Opening up my own shop, gauging intrest

[HETvet]

So I've been presented the opportunity to go in to business modifying, selling, and repairing former military vehicles, with a specialty in HMMWVs. We will be located in the DFW area of north Texas. I'm currently in the beginning stages of designing a complete bolt on turbo option for trucks powered by the 6.2. In an effort to get an idea of interest, any one out there interested in a kit like this? The goal is to come in cheeper than a 6.5 swap with about the same power out put. Also, would like to know what other modifications the community as a whole would like to have available, or any problems that the community would like a solution to? Lastly, I would like to see if there is any interest in doing business with a shop such as the one I have presented here? Feel free to research me here on this forum, as I will be doing the work to begin with, and eventually training future technicians, be a SME and projects manager.

To the admins, please feel free to move and/or modify this post/thread to reach others in different forums that might also have an interest; I don't think it's right to flood each and every section with basically the same verbiage to get a good grasp on instead and to have maximum reach. It is not our goal to compete with other venders/businesses. What we would like to see is to work together with other businesses/vendors in an effort to provide maximum customer satisfaction and service. Thank you!

mike

 

[orgnal]

So I've been presented the opportunity to go in to business modifying, selling, and repairing former military vehicles, with a specialty in HMMWVs. We will be located in the DFW area of north Texas. I'm currently in the beginning stages of designing a complete bolt on turbo option for trucks powered by the 6.2. In an effort to get an idea of interest, any one out there interested in a kit like this? The goal is to come in cheeper than a 6.5 swap with about the same power out put. Also, would like to know what other modifications the community as a whole would like to have available, or any problems that the community would like a solution to? Lastly, I would like to see if there is any interest in doing business with a shop such as the one I have presented here? Feel free to research me here on this forum, as I will be doing the work to begin with, and eventually training future technicians, be a SME and projects manager.

To the admins, please feel free to move and/or modify this post/thread to reach others in different forums that might also have an interest; I don't think it's right to flood each and every section with basically the same verbiage to get a good grasp on instead and to have maximum reach. It is not our goal to compete with other venders/businesses. What we would like to see is to work together with other businesses/vendors in an effort to provide maximum customer satisfaction and service. Thank you!

mike

Personally, I think it is awesome! I would be more interested in a transmission swap - 3 spd to 4 spd.

McReddy

 

[HETvet]

Personally, I think it is awesome! I would be more interested in a transmission swap - 3 spd to 4 spd.

McReddy

staying fully mechanical or like a 4L80E or 700R4?

 

[Bighorn]

I would be interested in a kit.
That is the primary reason I am doing the durability work (Fluidampr, injector pump, new 4 core radiator, Joeblow911 cooling upgrade etc.) to my 6.2 first.
At some point next spring after the snow comes off and it isn't minus 20 up here I am going to pull the heads and replace the head gaskets.
But by next summer I will most definitely be interested in a turbo kit.

Questions;
Will the kit require/need and intercooler?
Will exhaust need to be shortened or modified? (I know, you said bolt-on).
Will the injector pump require re-tuning?
Does the turbo unit come with a warranty; is it new or rebuilt?
What kind of oil cooler system will the turbo have? Oil pan modifications for return oil?

 

[orgnal]

staying fully mechanical or like a 4L80E or 700R4?

I would be ok with either approach as long as I can go above 55 with out WOT.

McReddy

 

[Havok]

So I've been presented the opportunity to go in to business modifying, selling, and repairing former military vehicles, with a specialty in HMMWVs. We will be located in the DFW area of north Texas. I'm currently in the beginning stages of designing a complete bolt on turbo option for trucks powered by the 6.2. In an effort to get an idea of interest, any one out there interested in a kit like this? The goal is to come in cheeper than a 6.5 swap with about the same power out put. Also, would like to know what other modifications the community as a whole would like to have available, or any problems that the community would like a solution to? Lastly, I would like to see if there is any interest in doing business with a shop such as the one I have presented here? Feel free to research me here on this forum, as I will be doing the work to begin with, and eventually training future technicians, be a SME and projects manager.

To the admins, please feel free to move and/or modify this post/thread to reach others in different forums that might also have an interest; I don't think it's right to flood each and every section with basically the same verbiage to get a good grasp on instead and to have maximum reach. It is not our goal to compete with other venders/businesses. What we would like to see is to work together with other businesses/vendors in an effort to provide maximum customer satisfaction and service. Thank you!

mike

With the known cylinder #8 issue I dont think I would want to sink money into a turbo kit for the 6.2. Id rather just go right to Duramax or Cummins and have a bulletproof truck. Worst case id go turbo 6.5 cause you can find them cheap.

 

[Bighorn]

With the known cylinder #8 issue I dont think I would want to sink money into a turbo kit for the 6.2. Id rather just go right to Duramax or Cummins and have a bulletproof truck. Worst case id go turbo 6.5 cause you can find them cheap.

Check out the cucv cooling upgrade thread here on Steel Soldiers.
Also; 6.2 cheap, plentiful, no computer.
I wouldn't call Duramax "bulletproof" either.
My old boss went through 3 sets of injectors on his Duramax.
The 6.7 Cummins at the lodge is great until the egr filter plugs, turbo speed sensor fries, or the dpf needs to be changed.
And what is it about Dodge vehicles and the dang check engine light going off for no reason.
The "information center" says; "See Dealer, your power will be de-rated immediately". or same darn thing.
Thanks computer.. thanks.
The next day.. "System Okay." Yea, I know. I have to drive it to work regardless and it made it here so I guess.. Thanks computer.. thanks.
Oh yea, another point for the 6.2 powered rig.. NO STINKING CHECK ENGINE LIGHT EVER!
No DEF fluid either.
You know that's pee right?
They actually have you put pee into your truck because the computer wants it.
Nuts.

