MEPS 806B how to turn it into a "dumb" generator

[TheEquineFencer]

I have friend that had another guy "working" on his MEPS 806B, he was "trying to wire around a problem" and it appears he blew come CAPS in the governor control board (ESD5551) and the TCM-02 board and God knows what else.

Here's what I'd like to do, or be able to do.

#1 Install another governor control module from another regular governor system that's readily available to just get the generator to run to see if the Generator end is OK. He's looking cheap.

#2 If the generator end is still good, I'd like to install a voltage regulator to regulate the voltage. I have no idea if I can use the original one or not. Aftermarket retro fit would be nice.

#3 If I can get #1 and #2 completed, I'll figure out how to get it set up for shut downs and such using what I have.

He doesn't need all the other "stuff" that came for paralleling and such. He just needs a generator that's as bare bones basic as it gets.

Any help or insight would be great.

 

[Guyfang]

Sent a PM to you. I think this is something that needs to be done. The engine and main gen are bullet proof. Its the darn controls that suck.

 

[TheEquineFencer]

Sent a PM to you. I think this is something that needs to be done. The engine and main gen are bullet proof. Its the darn controls that suck.

I agree. Thanks!
Floyd

 

[mciikurzroot]

I have friend that had another guy "working" on his MEPS 806B, he was "trying to wire around a problem" and it appears he blew come CAPS in the governor control board (ESD5551) and the TCM-02 board and God knows what else.

Here's what I'd like to do, or be able to do.

#1 Install another governor control module from another regular governor system that's readily available to just get the generator to run to see if the Generator end is OK. He's looking cheap.

#2 If the generator end is still good, I'd like to install a voltage regulator to regulate the voltage. I have no idea if I can use the original one or not. Aftermarket retro fit would be nice.

#3 If I can get #1 and #2 completed, I'll figure out how to get it set up for shut downs and such using what I have.

He doesn't need all the other "stuff" that came for paralleling and such. He just needs a generator that's as bare bones basic as it gets.

Any help or insight would be great.

I will pleased to "wade" into this , but it will have to be later today, right now i have to go honor a few other obligations.. but it will be lengthy and not all what you might want to hear..

best: mac/mc

 

[mciikurzroot]

Sent a PM to you. I think this is something that needs to be done. The engine and main gen are bullet proof. Its the darn controls that suck.

Happy NY Guy.. I will answer this fellow and one more it seems as well... We are busy here, generator work here is good and i speak of the 804B and up series. We have developed a new backplain board to replace the CIM and all the mess, this is our first one we had built so it really our prototype one but if it will pass the testing and ring out then i will have a run made and help solve good gen sets from being door stops...
i welcome trying to help most of these guys but it seems to also that most dont want to spend the dough to really fix it for the long term and that is a shame to me.. but it s also why i like to deal with cities and fire depts and the like, they have a better understanding and welcome the high reliability we can offer as well open architecture and software support.. I will make time and offer an updated report on SS soon .. as it is near midnight it looks like we have the senate race here maybe a split and not a total loss but it might be a bit longer before the vote dust settles all out.. Right now it is early, but my wife has what seems is early dimentia we are still in the testing phases's and she has a terrific attitude, so all this to say im not sure how it will effect my hobby/work but little doubt things will change...
Guy be safe and lets hope this 2021 is far better than c-19 and 2020 we have experienced..
best mac/mc

 

[155mm]

Following

 

[TheEquineFencer]

Happy NY Guy.. I will answer this fellow and one more it seems as well... We are busy here, generator work here is good and i speak of the 804B and up series. We have developed a new backplain board to replace the CIM and all the mess, this is our first one we had built so it really our prototype one but if it will pass the testing and ring out then i will have a run made and help solve good gen sets from being door stops...
i welcome trying to help most of these guys but it seems to also that most dont want to spend the dough to really fix it for the long term and that is a shame to me.. but it s also why i like to deal with cities and fire depts and the like, they have a better understanding and welcome the high reliability we can offer as well open architecture and software support.. I will make time and offer an updated report on SS soon .. as it is near midnight it looks like we have the senate race here maybe a split and not a total loss but it might be a bit longer before the vote dust settles all out.. Right now it is early, but my wife has what seems is early dimentia we are still in the testing phases's and she has a terrific attitude, so all this to say im not sure how it will effect my hobby/work but little doubt things will change...
Guy be safe and lets hope this 2021 is far better than c-19 and 2020 we have experienced..
best mac/mc

