Observations in Flat Towing

[Recovry4x4]

Hey gang, let me say I'm no stranger to the medium tow bar. Mine's sure paid for itself dearly. Today it was used again and I noticed an interesting thing. Those who've ever flat towed a deuce can probably attest to this, they don't much care to turn. They really don't much care to turn right. Heres a quick rundown on the towbar trips of reasonable length.
1) 1952 Stude M275 from Philly. 1250 miles to FL.
2) 1981 AM M35A2 from Baxley GA 400 miles to FL
3) 1984 AM M35A2 from Baxley GA 400 miles to FL
4) 1971 AM M35A2 (no engine) from Columbus OH 1200 miles to FL

All 4 of these tows were done with my pickup truck. The 52 Stude followed me perfectly. Never fought direction and never bound up on a turn. The 81 M35 was facing in the direction I needed to go about 15' off the road. When I hooked up to it and took off it turned left just fine then when I guided right to straighten out, the wheel locked left. Jumped out, corrected the wheels and off I went. From this point on I noticed that gradual turns the trucks would follow, and tight turns and the wheels would lock in the opposite direction requiring a quick jump out to correct. This was more of a problem with the 84 since it had vicegrips for a steering wheel. Now I figured the engineless deuce might be a little different but it did the same darn thing. I've come to anticipate this stuff and am ready when it happens. Now here's the kicker! Today I drug the M108 out of the yard and around the block. This truck, like the other Stude, tracked perfectly. Perhaps there was a geometry change I'm unaware of but it sure follows nicely. I can't attribute it to weight, or wheelbase anymore. Things that make you go Hmm.

 

[Wick246]

Could there be differences in the front end alignment between each of those trucks?

I think we need a picture of a pickup pulling a Deuce...

 

[Recovry4x4]

Thats exacly what I was thinking. I can't find any different specs but more positive caster would surely help the flat towing for sure. As far as a pic, check the bottom of this thread for one and I'll scare up another one! http://www.steelsoldiers.com/index.php?name=PNphpBB2&file=viewtopic&t=2972

 

[Recovry4x4]

OK, here's 2 more pics of my insanity.

 

[marksgarage2]

towing

Kenny, One problem is the angle of your towbar. It has to be level or slightly pointing up from the vehicle being towed to work correctly. When at that angle your pulling down on the bumper putting more force on the tires trying to track. In my poorer days, I towbared my CJ5 on 40 inch tires with my 2 wheel chev pickup. We used to lock the wheel and drag it around turns!

 

[Recovry4x4]

Well, if I have the towbar pointed up, whenever I apply the brakes of the truck, the deuce will just push me along. That angle is necessary just to stop the darned thing. Even when hooked from one deuce to another they have a similar angle. If this angle did play into the problem of the tracking, I would tink it would do that on all the trucks, not just the newer ones. The Studes track and follow perfectly. I gave much consideration on the towbar angle when I first thought of doing such an unsafe stunt. On the first truck I even added shackle mounts on the bottom of the bumper incase I needed to change the angle on the road. Of course I have the axle clamps as well but the change was never warranted. I had similar issues with a CJ-5 with 35s and an 84 Chev SWB 2wd. I added some + caster and it tracked and followed perfectly. I would offer this little tidbit of advice for anyone thinking of doing what I've done too many times, don't!! I got away with it but towing 13,000# behind a pickup without brakes is just dumb and you can call me that. Heck, I worry about that even towing with the deuce. I'll gladly bust my can to help someone before they tow with a pickup. At least get a trailer with brakes.

 

[Crazyguyla]

Kenny, Could have been anything from bad front end alignment , a dragging brake, or... I had a similer problem towing a duece with another duece. I could all just been that wonderful maint from them highly trained mechanics the army has LOL before anyone starts the grief train, I been there trying to train some of the rocks that come down the line

Marcus

 

[rmgill]

So, you're towing the deuce with out brakes? Just how safe is this and why haven't the cops pestered you about it? You do this on the highway?

 

[Desert Rat]

RMG,

Kenny has the cops pestering him more than the average guy. He just can't seem to get away from them! I know he's tried! He's still trying!

 

[marksgarage2]

towing

Kenny, I almost knew you were going to say that when I typed it. Back then a friend had a 46 willys w/38s. Flat towed from NJ to Utah and back no problem on turns. Tracked right behind him like a trailer.

 

[Recovry4x4]

Ryan, all the miles are highway, it's as safe as the idiot behind the wheel makes it and I can't explain why the cops aren't all over me. No one who tows a deuce, tows one one with brakes with the exception of probably a few folks. Unlike the 5 ton, hooking up towed brakes on a deuce requires some fabrication. I have the stuff to do this but the towing vehicle requires air. All I can say is this, I went into into it aware of the weight and brake situation and adjusted my driving accordingly. I would not suggest anyone do this since the only skills I'm sure of are my own. I will tell you this, I don't use the pickup anymore!

 

[Stretch44875]

I had a problem with my CJ2A tracking before, I had adjusted the steering box to tight. Once I back the adjustment on the box of some, it tracked great.

 

[Djfreema]

Ive flat towed three dueces and all three had the same problem with the wheels turning the opposite direction on sharp turns. I cant imagine towing one with a 1 ton truck. On 2 seperate occasions I had the towed duece push the back of my truck sideways almost causing a jack knife. Both times was a slow turn on dirt and wet slippery asphalt, very scary. The last truck I towed I just tied the steering wheel straight with rope and dragged it around the corners, it was the best system.

 

[Clem1226]

I think I rember something about this in PS magazine and I think it is a problem related to the sprague<sp>. I had this happen more than once when I was a wrecker operator and in a hurry so I didn't lift the front end.....when it did happened I would just just lift the front end and I rember the sprague always let go as soon as the tires got off the ground. Maybe pulling the front drive shaft would be a good Idea when flat towing long distances.

just my 2 cents

 

[Recovry4x4]

These experiences are just one of the reasons I built my piggyback device. With that piece, you can tow a deuce anywhere and back it up too.

Each of these tows had the 4 axle shafts and 2 drive flanges removed as well. Pulling drive shafts is always a good idea but I prefer the axles since I can knock the bolts off with an impact.

Ive flat towed three dueces and all three had the same problem with the wheels turning the opposite direction on sharp turns. I cant imagine towing one with a 1 ton truck. On 2 seperate occasions I had the towed duece push the back of my truck sideways almost causing a jack knife. Both times was a slow turn on dirt and wet slippery asphalt, very scary. The last truck I towed I just tied the steering wheel straight with rope and dragged it around the corners, it was the best system.

 

[williamh]

i towed 2 , 5 ton trucks with my m35a2 only a couple of miles on a dirt road .. and had almost the same problems .. wouldnt turn for anything without the wheels cramping to the left .. the right turns seemed to go alright .. but the left turns sucked .. only one of the turcks turned o.k. and it didnt have a a steering box attached but did have the steering dampers on the right side .. it cramped going left but straingned out quickley and tracked well , almost better than the complete truck .

none of the trucks i have towed where any fun .. only having them are ..