x4 in through the air filter door and butt up against the solenoid mount. If I tapped the 2x4 then it would push the starter out. I tapped it with a mallet. No go. Again. No go. Something else Guy said. It will come out. Oh what the heck... I stood back like a batter in the batting cage and let the 2x4 have it. It came out! Lesson learned? Reach out to your mentors and gain confidence.

I'll post pictures next, but I want to share something else Guy told me. I promised him that I will learn and in turn make a contribution to this body of knowledge. He pointed out to me that I had already made a contribution by posting the thread. And he said... better still when you follow up and post the solution.

 

[Evvy Fesler]

Read the TM and study the parts diagram and layout.

Disconnect the negative terminal of the battery (manual says so).


Mark all of the wires. Okay, so I cheated a little here. I took photos of them and wrote in the manual what my pics were showing. Pic #1 was this and Pic #2 connected to here and Pic #3 connected there. I'll print the pics tomorrow and stick the into the manual, but at the time, I had a picture essay and my notes. And I'm glad I did! If anyone reading this thread in the future finds themselves wondering what wire goes where on their generator, reach out to me and I'll send the notes and pics.



Normally I would have removed the bottom bolt first, but the top stud had a wire under the nut and I wanted all of the wires out of the way in case my box wrench slipped. I didn't want to guillotine a wire with wrench against a casting with a wire in-between. As Guy pointed out, put the nut on enough to hold the starter so when it comes out it doesn't fall on your toes. Ouch! Next the bottom bolt came out.

The starter was hard and fast stuck in place. See previous post. It took persuasion to get it out.

Inspect the teeth on the starter and on the flywheel. Broken teeth are a problem. Mine didn't have any. Phew! Note: A cellphone camera makes this easy because you can set the timer and insert your camera in the opening and wait for it to take the picture (turn the flash on).



Clean surfaces, rub some grease on them, or oil... not too much. Just enough to curb rusting.
Reverse the assembly process.



Double check against your pictures and be sure to count the wires just to make sure you got them all.

Connect the negative terminal on the battery.

Now my engine starts like it's supposed to. YAY!

Quick note about parts selection. My goal is to use this generator as a three phase generator for some farm motors and also as an emergency power source for our house (single phase). As such, I'm not making any attempt to source military grade parts unless I have to because commercial parts aren't available. I know from reading your posts that many of you are restoring equipment for show and historical preservation. I admire that. I may join you on another project now that I've gotten my feet wet on this one. Anyway, Rule #4 - know your goals and always buy good parts.

Evvy-

 

[Guyfang]

This post closes out this thread. I learned a handful of valuable lessons that I want to share. Let's start with an admission that I never learn this one because I make this mistake over and over again. Rule #1 - Let the problem talk to you! When I started researching what I thought was a crank duration problem, I landed on that idea because of threads on this website that I had read. I got caught up in MPU (Magnetic Pickup Unit) and relays, and RPMs and... and... and... A lot of these threads didn't finish so I don't know their outcomes, something that I'll talk about shortly. Because I let myself get caught up in the overwhelming research I forgot my own Rule #2 - Don't confuse symptoms with root cause. Just because I had what appeared to be similar symptoms as other threads didn't mean that their root cause was my root cause, Rule #3 - reach out to your trusted mentors. Thanks to all of you who put up with me as I worked my way through this. You kept pulling me back into focus, something obviously noticed by all but me!

Let the problem talk to you. I've heard the Bendix mechanism (named after Mr. Bendix) wind out on other bad starters. Why wasn't this started the same as all of the others? Because it was military? Because it has a Start switch that's also meant to flash the generator? No! It was just like any other starter. Maybe the solenoid or maybe the starter. $100 later I had a rebuilt one that works/fits the Isuzu C240 engine, arguable one of the more successful 4-cylinder diesel motors made. There's literally millions of them made over the years. Starters are easy to get,

As you read a couple of posts ago, I was in the middle of removing it when I ran into a problem. If you were to tell me that women aren't as capable as men are, I'd challenge... "have you met me?" But... I'll be the first to admit that I'm not as strong! When the starter didn't come out, I looked again at the parts manual and at the replacement. Two bolts. Count them! Actually one was a stud. With stud nut loosened almost all the way and bottom bolt out, this thing should have come out. Easily. Not so! Thanks Guy for your patient coaching. He told me to make sure the top nut was on the stud, but "very loose" and then give it a "smart tap." Yeah well... that's where Evvy isn't as strong as Guy is! Now I have to work smarter not harder. A 2x4 solved the problem. No, I didn't whack it with a 2x4. Well actually, I did. Here's how. The casting on the starter sticks up and mounts the solenoid. I was able to run a length of 2x4 in through the air filter door and butt up against the solenoid mount. If I tapped the 2x4 then it would push the starter out. I tapped it with a mallet. No go. Again. No go. Something else Guy said. It will come out. Oh what the heck... I stood back like a batter in the batting cage and let the 2x4 have it. It came out! Lesson learned? Reach out to your mentors and gain confidence.

I'll post pictures next, but I want to share something else Guy told me. I promised him that I will learn and in turn make a contribution to this body of knowledge. He pointed out to me that I had already made a contribution by posting the thread. And he said... better still when you follow up and post the solution.

YES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

The first paragraph is killer!
Rule #2 - Don't confuse symptoms with root cause. Just because I had what appeared to be similar symptoms as other threads didn't mean that their root cause was my root cause

And this happens 95% of the time.