my 4l80e learning experience

[richingalveston]

I am having a 4l80e being built for my m1009. I had a free 2w drive core and have aquired the parts to convert to 4wd.
I can get good used Torque converter or a custom/aftermarket

My Used parts guy, that took a while to find, has two Torque converters for the tranny (these are stock gm) one he says produces more torque at lower RPMS and the other more Horses at higher RPMs. I would guess I want the more Torque option if i choose to get one from him. he just deals in used tranny parts (AOK transmission parts, in Houston tx) he has been very helpful and apparently a good source for hard to find parts.

I will try to get the part numbers from him on my next visit and post as a follow up.

what would you do if you went used stock?
would you choose new stock instead of used?
And if you would choose and aftermarket and if so any recomendations on which one?

There may not be a lot of 4l80e owners out there but I would appreciate any advice.

 

[BIG_RED]

If it's going behind a diesel (I'm assuming you're keeping the 6.2) you want the torque converter that works best for high torque & low RPMs. If you want to be sure you're getting the right part, look up at a parts place (ie rockauto.com or similar) what torque converter went behind a 6.5 in a mid 90's gm 1 ton - that will be what you want.

 

[NDT]

Please tell us what your solution is for the controller and if you are happy with what you decided upon.

 

[richingalveston]

i am staying with 6.2 and yes the 4l80e will require me to use the 6.5 converter. Unless anyone here can offer advice for me to use something different, i plan to use the high-torque torque-converter. I may go ahead and buy a used one since replacing the torque converter is something i can do if it goes bad. just a matter of removing tranny and switching the converter, opening up the tranny is not needed. provided it does not blow completely up and put any metal or other debris into the tranny and cause other problems

my current plan was to purchase a stand alone controler. looking at them now. I want one that does not require a lap top but can be connected to a standard laptop for programming (no seperate programmer). I will update the thread on the controler ASAP.
I thought of putting the 6.5 wiring harness on but not sure I want to be stuck with the stock controler. I have a spare 6.2 engine thus I will have to blow it up also before changing to a 6.5 so the wiring harness would not really be required until then.
With the right gears, the 6.2 has plenty of power for a 1009 and I would rather have the fuel economy thus i may never turbo it either.
(still up in the air on the turbo)

getting the right torque converter is what I am concentrated on at this time. Controler is second and then the t-case will be after that.

Thanks to those who have chimed in so far.

 

[panzerwillie]

Im in the process of putting a 4l80E on a M1010 with a 6.5 turbo i rubuild is all in place already, will be odering a contorller for the trany in the next few weeks, as far as the converter i got a stock one rebuild from a local trasmission parts seler, the same one i got on the HMMWV with the 4l80E works real good and locks good, make sure is for a diesel not only does it have 6 bolts but has a lower stall , working with a BAUMANN TCU controler this weekend on a 4R70W for trany but i have use the TCI on 4l80E in the pass with exellent control however all there new stuff does not use laptop anymore is a hand held , GM performance as a nice controler but is in the higher prize range almost double of the others but very easy to work with, im in the process on making changes to the crossmenber loos easy enougth will see good luck with your upgrade

 

[ODdave]

Stock reman diesel convertor is the only choice in my opinion. What put a used part in a new trans? There not that expensive.

 

[richingalveston]

stock reman must be it.

stock reman sounds good, did not want to go used and the aftermarkets ive looked at worry me. just want a good one not trying to go high performance.

just starting the controler search really interested in what you do with yours panzerwillie.

thanks to all for sharing your experience

 

[True Knight]

Here is my write up of my 4L80E swap. Go with the low rpm diesel converter. It is the one that is supposed to go with this low rpm motor. I used the TCI controller. It is highly programmable and I only made a small few changes to the base programming that it came up with for the power and drivetrain values of the truck.

http://www.steelsoldiers.com/showthread.php?p=759424

 

[powerhouseduece]

For a Controller, have you looked into this?

Painless Performance: PERFECT TORC GM 4L60/65E & 4L80/85E Transmission Controller

This is the only one I've found that does not require a tach signal. Its also the simplest hookup, and you can adjust it without a laptop.

