MEP002A With low frequency meter reading

[Bushwacka]

Need assistance understanding why I have a low frequency meter reading even after I increase RPM. Thought it was low RPM and just replaced the speed control cable. Same problem. Reading is 55-56 hertz at full speed control throttle pull. Will adjust to lower RPM with speed control cable, but not higher RPM.

Tech manuals do not seem to address how raise the RPM beyond speed control cable pull out and turn.

Trying to get to 60-62 hertz. Have cleaned grounding post on trailer and genny frame.

The convienance 120 outlets both reflect 120v on multimeter when running at 55-56 hertz.

No problem adjusting voltage.

Thinking this is a problem related to the speed setting of the governor.

Is this just a matter of adjusting the speed setting of the governor? Where is the adjustment located?

If not, could it be a transformer or frequency transducer problem?

Thanks!

 

[1800 Diesel]

Need assistance understanding why I have a low frequency meter reading even after I increase RPM. Thought it was low RPM and just replaced the speed control cable. Same problem. Reading is 55-56 hertz at full speed control throttle pull. Will adjust to lower RPM with speed control cable, but not higher RPM.

Tech manuals do not seem to address how raise the RPM beyond speed control cable pull out and turn.

Trying to get to 60-62 hertz. Have cleaned grounding post on trailer and genny frame.

The convienance 120 outlets both reflect 120v on multimeter when running at 55-56 hertz.

No problem adjusting voltage.

Thinking this is a problem related to the speed setting of the governor.

Is this just a matter of adjusting the speed setting of the governor? Where is the adjustment located?

If not, could it be a transformer or frequency transducer problem?

Thanks!

To really isolate the problem, you need to check freq with a known good external meter (or swap the OEM meter with another one known good). If OEM meter is shown to be reading correctly, then you need to verify RPM with a strobe tach. If RPM can then be adjusted to 1800 (with tach verification) then the transducer could be at fault. Would not recommend blindly increasing engine speed without knowing the actual speed of the engine. Hope this helps you out!

Edit--Found this thread that may help too...(I'm certain there are several others...)

http://www.steelsoldiers.com/showthread.php?94421-MEP002A-Frequency-Meter-Troubleshooting

 

[steelypip]

A Kill-A-Watt meter is cheap, works well, and has many, many other uses once you've got it around. One thing it does very well is plug into the convenience outlet (or near the load) and measure the frequency.

 

[Bushwacka]

Guys, Appreciate the explanations and I will go the Kill a Watt meter route and then the Tach on the engine. Don't have a meter to swap out. Will also have a look at the thread you so patiently posted. Thanks!!!

 

[Triple Jim]

Once you have a Kill-A-Watt meter, you don't need a tach. 1800 rpm is 60 Hz, by definition.

 

[steelypip]

Once you have a Kill-A-Watt meter, you don't need a tach. 1800 rpm is 60 Hz, by definition.

What he said - as long as there's a solid shaft connecting the gen head and the crankshaft, if it's a four-pole gen head (an MEP-002A/003A is), then 1800 RPM = 60.00 Hz and vice-versa. A quartz crystal based frequency counter (like a Kill-A-Watt) plugged into the convenience outlet is considerably more accurate than any of the stock frequency meter systems on MEP generators.

 

[Bushwacka]

Guys,

I put the Kill A Watt meter on the convienance outlet. It reflects 117v at a 102 hz. When I adjust the voltage knob to increase the voltage to 120v the Kill A Watt meter reads 98-99hz. Does this sound like a bad transducer? Where do I go from here?
Thanks again.

 

[Triple Jim]

Something is wrong with your results. For 100 Hz, the engine would have to be running 3,000 rpm instead of the 1800 it's set up to run, so it would be screaming, and this is very unlikely. Are you sure the Kill-A-Watt meter isn't set to read power factor or something like that? On the model I have, the same button toggles between frequency (Hz) and power factor (PF), so pressing that button can get you into either mode.

Now if your governor is jammed or disconnected and the engine is running wide open, and it's really screaming, maybe you could get to 100 Hz.

 

[johnray13]

I think 102 hertz derived from 3060 RPM would make you wanna run for cover. I hope he is seeing pf.

 

[Triple Jim]

I hope so too, but I don't know how it would read 1.02 for PF.

 

[Craig A Tull]

Try loading down the convenience power some and see if the kill A watt reads any different, also as stated make sure you are reading freq. plug it into the house somewhere and see, that is a REALLY cheap Chicomm meter and could be reading erroneously.
Best to find a Fluke meter that reads frequency.