The quote for just this two boards was stupid. If I could get it to crank and stay running ...Life would be easier. I "inherited" this project on my own recourse trying to help a guy out I met years ago when I was doing "storm work" in Texas during the "Ike" event. He's going through some tough times right now, as I am alos. His mother just passed and the "pissing match" between sibblings is just starting for control of the estate and assets.

Personally I think the MIL-Spec Meps series are pretty cool...but from what I've seen so far, a PITA to get parts at a resonable price. The Price quoted for the ESD-5551 was almost as much as he paid for the generator. I did find this about that style GC unit. https://assets.website-files.com/5c...ac57c24e98d5c10e8fa3_PIB1003_ESD5550_5570.pdf
It'd be nice to be able to use something like this in place of the ESD5551 control and do away with the parralelling section. https://www.alibaba.com/product-det...=a2700.supplier-qrwzero.102.12.2ca8157e4U1IEH

I'll check back later. Thanks again folks.

Floyd

 

[TheEquineFencer]

Happy NY Guy.. I will answer this fellow and one more it seems as well... We are busy here, generator work here is good and i speak of the 804B and up series. We have developed a new backplain board to replace the CIM and all the mess, this is our first one we had built so it really our prototype one but if it will pass the testing and ring out then i will have a run made and help solve good gen sets from being door stops...
i welcome trying to help most of these guys but it seems to also that most dont want to spend the dough to really fix it for the long term and that is a shame to me.. but it s also why i like to deal with cities and fire depts and the like, they have a better understanding and welcome the high reliability we can offer as well open architecture and software support.. I will make time and offer an updated report on SS soon .. as it is near midnight it looks like we have the senate race here maybe a split and not a total loss but it might be a bit longer before the vote dust settles all out.. Right now it is early, but my wife has what seems is early dimentia we are still in the testing phases's and she has a terrific attitude, so all this to say im not sure how it will effect my hobby/work but little doubt things will change...
Guy be safe and lets hope this 2021 is far better than c-19 and 2020 we have experienced..
best mac/mc

Any updates?

 

[Guyfang]

I have not heard anything. Perhaps Mac might have something to say.

 

[TheEquineFencer]

I have not heard anything. Perhaps Mac might have something to say.

I hope so. The guy with the generator called and left a message last night. I was out late helping another friend wire a "tiny" house that wasn't as "tiny" as he said it was., so I haven't called him back with an update. If he gets deployed he's going to be nervous leaving home without back up power of some kind.

My main thing right now is getting a governor control that'll get the engine running so I can flash the field to see if the generator end is FUBAR'd or what. Then I'll tackle getting a Voltage reg that'll work, the rest will be "easy" after that.

Thanks for following and helping out, you're a good guy IMO.

 

[robertsears1]

Does this person have a manufacturing plant or numerous chicken houses to supply backup power to? If it is just for a house, that is not a good fit.

Robert

 

[TheEquineFencer]

Does this person have a manufacturing plant or numerous chicken houses to supply backup power to? If it is just for a house, that is not a good fit.

Robert

I agree, a single phase generator would be a better choice IMO. But it's configured, or was when it worked. So the loads are balanced. It powers his entire "complex", there's several family members living there, plus his livestock and shops. Some are in declining help, most are female, and I've met a couple of them....I feel for the guy...

It's what he has to work with if you know what I mean. If he's gone on a deployment and power goes out for an extended time, he'll never hear the end of it.

 

[TheEquineFencer]

I just got off the phone with my friend that has the generator.... he said his wife is on his a$$ about it...