 

[richingalveston]

update on parts aquired

I am updating this thread to show the parts needed to changing my 2WD core to 4WD (4l80e transmission). Pictures include the 4x4 output housing and the shaft in addition to the gaskets I purchased at the GM dealer. These parts replace the slip yoke housing and longer shaft of the 2WD version of the transmission.
I am now on the hunt for a spacer/adapter that the GM parts guy could not identify. I was informed about this spacer from the guys at ORD. I have not seen it installed but it apears like it may be in one of the pics on their website. (silver part on the front of the red 203/205 doubler in their t-case section of website). The told me this was a standard GM part and was still available at dealer for $100. Still working on this one.

This spacer does not appear in any of the pics that I have seen by other members who have installed the 4l80e in their vehicles. However the only installs that I have been able to get pictures of they were not using a 203/205 doubler like I plan to do.

Purchased the housing for $25 and the shaft for $50 from a very hard to find used tranny parts dealer.

 

[wayne pick]

Im with ODdave on the converter. You spent $$$ on the trans and controller. New or reman on the converter and no worries.

 

[ODdave]

There is no spacer. You just need the right adapter if you want to run a 205. Your adapter in pic #1 wont work for a 205. Would fit a 208 or 241 though. The factory adapter you need came in 1991 trucks only.

 

[richingalveston]

gm parts guy not very good.

I asked for the 91 parts first since all of my research showed this was the first year they started using the 4l80e. The parts guy could only pull up t400 transmissions in the computer for 91 thus he insisted the 4l80e was not used unitl 92 because this was the only thing he could find in the computer. I had him check 2500 and 3500 models which gave the same info for both.
The 92 drawings in the gm computer show a driverside drop on the transfercase and not a passenger drop. I have attached the print out he gave me for the 91 year model. It shows the t400.

I was not going to argue with a parts guy who only knows parts from a computer screen so unless I can get an actual gm part number to take him, I will drive across town to a different gm dealer.

with regards to my transfer case connection, I plan to use the doubler from ORD which to my knowledge is designed to use a 203 transfercase connected to the transmisson and the 205 is mated to the back side of the 203. I was also under the impression that the 203 used the same mounting as the 208 or 241. It looks to be similar.

Thanks for your input, this is a learning experience that I hope to share with all so maybe I will get it right the first time.

 

[ODdave]

He was probably looking at the c/k series trucks. The r/v series is where you will find the adapter. Irrelevant though being you are going to a 203. No factory adapter but you can machine a 400/203 adapter to fit. that will be the easiest.

 

[Recovry4x4]

Sounds interesting. Between the length of the 4L80E, the 203 range box and the 205 you won't have much rear drive shaft.

 

[richingalveston]

check out the ord doubler

the ord doubler uses a 203 front half only and with no slip yokes.
the doubler is same length as the np208
the 4l80e is about 2 inches longer.

thus it is only 2 inches longer in total

I will look at the ck adapter or I may switch to the 241/205 doubler instead if it makes it shorter or that much easier.

ord has both 241/205 doubler and 203/205 doubler.

thanks for the input. I will check back with the parts guy with the new info.

 

[1ton cucv k5 turbo]

I asked for the 91 parts first since all of my research showed this was the first year they started using the 4l80e. The parts guy could only pull up t400 transmissions in the computer for 91 thus he insisted the 4l80e was not used unitl 92 because this was the only thing he could find in the computer. I had him check 2500 and 3500 models which gave the same info for both.
The 92 drawings in the gm computer show a driverside drop on the transfercase and not a passenger drop. I have attached the print out he gave me for the 91 year model. It shows the t400.

I was not going to argue with a parts guy who only knows parts from a computer screen so unless I can get an actual gm part number to take him, I will drive across town to a different gm dealer.

with regards to my transfer case connection, I plan to use the doubler from ORD which to my knowledge is designed to use a 203 transfercase connected to the transmisson and the 205 is mated to the back side of the 203. I was also under the impression that the 203 used the same mounting as the 208 or 241. It looks to be similar.

