Not starting because no fuel?

[fleetmech]

The Deuce is set up so as you never need to bleed the injectors.

Thanks, I kinda thought so, but like I said, I'm new to this specific pump/ engine myself. I think loosening those lines would still give us/ OP a final confirmation if anything at all is getting where it needs to go?

 

[Floridianson]

When you take off the shut down cover where is the fuel control pointing. If your going make a video to show me the cover needs to be off. I know what one sounds like if it does not start. LOL No need to bleed the injectors I designed it that way. If the truck was ever run out of fuel we just add fuel and bleed at the bleed screw on filters or just wait long enough with just the in tank pump working the system will clear and prime. Bad thing would be run out of fuel and to have to bleed the injectors in a combat zone and no wrench.

 

[carhug12]

The Deuce is set up so as you never need to bleed the injectors. If the fuel control unit assembly is now working free and with the shut down cover off it should be in the 7 o'clock position. This is where it needs to be for the engine to start. When we check for free movement of the fuel control unit assembly as said with cover off it will be around 7 o'clock if not stuck in the shut down position 4 o'clock. That can happen and is better than wide open throttle. With our finger we can move it towards the firewall or about the 4 o'clock position. When we let it go it will snap back to the 7 o'clock position. When all is right before we start it as said it will be at full throttle but if all is right the governor will reduce the rpm to the idle . You never want to try and start a truck with the fuel control unit assembly stuck in the 7 o'clock position. You will be sorry. As for button yep that has been the Deuce's down fall.

When I move it to the 4 oclock, it will slowly return to the 7oclock. It won't snap back like show on other people videos. I don't believe it's the part that interfaces with the spring, I think it's w/e the arm is that actually extends back into the unit towards the fire wall that's gummed up. But that is just a guess.

 

[carhug12]

The Deuce is set up so as you never need to bleed the injectors. If the fuel control unit assembly is now working free and with the shut down cover off it should be in the 7 o'clock position. This is where it needs to be for the engine to start. When we check for free movement of the fuel control unit assembly as said with cover off it will be around 7 o'clock if not stuck in the shut down position 4 o'clock. That can happen and is better than wide open throttle. With our finger we can move it towards the firewall or about the 4 o'clock position. When we let it go it will snap back to the 7 o'clock position. When all is right before we start it as said it will be at full throttle but if all is right the governor will reduce the rpm to the idle . You never want to try and start a truck with the fuel control unit assembly stuck in the 7 o'clock position. You will be sorry. As for button yep that has been the Deuce's down fall.

I have tried to bleed the injectors in the past, but nothing comes out. No smoke ever leaves either. Perhaps the button thing is broken?

Is there a way It can be fixed while everything is on the Duce, or do I have to pull the entire fuel injector off? Or is there a way I just remove the hydraulic head?

 

[Floridianson]

Correct for button or O rings we just remove the Head.

 

[Floridianson]

When I move it to the 4 oclock, it will slowly return to the 7oclock. It won't snap back like show on other people videos. I don't believe it's the part that interfaces with the spring, I think it's w/e the arm is that actually extends back into the unit towards the fire wall that's gummed up. But that is just a guess.

I do believe it is the fuel control unit assembly in the Head getting sticky. Better this happened and you went to start it and it was stuck in wide open position because you did not leave the shut down cable pulled out when you left the truck. Always leave the engine shut down cable pulled out when the truck is sleeping.

 

[M37M35]

When I move it to the 4 oclock, it will slowly return to the 7oclock. It won't snap back like show on other people videos...

This is at least part of your problem. That lever should snap back. Keep putting penetrating lube on it and working it back and forth until it moves freely.

 

[Floridianson]

Just so that everything is clear, have you bled the high pressure lines up at the injectors on top of the engine? You have fuel getting to the pump, if you can confirm there is nothing getting to the injectors, then either something in the pump internally is holding the fuel control off or something has happened to the high pressure pumping element. I myself am fairly new to this specific pump, but I understand there is a 'button' on the bottom of the pump plunger that can fail/ come off and not allow the pump to travel its full stroke and build pressure.

From here it is looking more and more like a Head problem. Yep other than leaking O rings that dang button problem has showed up way to many times. Now on the bleeding of the injectors when all is right we do not need to bleed the Deuce injectors if we just run out of fuel. We do use the bleed screw between the final fuel filters after a filter change to help get the air out faster. For just checking for a problem I like to leave cracking the injectors till the last thing before I pull the Head. I only say this as some injector lines have been on for 30 years and have seen more than a couple of times damage to the tips on the fittings. Believe this happens when the tip of the line get seized to the injector. The metal to metal binds up and can knock a chunk off the sealing area on the line fitting. This will not seal and cause us to buy / find a new line. Yea sometimes we have to remove all the injector lines to R&R the Head. I see where he has already cracked some lines so we will see if any damage was done when / if he gets it running.

 

[carhug12]

When you take off the shut down cover where is the fuel control pointing. If your going make a video to show me the cover needs to be off. I know what one sounds like if it does not start. LOL No need to bleed the injectors I designed it that way. If the truck was ever run out of fuel we just add fuel and bleed at the bleed screw on filters or just wait long enough with just the in tank pump working the system will clear and prime. Bad thing would be run out of fuel and to have to bleed the injectors in a combat zone and no wrench.

