Oklahoma Bill Introduced to Create Titling for HUMVEES

[donkren]

From the SEMA Action Network Website:

http://semasan.com/page.asp?content=aa2018OK1&g=SEMAGA

DON’T DELAY! ​

Please contact the Oklahoma House Committee on Transportation Immediately to request support for H.B. 3317:

• H.B. 3317 allows for the titling of HUMVEES.
• H.B. 3317 defines a “High Mobility Multipurpose Wheeled Vehicle” or “HMMWV” as a four-wheel drive tactical military vehicle that can carry a wide variety of military hardware, a vehicle more commonly know as a Humvee.

Overview:Legislation (H.B. 3317) allows for the titling of High-Mobility Multipurpose Vehicles. The bill would restrict these vehicles from traveling on Interstate Highways. Under current law, “HMMWV” vehicles are not able to be titled in the state. This bill is currently in the House Committee on Transportation.

From the Oklahoma State Legislature Website:

http://www.oklegislature.gov/BillInfo.aspx?Bill=hb3317&Session=1800

Motor vehicles; High Mobility Multipurpose Wheeled Vehicles; registration; use on highways; effective date.

AS INTRODUCED

An Act relating to motor vehicles; requiring the registration and titling of High Mobility Multipurpose Wheeled Vehicles; requiring the promulgation of certain rules; authorizing certain operation of High Mobility Multipurpose Wheeled Vehicles; limiting the operation of High Mobility Multipurpose Wheeled Vehicles; requiring compliance with certain regulations and rules; amending 47 O.S. 2011, Section 1102, as last amended by Section 1, Chapter 57, O.S.L. 2016 (47 O.S. Supp. 2017, Section 1102), which relates to definitions used in the Oklahoma Vehicle License and Registration Act; defining term; and providing an effective date.

 

[Flyingvan911]

Seems reasonable to me.

 

[Tinstar]

Did not know HB3317 was introduced.

I will call them tomorrow and voice support.

Edit:
Have not called
Waiting to hear more opinions

 

[porkysplace]

From the SEMA Action Network Website:

http://semasan.com/page.asp?content=aa2018OK1&g=SEMAGA

DON’T DELAY!
​

Please contact the Oklahoma House Committee on Transportation Immediately to request support for H.B. 3317:

• H.B. 3317 allows for the titling of HUMVEES.
• H.B. 3317 defines a “High Mobility Multipurpose Wheeled Vehicle” or “HMMWV” as a four-wheel drive tactical military vehicle that can carry a wide variety of military hardware, a vehicle more commonly know as a Humvee.

Overview:Legislation (H.B. 3317) allows for the titling of High-Mobility Multipurpose Vehicles. The bill would restrict these vehicles from traveling on Interstate Highways. Under current law, “HMMWV” vehicles are not able to be titled in the state. This bill is currently in the House Committee on Transportation.

From the Oklahoma State Legislature Website:

http://www.oklegislature.gov/BillInfo.aspx?Bill=hb3317&Session=1800

Motor vehicles; High Mobility Multipurpose Wheeled Vehicles; registration; use on highways; effective date.

AS INTRODUCED

An Act relating to motor vehicles; requiring the registration and titling of High Mobility Multipurpose Wheeled Vehicles; requiring the promulgation of certain rules; authorizing certain operation of High Mobility Multipurpose Wheeled Vehicles; limiting the operation of High Mobility Multipurpose Wheeled Vehicles; requiring compliance with certain regulations and rules; amending 47 O.S. 2011, Section 1102, as last amended by Section 1, Chapter 57, O.S.L. 2016 (47 O.S. Supp. 2017, Section 1102), which relates to definitions used in the Oklahoma Vehicle License and Registration Act; defining term; and providing an effective date.

Made more readable for you the black type doesn't show up well on OD.

 

[juanprado]

Step in the right direction but why can they not be used on interstate?

Not a perfect solution.