 

[draymorris]

Does Mciikurzroot have a company that makes controls for these units? The unit I am working on could use some "dumbing down as well. I have thought about trying to spec a new set of controls - Governor, AVR and controller - but was not sure if it is the way to go. Any input?

 

[TheEquineFencer]

Does Mciikurzroot have a company that makes controls for these units? The unit I am working on could use some "dumbing down as well. I have thought about trying to spec a new set of controls - Governor, AVR and controller - but was not sure if it is the way to go. Any input?

I've been talking with GCS about an engine control. I'll know more tomorrow. I'm going to the engine RPM /oad controls "right" then figure out the voltage regulation from there and just add what the guy wants. Basically, I'm going really "gut" this thing and make it do bare bones basics. I'm starting to hunt for some HVAC heating elements to build a load bank for it.

I'll post updates as I go.

 

[draymorris]

I've been talking with GCS about an engine control. I'll know more tomorrow. I'm going to the engine RPM /oad controls "right" then figure out the voltage regulation from there and just add what the guy wants. Basically, I'm going really "gut" this thing and make it do bare bones basics. I'm starting to hunt for some HVAC heating elements to build a load bank for it.

I'll post updates as I go.

A few things:
I just read another post with Mcii explaining a lot about himself so that question is answered and I now have his phone and email.

I recently retrofitted an non military genset (350Kva) with an aftermarket controller (for the engine and generator monitoring and safeties) an aftermarket governor (but this was an old Cummins engine with a PT pump) and an aftermarket AVR (Marathon generator with good part numbers to cross) - and the process was easier than I expected. But it was time consuming. The parts were relatively cheap and I ended up getting set up with the company. I can give more details about what I did, but I don't know enough about these military units to know what parts would be needed to do the same.
I think I will email Mcii to see what he has to offer on this current 806 I am working on.

 

[TheEquineFencer]

A few things:
I just read another post with Mcii explaining a lot about himself so that question is answered and I now have his phone and email.

I recently retrofitted an non military genset (350Kva) with an aftermarket controller (for the engine and generator monitoring and safeties) an aftermarket governor (but this was an old Cummins engine with a PT pump) and an aftermarket AVR (Marathon generator with good part numbers to cross) - and the process was easier than I expected. But it was time consuming. The parts were relatively cheap and I ended up getting set up with the company. I can give more details about what I did, but I don't know enough about these military units to know what parts would be needed to do the same.
I think I will email Mcii to see what he has to offer on this current 806 I am working on.

I love the old Cummins (Onan) Generators. The old V-12s were pretty cool IMO. I worked for a local Cummins/Onan distributor for 4 years. I lost all my printed service manuals when my shop was hit by a tornado in 2011. I learned some things from a veteran Onan road tech about how to "fix" things when the parts were obsolete and told it couldn't be had. The controls on part of it for start disconnect were in a section run off the accessory drive, we'd use an oil pressure switch for start disconnect and just move the wiring over to the OP switch.

Any insight would be greatly appreciated on what you did to 350KVA.

I've got to get the guy at GCS info on the actuator and such. He's going to find a "compatible" controller for what I have.

 

[draymorris]

For the record I am a baby in the generator world compared to some of you. My life has made me a "jack of all trades" to an extreme level. And it continues that way. One day I am working on a farm tractor, the next a man lift, then a genset, and might even throw in a dozer or even a truck mounted crane. It keeps life interesting but sometimes gets a little frustrating when I can't remember things as well as I use to. I worked for 3 years for a oil field generator rental company (2012-2015) as a contractor totally unmanaged. Therefor I could spend as much time to learn and diagnose and always found a solution. So they sent me all the units that had "weird" problems. So if I sound like I don't know what I am talking about - that may be.
That Cummins I think was actually a Kohler, but I never could find any proof. But it had a Marathon generator (not Onan) so we just assumed Kohler put it together. Dairy had bought it from a service company in a liquidation auction. RPM's were high. They took the PT pump to a reputable shop who went through it and still to high RPM. They scratched their heads for a few months then heard about me. I tested every thing I could then said "too much fuel, pumps not right". They took it back to the shop, who charged them another 1200 and said "oh, you did not tell us this was on a genset, we will fix it" - wrong - same problem. I told them it still wasn't right. Took it back a third time- no charge - said it was right. I took it to my reputable injection shop, who took it apart and said it was good. I discussed some governor functions I had learned about in the mean time and talked the owner into re - evaluting - The PT pump we had was from a truck engine, the electronic governor was doing nothing - he did some research and made a few mods - good to go. NOW I HAD VOLTAGE - literally all over the place. 300-540-480-350.