 

[Bushwacka]

I too am confused by the 102 hz, as I understand the RPMs basically determine the Hz. I am certain I had the 117 volts reading correct, so will go back and check the Kill A Watt functions and re-read the Hz. As you note, perhaps I did not toggle between functions......... Engine sounds like 1600-1800 RPM.....not over revving ect. Thanks for your patience and assistance. Will take readings again.

 

[Bushwacka]

Guys,

I rechecked the Kill-A Watt meter on house current ect to verify readings. All functions appeared ok.

Started Mep-002 and used convienance 120 outlet to measure. Let genny run for 5 minutes and here are results on Kill A Watt meter:
119 v at 95.2 hz and 1.00 PF. Engine at high RPM

Hz guage shows: 57 hz
Load guage : bouncing from 0 to 22%
Voltage adjustment guage: 100-120v Previous start and run it was showing 230-240v and adjustment knob was functioning normally

Other factors: upon start, governor takes over engine and brings up to high RPM
pulled out throttle and only very change in RPM, but RPM would respond to turning throttle cable for small adjustments( lower RPM)
pushing in throttle control cable does not lower RPMs
A/C circuit breaker is off
Am-Volt Transfer Switch is set as: 1 Phase: L3 L1 volts: L3 Amps
When I depress the throttle linkage near injector pump( while running), it is spring loaded and lowers RPM, but when released, goes back to high RPM.

I do not have the experience to understand the significance of the readings or their cause, but I am reluctant to keep testing at hi RPMs. Unsure what the cause is for these symtoms as now the guages are giving me different readings each time I start under the same settings. Need your continued help on how to diagnosis and start repairs.
Perhaps I have missed something in the TMs or have used an incorrect setting?
Thanks

 

[Craig A Tull]

Open up the "close to run" door and make sure the lever that goes from the end of the throttle cable to the governor spring is not stuck or sticking..
Also make sure the cable adjustment has the cable moved as far forward "to the right looking at the cable" as to give as much slack as possible. Don't worry about anything until you get the RPMs under control, if you are truly running 92hz you are in real danger of chunking a rod or doing other damage.
There is a small possibility you have a failed governor, one way to tell if your governor is working is to push on the throttle linkage to speed up the engine then when you let go you will see the gov. reduce the throttle by a bunch then advance the throttle when it starts to drop under speed, but I would not suggest that until you are sure your not running really high RPMs

 

[Craig A Tull]

If you are not able to see (hear) an appreciable difference when pushing and pulling the throttle control there is a problem and none of that is electronic or electrical, check as above

 

[Bushwacka]

I will check/adjust the cable adjustment to be sure the lever is as far to the right as possible.. Last check, when I pushed the throttle cable linkage down,( when running) it is under spring tension and RPMs are reduced. However when I let go, it returns back to the upward position and returns to high RPMs. Sounds like I do not have a governor that is functioning.

 

[Craig A Tull]

I am a little confused on what you are saying, the throttle cable, linkage and spring run horizontal, so I don't understand your reference to up and down.
Craig

 

[Bushwacka]

My error in describing the problem. The linkage I am pushing down while engine is running is not the throttle control cable, rather it is where the arm comes up from the grooved rod that the spring tension spring attaches to. The rod and linkage that then connects to the fuel injector pump is what I refer to. I adjusted what I think is the governor adjustment ( grooved rod that spring attached to). It did indeed lower my RPMs when I started, but after 2-3 minutes of lower RPM, it accelerated back to high RPMs which I can only reduce by manually pushing down on fuel pump linkage. Checked this linkage to be sure where it goes into the fuel injector pump and it appears to be working. So I am back to how do I lower the RPMs and determine what part is malfunctioning/broken.

 

[Jimc]

Ok there are a few things just to check and confirm. There is a spring that pulls back on the arm. The spring where hooked around the arm is a corkscrew looking adjustment. That should be roughly in the middle, from top to bottom. Assuming your throttle cable is set all the way in and its still high rpm then while running look at the brass linkage rod and the arm on the ip. By looking at where the idle stop is on the pump and comparing to where the throttle arm is does the pump appear to be at high throttle or is the arm up against or close to the stop? Does the unit shut down when turned off? If the pump is almost in the idle position and the rpm is high then the little block in the pump is broken.

 

[Craig A Tull]

If you go to my thread "civilizing the MEP' (page 2)you can see a good picture of what the General is talking about, if you can slow the engine down by manually manipulating the linkage I would not suspect something broken in the pump.