New deuce owner seeking advice

[Mullaney]

Why would you think Dot forbids the use of retreads on busses? Because they carry people not logs. Retreads do not last as long as new tires. Anyone who runs them on the steers is rolling the dice with their own life and the lives of others sharing the road. The loggers you've been talking to need their heads examined.

Don't want to start an argument - but a Bandag Recap on a Michelin Carcass will outlast the original Michelin and most other tires. Of course like everything else there are retread facilities that do a first class job. And there are others who will make you swear off recaps forever.

My first car was a 1967 Camero. It was very used. Maybe heavily abused is a better description. There wasn't one square foot on it that didn't have a dent on it. I found a body shop that fixed for me. I wasn't smart enough to know "Bondo" wasn't very stable - but at 16 - it looked pretty dang fine to me. The reason I bring all that up is that I needed tires. SIXTY BUCKS got me four brand new recaps mounted, balanced and on the car. Driving home from the tire store, the left rear had a piece of the recap started beating the side of the car. A piece about eight inches long and two inches wide "let go". Not completely. Just enough to beat the Bondo out of the left rear fender.

I have never run retreads on anything that I have owned since then. Imagine how much worse it might have been on a front tire...

As I mentioned earlier, a Bandag Recap on a Michelin carcass IS what we used on small tire lowboy trailers for one company that I worked for with OUTSTANDING performance. They wore like iron and blowouts simply stopped happening. We hauled a lot of M4's with derricks mounted on them on those "very low to the ground" trailers. Those trailers had eight retreads and I finally was able to stop repairing air lines and trailer wiring that happened every time a tire exploded.

 

[Dipstick]

They also have a different load dispersal with less weight on the fronts. Buses are single Axel front and rear with singles in the front. That may have something to do with it. I also know they uses retreads on stears for semi's up here in places.

Maybe so, but they wouldn't allow it in the other states. Most properly loaded semis transfer a good amount of weight to the front axle, which usually has a spring capacity between 12,000 to 20,000 lbs. Ever notice, that on most tractors, the drivers position the fifth wheel slightly ahead of the center line of the tandems? That's to put weight on the steers. Otherwise the steers would be too lightly loaded and wouldn't brake or steer properly. I had a tractor trailer license in N.J. before the CDL came about. I've worked as a truck mechanic. I've never once heard someone say they would put retreads on the steering axle. Don't mean to sound preachy, but retreads on the front are dangerous to life and limb. It's one thing to blow a drive tire, but it's a whole other thing blowing a steering tire. Imagine what would happen to your control when the front rim suddenly hits asphalt at 65 mph on a loaded truck.

 

[Dipstick]

Don't want to start an argument - but a Bandag Recap on a Michelin Carcass will outlast the original Michelin and most other tires. Of course like everything else there are retread facilities that do a first class job. And there are others who will make you swear off recaps forever.

My first car was a 1967 Camero. It was very used. Maybe heavily abused is a better description. There wasn't one square foot on it that didn't have a dent on it. I found a body shop that fixed for me. I wasn't smart enough to know "Bondo" wasn't very stable - but at 16 - it looked pretty dang fine to me. The reason I bring all that up is that I needed tires. SIXTY BUCKS got me four brand new recaps mounted, balanced and on the car. Driving home from the tire store, the left rear had a piece of the recap started beating the side of the car. A piece about eight inches long and two inches wide "let go". Not completely. Just enough to beat the Bondo out of the left rear fender.

I have never run retreads on anything that I have owned since then. Imagine how much worse it might have been on a front tire...

As I mentioned earlier, a Bandag Recap on a Michelin carcass IS what we used on small tire lowboy trailers for one company that I worked for with OUTSTANDING performance. They wore like iron and blowouts simply stopped happening. We hauled a lot of M4's with derricks mounted on them on those "very low to the ground" trailers. Those trailers had eight retreads and I finally was able to stop repairing air lines and trailer wiring that happened every time a tire exploded.

Good story Tim, but would run a Bandag on the steers?

 

[montaillou]

What specifically are the qualities of NDT tires that caused you to hate them?