 

[sue]

49 CFR 571.500 looks like it applies
to low speed vehicles, maybe that’s why
the no interstate thing?

 

[99nouns]

I never drive on interstate anyways... I dont like going faster than 40. But I got a M927.

 

[Flyingvan911]

My guess is they are worried about vehicles traveling 55 or 65 on the 75mph highways. A legitimate consideration. The interstate's convenient but we aren't going anywhere fast anyway.

 

[98G]

My guess is they are worried about vehicles traveling 55 or 65 on the 75mph highways. A legitimate consideration. The interstate's convenient but we aren't going anywhere fast anyway.

Consider - I can drive 55mph in the right lane of the interstate, and there's plenty of room to get around me. I am not creating an impedance.

Or prohibit me from the interstate and now I'm on a one lane hwy with traffic stacking up behind me and passing unsafely. Of course I'll pull over at every opportunity to let people by, but this is insufficient.

As an impatient distracted driver of a normal vehicle, where would you rather have me?

 

[porkysplace]

Maybe it has something to do with the 50 mph minimum speed on rural sections of turnpikes.

[h=2]Oklahoma[/h]In Oklahoma, the maximum posted speed limit is 75 miles per hour on turnpikes and 70 mph on all other freeways. Most other rural highways, divided or undivided, have a 65 mph speed limit (although some rural divided highways have a 70 mph limit). The minimum speed limit on almost all Interstate Highways, freeways, and turnpikes is 40 mph, except when the speed limit is 75 mph (found only on turnpikes), in which case the minimum speed is 50 mph. In addition, rural sections of turnpike are supplemented with a sign warning "no tolerance". On May 9, 2016, Governor Fallin signed HB 3167 which removes numerical caps on rural highway speed limits in Oklahoma which takes effect in November 2016. Even with this bill the speed limits across the state are not expected to change because of budget issues in doing studies [SUP][130] ][/SUP]

 

[DeadParrot]

Push for passage as is rather then risk then it getting caught up in floor fights over turnpike safety. This group of legislators is having trouble getting a basic budget passed. Budget failed last year. Special session 1 did little. Special session 2 is now running concurrent with the normal session. Anything that might slow passage risks the bill getting hung in committee and then the best case is it might get out next session. This session ends in May by the OK Constitution and I think there is a much sooner deadline for non-budget bills to be considered.

For the 55 on the Turner turnpike not being a hazard, the speed limit of 75 is sort of a suggestion. 85 seems fairly common. Do you really want someone closing at 30+MPH while they are staring at their phone or futzing with their infotainment screen that keeps rebooting?

 

[98G]

Do you really want someone closing at 30+MPH while they are staring at their phone or futzing with their infotainment screen that keeps rebooting?

Been there, done that.

https://www.steelsoldiers.com/showthread.php?145463-Distracted-Driving

Edit to add -

Consider how this would impact the out of state MV enthusiasts attending the KAMO rally. They have hmmwv''s with unrestricted use plates. They plan to drive them on the interstate to attend the rally. According to the letter of the law, this would be ok. Oklahoma accepts drivers licenses and vehicle licensing from out of state. The proposed OK law would issue a license plate that has restrictions attached to it, but it would not place those restrictions on vehicles not displaying that plate.

I speculate that LEO would pull over and ticket out of state hmmwvs on the interstate. I also speculate that these tickets would be dismissed when it got in front of a judge. Anybody want to be the one to test that? Not me.... if my hmmwv goes to the KAMO rally, it'll be in the bed of my 5ton...

 

[sue]

What’s wrong with getting “regular” plates?
we have a hmmwv and a M35 that have
regular plates, so why would you want a bill
that puts lots of restrictions on what you
can do and when and where you can and
cant drive? Along with lowering your resale
ability. Bottom line it sucks.

 

[98G]

What’s wrong with getting “regular” plates?
we have a hmmwv and a M35 that have
regular plates, so why would you want a bill
that puts lots of restrictions on what you
can do and when and where you can and
cant drive? Along with lowering your resale
ability. Bottom line it sucks.