I'll shoot a video and show you today where it's pointing

 

[Floridianson]

As long as it is close to the 7 position I will believe you no need. We just never want it to stick in that position. You say the delivery valve and it's bore cleaned up good. You said you have flow to the Head so then I have to move on.
You said you checked with a injector buy taking loose one of the injector lines. So what I might be looking because I have done it more than once is remove the Head and check the button. With any injection we almost have to go with the same 12 steps that some have to do when in AA. Filters, delivery to the Head and then delivery to the injectors. You know / said you have flow / some pressure from just the in tank pump to the Head. You know but skipping a couple of steps you have nothing at the injectors. The delivery valve was checked so that would seem to leave us at looking at the Head/ button. As said in my last post cracking the injector lines has me crossing my fingers as I am hoping they come apart with no damage to the tip fitting. So here after I check everything else on the 12 step I would then check an injector line. Then since we checked everything plus injector that only leaves the Head. Problem is what if it was the delivery valve but you first cracked the injector line and messed up the tip . Now you need a new injector line and the only problem was as said delivery valve. 12 baby steps in order. Hope you get the Head off OK.

 

[carhug12]

Here is a video of the engine shutoff. It was gummed up, but now it snaps back. Especially if the power was on.

 

[carhug12]

Should I attempt this?

If so, I think i just disconnect the fuel lines above, the fuel lines that attach to it, and loosen the 4 bolts and pull it off very carfully.
Before I do this, should I order some O-rings to replace stuff while i'm at it?

If I DONT have to too this, are there any ideas before I actually pull the head off?

 

[frank8003]

When you last shut off the engine as You normally do, did you pull out the shut off slowly until she died or just yam out the handle as if it was some kind of a valve?
If the answer is the latter part of above then it just may be the button.
Study what happens with the governor when the engine is being shutdown.

 

[Floridianson]

Should I attempt this?

If you have to ask no. Read and reread and then read again them TM's on Head removal. When you have it down pat how and what you have to do to remove the Head then aske me again. Also plenty of old threads with pics and maybe some videos would help. It is more than just taking off the lines and pulling the Head.

 

[Floridianson]

I just watched the clip with the guy taking his apart. If your going to make UTube stuff you need to be correct and more info. He did not show the delivery valve coming out and cleaning the valve and boar. He also said nothing when he install plunger drive key. This key if put in backwards the truck will not run and you have to remove the Head again. He also said nothing about the sleeve that rides on the plunger. It has a hole in it and he said nothing which way it goes up or down plus it has to face the correct way. Be care full no all info is the best. Just for correct info the plunger sleeve with the hole, it goes not up.

 

[carhug12]

I just watched the clip with the guy taking his apart. If your going to make UTube stuff you need to be correct and more info. He did not show the delivery valve coming out and cleaning the valve and boar. He also said nothing when he install plunger drive key. This key if put in backwards the truck will not run and you have to remove the Head again. He also said nothing about the sleeve that rides on the plunger. It has a hole in it and he said nothing which way it goes up or down plus it has to face the correct way. Be care full no all info is the best. Just for correct info the plunger sleeve with the hole, it goes not up.

That all sounds very intimidating! I think i'll study up on it for a while before I attempt that. Is there something else that you think I could try beforehand? Maybe WD40 in different spots, or something simlar?

 

[Floridianson]

It is and there are a lot of good threads plus in the Deuce forum on the top of that page is the sticky. There are a couple of them that show and we have discussed thinks of importance that need to happen. I like the one it is listed as Trouble shooting the 465. It has most of the info plus the TM for the Deuce injection. Was thinking about whoever made the U boob video he said nothing about checking the sleeve to plunger clearance plus the moving parts needed oiled before putting the Head together. Plus proper cleaning of the Plunger. Yes please read / search threads and if you do not understand just ask before you pull it apart. There are some good smart people here and someone will help you hopefully before you have trouble. Also WD40 is not a lubricant and will also not cut the varnish / tarnish that builds on the plunger and fuel control unit assembly. https://www.steelsoldiers.com/threads/removing-rebuilding-reinstalling-hydraulic-head.69241/ https://www.steelsoldiers.com/threads/how-to-remove-the-fuel-shutoff-rod-on-the-ip.143476/

LDS465-1 Multifuel Engine Troubleshooting Manual

Attached the Trouble Shooting Manual LDS-465-1 Multifuel Engine. G.

www.steelsoldiers.com

 

[Floridianson]

G pump and Hydraulic Head Removal

Just an FYI to all newbies and those that do not know. These pumps line up the same as all other pumps. There is one caveat that not many know about. There is a oil feed bolt that goes through the rear of the head housing. It will fool you by looking at it, if its been painted it will look like...

www.steelsoldiers.com

Do you know what pump you have? Think I saw a hint.

 

[carhug12]

G pump and Hydraulic Head Removal

Just an FYI to all newbies and those that do not know. These pumps line up the same as all other pumps. There is one caveat that not many know about. There is a oil feed bolt that goes through the rear of the head housing. It will fool you by looking at it, if its been painted it will look like...

www.steelsoldiers.com

Do you know what pump you have? Think I saw a hint.

I don't know, but I can go look. Is there

G pump and Hydraulic Head Removal

Just an FYI to all newbies and those that do not know. These pumps line up the same as all other pumps. There is one caveat that not many know about. There is a oil feed bolt that goes through the rear of the head housing. It will fool you by looking at it, if its been painted it will look like...

www.steelsoldiers.com

Do you know what pump you have? Think I saw a hint.

Here it is! Looks like a UNN Technologies?

 

[Floridianson]

The Head is a 90100A I am talking about the whole injection pump. Read the post # 38 G pump Head removal and see if you have what it looks like. I NO but want you to know and tell me. Was not that long ago I saw my first post on the G pump and did not know that there is another step we have to do to remove the Head. Yes it is in the TM for the Deuce injection and I missed it when I was trying to stay up on the Deuce TM's'. So do not feel bad everybody learns something here on SS. Keep reading threads as there will be a test.