The avr was toast from vibration, the engine governor was stable until I tried to adjust - it was toast - the safety relays and meters were all bad from dirt dobbers and corosion. Dennis at partsfortechs.com helped me spec aftermarket AVR, governor (was Cummins) and a Dynagen brand controller. Emailing him works good but I have talked on the phone. He already knew what the temp and oil pressure sensors were but I confirmed and ordered new ones from them to make sure they worked with the Dynagen. Basically rewired the unit except for mains. The Dynagen was IMO very user friendly and I had no problems setting the parameters - even downloaded software and could program on my computer.

I know this is long, but I have learned so much from websites through other's experiences, I try to give mine.

 

[SandBar]

Something like a DC72D or DC60D controller for under 200 dollars could handle controls, then a suitable VR , even a 35.00 Leroy Somers clone might be able to handle the voltage and excitation. Just thoughts.

 

[TheEquineFencer]

For the record I am a baby in the generator world compared to some of you. My life has made me a "jack of all trades" to an extreme level. And it continues that way. One day I am working on a farm tractor, the next a man lift, then a genset, and might even throw in a dozer or even a truck mounted crane. It keeps life interesting but sometimes gets a little frustrating when I can't remember things as well as I use to. I worked for 3 years for a oil field generator rental company (2012-2015) as a contractor totally unmanaged. Therefor I could spend as much time to learn and diagnose and always found a solution. So they sent me all the units that had "weird" problems. So if I sound like I don't know what I am talking about - that may be.
That Cummins I think was actually a Kohler, but I never could find any proof. But it had a Marathon generator (not Onan) so we just assumed Kohler put it together. Dairy had bought it from a service company in a liquidation auction. RPM's were high. They took the PT pump to a reputable shop who went through it and still to high RPM. They scratched their heads for a few months then heard about me. I tested every thing I could then said "too much fuel, pumps not right". They took it back to the shop, who charged them another 1200 and said "oh, you did not tell us this was on a genset, we will fix it" - wrong - same problem. I told them it still wasn't right. Took it back a third time- no charge - said it was right. I took it to my reputable injection shop, who took it apart and said it was good. I discussed some governor functions I had learned about in the mean time and talked the owner into re - evaluting - The PT pump we had was from a truck engine, the electronic governor was doing nothing - he did some research and made a few mods - good to go. NOW I HAD VOLTAGE - literally all over the place. 300-540-480-350.

The avr was toast from vibration, the engine governor was stable until I tried to adjust - it was toast - the safety relays and meters were all bad from dirt dobbers and corosion. Dennis at partsfortechs.com helped me spec aftermarket AVR, governor (was Cummins) and a Dynagen brand controller. Emailing him works good but I have talked on the phone. He already knew what the temp and oil pressure sensors were but I confirmed and ordered new ones from them to make sure they worked with the Dynagen. Basically rewired the unit except for mains. The Dynagen was IMO very user friendly and I had no problems setting the parameters - even downloaded software and could program on my computer.

I know this is long, but I have learned so much from websites through other's experiences, I try to give mine.

LOL, we could be brothers...Jack of all trades and a master of none, my life's story.

After I left Cummins, I found out I was the poor fellow that got all the "weird stuff" too. Lakeshore switchgear, Old and I mean really old Cummins generators and Automatic Transfer Switches and the like. I was even task with making a 3Ph only load bank run on 1Ph power and work right. I

Still no update from GCS yet, I'll give it another hour and make a call.