According to the first post, currently hmmwv's can't be titled at all in OK. I have no idea whether that's accurate or not.

This reads like it was crafted with the intent to create a path to lightly restricted on road use where no path currently exists. Unlike the VA bill, this one limits itself to hmmwv's and appears to remove restrictions while creating no new ones - allowing vehicles on all roads except interstate highways, where currently these vehicles aren't eligible to be on any roads at all. However, that's only true if the original assertion that hmmwvs can't be titled and plated in Oklahoma is correct.

 

[sue]

Maybe our post was confusing,....so let us try to clear it up
get regular plates for your hmmwv, we have “regular” plates
on our hmmwv, lots of other people have regular plates on
there hmmwvs in Oklahoma.
Just don’t understand why we need more laws?
And more restrictions? If you don’t feel safe driveing
on the interstate, then don’t.
If you don’t want to use your deuce, acp, hmmwv etc. for
your business or commercial use then don’t.

 

[98G]

Maybe our post was confusing,....so let us try to clear it up
get regular plates for your hmmwv, we have “regular” plates
on our hmmwv, lots of other people have regular plates on
there hmmwvs in Oklahoma.
Just don’t understand why we need more laws?
And more restrictions? If you don’t feel safe driveing
on the interstate, then don’t.
If you don’t want to use your deuce, acp, hmmwv etc. for
your business or commercial use then don’t.

In other words, the original assertion that hmmwvs aren't eligible to be titled in OK is wrong...

 

[Tinstar]

Turner Turnpike is the Autobahn of Oklahoma.
As mentioned, 85-90+ is the norm.
OHP patrols it as vigorously as their budget allows, but seems to have little effect once the trooper is passed and out of sight.
Local/county LE usually stay clear from it.
Air patrols have suffered from budget cuts.
Multiple fatalities due to someone slamming into the back of a slower vehicle is becoming common.
I would never consider taking my M1008A1 on it, no matter how convenient.
I have taken my 5 ton and it was spooky.

I know the minimum speed is 50.
Smaller sigh should read “At your own risk”.

Driving culture has changed and not for the better.

 

[donkren]

In other words, the original assertion that hmmwvs aren't eligible to be titled in OK is wrong...

Maybe, Maybe not. You might have a plate on your truck today, and a letter in the mailbox tomorrow revoking it. Even if it has been registered for annually for 20 years. We need need more information. Why would this legislation have been proposed if not for someone having trouble registering their truck? If it is a preemptive measure - offered in advance of trouble in OK, prompted by the difficulties many have been experiencing in other states, then I tip my hat to whoever is trying to get ahead of this mess.

I'd personally like to see all Former Military Vehicles specifically exempted from FMVSS and EPA compliance in all 50 states. Just like they are at the federal level. If you don't have that written into your state law, or specific "permission" for your truck like this bill grants HMMWVs, you may always be vulnerable to someone "reinterpreting" the law to mean your truck is ineligible for registration, or in some cases, just applying the law as it is written. I realize a blanket exemption is unlikely. And I can see where that would be problematic from the DMV's point of view.

Make no mistake, this whole problem is NOT caused by any HMMWV owner trying to register his truck. The HMMWV just happens to be the tip of the spear. The controversy has been brewing for decades. And it has many causes.

From their website: "The American Association of Motor Vehicle Administrators (AAMVA) is a tax-exempt, nonprofit organization developing model programs in motor vehicle administration, law enforcement and highway safety. The association also serves as an information clearinghouse in these areas, and acts as the international spokesman for these interests." It appears most states are marching to this drum.

AAMVA develops policy positions, writes best practices and model code in a coordinated effort to homogenize vehicle codes across the nation. This is a necessary effort and is a good thing for most, but military vehicles simply don't fit into their vision of the future.