Thanks for your input, this is a learning experience that I hope to share with all so maybe I will get it right the first time.

It really depends on that adapter you are searching for..... there is no mounting to crossmember on the 203... it will be on that adpater... the adapter that mates the 203 to the 205 will be the other mounting point... i would recomemd gettting a 2nd Cross member from salvage yard, as you will need this when installing... you will see theres alot of weight just on one crossmember and one mount... Given the fact that your swapping to the 4L80.. ( 2" longer )

For me i had to use the original 400 /208 mount and redrill tap into the front face of my 203 to get it to work... ( doing this i clocked it the way i wanted it to sit with the doubler clocked to be level with each other...


im interested on that mount your searching for, as i think i will be doing the same swap in the fall/ winter....

 

[ODdave]

I supose one nice thing is the 400/203 adapter is only about 1.25 inches thick. This will save you some length.

 

[richingalveston]

going to talk to ord and check 241 tcase

Due to the fact a 241 will be a direct bolt on and no real other work is needed. besides some extra work on the mating between 241 and 205, but ORD already has this figured out. I am going to look at the difference between the 241 and 203.
I thought the 241 was an alluminum housing and the 203 cast steel.
I do not know this for sure but that was why I thought the 203 was the better case.
If someone wants to chime in on the difference between the 241 and 203 please do. I will only be using the front part of the case (chain housing and front output replaced by 205 case). does anyone know the length difference between 203 and 241?

The 241 with 4l80e is an easy install and all of the clocking can take place between the two t-case's so clocking at the tranny should not be needed.

yes I will be building a double cross over and I plan to use the rubber mounts suggested by ORD to allow enough flex in the system.

If I use the curent output housing that I have, it will have its own crossmemeber mount and the ORD doubler kit puts another mount between the two t-case's. I think ORD sells the 241 doubler kit cheaper than the 203 also.

I am getting closer to getting my parts togather. I am going to pick up the 1008 tomorrow so hopefully the axles on it are good and I can then start purchasing the lift kit.

Would like to know how hard it is to install the E-locker in the D-60 if anyone has done it themselves. plan on doing a rebuild of the axle when I get it out of the truck and Install the elocker at that time.

thanks for the input.

 

[1ton cucv k5 turbo]

Due to the fact a 241 will be a direct bolt on and no real other work is needed. besides some extra work on the mating between 241 and 205, but ORD already has this figured out. I am going to look at the difference between the 241 and 203.
I thought the 241 was an alluminum housing and the 203 cast steel.
I do not know this for sure but that was why I thought the 203 was the better case.
If someone wants to chime in on the difference between the 241 and 203 please do. I will only be using the front part of the case (chain housing and front output replaced by 205 case). does anyone know the length difference between 203 and 241?

The 241 with 4l80e is an easy install and all of the clocking can take place between the two t-case's so clocking at the tranny should not be needed.

yes I will be building a double cross over and I plan to use the rubber mounts suggested by ORD to allow enough flex in the system.

If I use the curent output housing that I have, it will have its own crossmemeber mount and the ORD doubler kit puts another mount between the two t-case's. I think ORD sells the 241 doubler kit cheaper than the 203 also.

I am getting closer to getting my parts togather. I am going to pick up the 1008 tomorrow so hopefully the axles on it are good and I can then start purchasing the lift kit.

Would like to know how hard it is to install the E-locker in the D-60 if anyone has done it themselves. plan on doing a rebuild of the axle when I get it out of the truck and Install the elocker at that time.

thanks for the input.

the 203 is cast Steel....


going with the 203/205 will in the end be a better choice IMO because. both units are gear driven, no belts too Slip.. or chains to stretch or break.

Are you going to twin stick the 205? ( its worth it while your piecing this together.... I love mine.... )



the E locker for D60 was easy... IF your comfortable in doing it yourself, you just have to ensure its dialed in correctly and the backlash is correct. be sure to cover tubes with some rags, after the carrier is out and drilling hole for Locker wires...