I don't like how they have a relatively small strip of rubber running down the center that is all smooth. It wasn't a big deal when it was dry, but driving on the highway with them in the rain they felt squirrelly. My thought is they were designed primarily for off-road driving where the tire would sink down far enough that the ridges would contact the road.
So, suppose it depends on what kind of driving you do, and how much. If I only drove around my place occasionally, I probably wouldn't care, but since I take it on 1k+ mile trips, I went with other tires.

Why would you think Dot forbids the use of retreads on busses?

This is only on the steer wheels.

49 CFR § 393.75 - Tires.

www.law.cornell.edu

 

[montaillou]

Good story Tim, but would run a Bandag on the steers?

The prohibition on retreads on the steers only applies to busses. See the link in my previous post. I know some tire places that won't put retreads on the steer wheels, but that's their policy not the law. I'm sure other places will mount them.

I am almost certainly using retreads for my truck. There is retread tire plant within an hour's drive of me, but it's in Canada and I can't get to it.

 

[Mullaney]

Good story Tim, but would run a Bandag on the steers?

Absolutely not. I don't think DOT would allow it even on a MV hobby truck. Based solely on my one bad experience with a completely different product and company 45 years ago I am certain that I wouldn't have any sort of retread on the front axle!

Those Bandag caps are pretty amazing though.

 

[Dipstick]

I don't like how they have a relatively small strip of rubber running down the center that is all smooth. It wasn't a big deal when it was dry, but driving on the highway with them in the rain they felt squirrelly. My thought is they were designed primarily for off-road driving where the tire would sink down far enough that the ridges would contact the road.
So, suppose it depends on what kind of driving you do, and how much. If I only drove around my place occasionally, I probably wouldn't care, but since I take it on 1k+ mile trips, I went with other tires.



This is only on the steer wheels.

49 CFR § 393.75 - Tires.

www.law.cornell.edu

Thanks for the link. I was only talking about not using recaps on the steering axles. On that link in section E, it says that regrooved tires shall not be used on any truck or tractor if it has a capacity equal or greater than 4,920 lbs. My tires have a capacity of 6,700 lbs. or so and the weight on my front axle scaled at 6,200 lbs., the rear axle was 5,240 lbs. empty. I wouldn't use recaps on the front even if it were allowed. Thanks for the info on the NDTs. I always felt that center rib would make them squirrely on paved roads. Especially wet roads. You've confirmed it. 1K is a heck of a long way to drive a Deuce!

 

[montaillou]

that regrooved tires shall not be used

I would like to point out that regrooved tires are not the same as recapped or retread, and that section specifically only mentions regrooved. In my talks with tire salespeople I don't believe they can be impartial since their job is to sell me tires. This article states that retreads are ok for steer position, but I'm sure for every article I find that is pro I can find another that is con. https://www.tirereview.com/steer-position-safe-retreads/
" Many dealers consider retreads a viable option only for drive and trailer axles, but today, experts recognize the steer axle as also a safe and dependable choice in specific applications. "


My criteria for tires, besides the proper size, has been: open shoulder, with a 26/32nd tread depth or better. Mine is not a commercial truck. I don't think I'll ever put even 100k miles (though maybe 50k) on this truck and I don't need to spend the extra money that goes into a Michelin that enables it to be retread up to 3x and will run 700k miles. As long as they're dot approved, I'll take my chances with drive tires. I may be a little more discerning with the steer, but I think a reputable retread (re: Bandag) will work for me there.

 

[Dipstick]

Montaillou, I think you're splitting atoms between regrooves and retreads. I myself don't want anything less than pristine front tires guiding me down the road. If I had to choose between saving dollars and driving safety, I'd park my truck. As far as tire salesmen go, they want to sell you the right tires because their reputation depends on it and they don't want to be sued. Good luck with whatever choice you make and may all your journeys be safe ones.

 

[montaillou]

between regrooves and retreads

Regroove tires take the bald tire and cuts deeper grooves into it. Retread takes a bald tire and adds rubber creating a new tread surface.

Now, if you prefer to not have either of those, that's fine, but they are completely different processes and I'm not even splitting phone books here. All I've been doing is clarifying previous erroneous information that was mentioned here. You can put retreads or recaps on steer tires (except buses). See previously linked DOT rule.