AAMVA also administers the The National Motor Vehicle Title Information System (NMVTIS). This is where the 17 digit VIN comes into play. The plan is to create a national history of every vehicle from cradle to grave. Again, from their website:
"It is designed to protect consumers from fraud and unsafe vehicles and to keep stolen vehicles from being resold. NMVTIS is also a tool that assists states and law enforcement in deterring and preventing title fraud and other crimes." Our military vehicles lacking 17 digit VINs do not automatically integrate into this system either.

There is also the Federal DOT, which spawned the NHTSA and the FMVSS that are so often the club we are beaten over the heads with. The feds exempt our trucks, but it is easy for the state to require certification of FMVSS compliance as a solution to a host of their problems regarding registering import and other "difficult" (including former military) vehicles.

Same goes for the EPA.

Finally, and probably the biggest issue feeding this whole controversy is liability concerns. It seems obvious that a universal set of safety standards (FMVSS) would do a great deal to limit runawaylawsuits. And almost no former military vehicle is certified as FMVSS compliant. So this is a problem for all of us.

Anyone making or doing anything in the US is vulnerable to lawsuit, and they are costly to defend against, even if you are right. I believe AM General knows they built a safe truck in the HMMWV, probably safer that most former military vehicles. But they know if they are on the road in civilian hands, they will end up getting sued. Given the popularity of the HMMWV, they could get sued a lot. So they have taken the unusual position, that these truck should not be allowed on the road, and launched a campaign to convince DMVs across the nation to protect them by simply banning their use.

The HMMWV is the focus of much of the controversy right now. But, make no mistake, if these forces prevail, WE ALL LOSE. It weakens us, and our argument for continued use of former military vehicles to fight among ourselves. We need to stand together and push back hard and now.

 

[DeadParrot]

I am NOT an expert in OK DMV laws. That said, I recently purchased a M35A2C from a private OK seller. It had been converted at some past point into a dump bed, then apparently a hay truck. No paperwork existed. Seller said he purchased at local auction. Passenger windows has faded auction sticker to support this. He provided a Bill of Sale. When I went to try to get proper tag, title and such, first stop was a major tag agent in OKC. Ladies I talked wanted to help but admitted they didn't know what to do. They called someone at the Tax Commission(our agency that handles DMV type stuff). Took about a half hour to get the answer that I needed to go to court to get a VIN then a second court visit for tag and title. I decided to visit the Tax Commission in person. Nice lady there said no problem, fill out this form and bring back. Make, model, VIN/serial number, etc. She seemed knowledgeable about military vehicles and knew that it didn't have a normal VIN. Returned with filled out form. Got back a set of forms to take to the tag agent. Visited tag agency again. There I was told for the first time that I needed a notarized bill of sale. Worked with the seller to get the needed information for the tag agency to notarize the BoS. A week later, went back, paid my money, and got my standard good for all roads tag. Was told my title would show up in a week or so. This is normal procedure in OK. After no title for a month, called the Tax Commission, provided the tag number and was told the title was on hold pending VIN inspection by a tag agent. First anyone had said that was required. He did say there was no time limit on getting the VIN verified and the title was on hold until then. So I now have a registered, fees paid, tag issued vehicle with no title.

My point with this is the even the folks that are supposed to know the laws and rules don't. If it falls outside the standard car/ coml vehicle norm, your results may vary. I have no reason to think our OK legislators are any more knowledgeable about OK MV laws then the tag agents and Tax Commission that carry them out. It is possible the sponsor of this bill is an expert and is fixing a real void in the law. It is also possible that a HUMVEE is perfectly able to be tagged and titled with the existing laws and this legislator doesn't know that and introduced this bill at the request of an equally ignorant constituent.

 

[DeadParrot]

If I am reading the status of this correctly, it was amended to remove the no turnpikes restriction, passed the House and was sent to the Senate. Also heard on the TV news that there is a bill to raise the speed limit on some turnpikes to 80mph.