They all have their issues.
I'll take the non-electronic diesel or gas engine every day of the week and twice on Sunday.
I think in this day and age of the ever increasing intrusion of technology into every facet of our lives; the lowly 6.2 stands as a refreshing antidote to the poisons of an over complex, technotronic, technocracy.

Or it could just be because they are cool.
Why are there still steam trains?

Alright, I really don't have a valid counter argument for the Duramax or Cummins other than I have no desire to own one myself.
There.

 

[Retiredwarhorses]

6.2 and 6.5 NA never suffered from a #8 cylinder issue....that was only Turbo GM blocks from 9X-2000.
GEP fixed the casting issues once they were purchased by AM General

 

[NDT]

Great idea, one which I have personally tossed around for quite a while. There are huge numbers of new HMMWV owners that do not have the ability to properly fix/upgrade their trucks, just look at the upcharge people are willing to pay to "Plan B" for a fixed/upgraded truck. My personal reservation with this is that when you convert a hobby to a business, the last thing you want to do after 10 hours of wrenching on someone's HMMWV is wrench on your own.

 

[Chief_919]

From a business perspective, keep in mind that the number of surplus HMMWV's being sold is very finite, we will not see this kind of volume much longer.

Sit and run the numbers on how much work you need to keep the shop out of the red and if you can do that volume now, and if you can when these trucks are no longer being surplussed.

 

[86humv]

Best upgrade would be a 4L80e overdrive trans./242 Transfer case.

 

[ryanruck]

An interesting option to consider...

A buddy has a 6.2 with Banks kit and 4L80E in his M1028 and it's a totally different truck.

I had been planning to go with a 6.5T drivetrain from Southern Metals but it doesn't sound like that's going to happen now so, considering I'm going to have to go a different route, this has my attention as an alternative but only if it's going to work with my DWF intake setup.

I've already got the late model 242 in my truck so would just need the turbo engine and 4L80E.

Check out the cucv cooling upgrade thread here on Steel Soldiers.
Also; 6.2 cheap, plentiful, no computer.
I wouldn't call Duramax "bulletproof" either.
My old boss went through 3 sets of injectors on his Duramax.
The 6.7 Cummins at the lodge is great until the egr filter plugs, turbo speed sensor fries, or the dpf needs to be changed.
And what is it about Dodge vehicles and the dang check engine light going off for no reason.
The "information center" says; "See Dealer, your power will be de-rated immediately". or same darn thing.
Thanks computer.. thanks.
The next day.. "System Okay." Yea, I know. I have to drive it to work regardless and it made it here so I guess.. Thanks computer.. thanks.
Oh yea, another point for the 6.2 powered rig.. NO STINKING CHECK ENGINE LIGHT EVER!
No DEF fluid either.
You know that's pee right?
They actually have you put pee into your truck because the computer wants it.
Nuts.

They all have their issues.
I'll take the non-electronic diesel or gas engine every day of the week and twice on Sunday.
I think in this day and age of the ever increasing intrusion of technology into every facet of our lives; the lowly 6.2 stands as a refreshing antidote to the poisons of an over complex, technotronic, technocracy.

Or it could just be because they are cool.
Why are there still steam trains?

Alright, I really don't have a valid counter argument for the Duramax or Cummins other than I have no desire to own one myself.
There.

I had gone back and forth on 6.5T and Dmax swaps. With the Dmax, sure you get gobs more power and fuel efficiency but you lose one of the best assets the HMMWV has, the waterproofing it's engineered with, especially when it's enhanced with the DWF kit.

 

[HETvet]

I would be interested in a kit.
That is the primary reason I am doing the durability work (Fluidampr, injector pump, new 4 core radiator, Joeblow911 cooling upgrade etc.) to my 6.2 first.
At some point next spring after the snow comes off and it isn't minus 20 up here I am going to pull the heads and replace the head gaskets.
But by next summer I will most definitely be interested in a turbo kit.

Questions;
Will the kit require/need and intercooler?
Will exhaust need to be shortened or modified? (I know, you said bolt-on)
Will the injector pump require re-tuning?
Does the turbo unit come with a warranty; is it new or rebuilt?
What kind of oil cooler system will the turbo have?
Oil pan modifications for return oil?

Will the kit require/need and intercooler? I feel all forced induction systems (minus chemical charging) should have an aftercooler. Will it require it, no. Will there be the option for it, Yes.
Will exhaust need to be shortened or modified? (I know, you said bolt-on). Yes. The stock exhaust manifolds have to go. Beyond that, all I can tell you is there will be exhaust modification, but how much were not sure. Rest assured you will have the parts needed to make the install complete. Remove stock parts, install parts from the kit.
Will the injector pump require re-tuning? Again, it's not required. But the options for fueling will look something like ;new DB2831 IP, new DB4831 (mechanical), marine injectors, or something like this.
Does the turbo unit come with a warranty; is it new or rebuilt? New. This design process is a joint venture. Once we get to production, me and the company I'm working with will be the only 2 authorized retailers of the kit, and installers of the kit. If you have me install it, there will be a warranty.
What kind of oil cooler system will the turbo have? I can't answer this question at the moment.
Oil pan modifications for return oil? absolutely not

 

[HETvet]

I would be ok with either approach as long as I can go above 55 with out WOT.

McReddy

If there is enough intrest in it, we could make a kit.

 

[HETvet]

With the known cylinder #8 issue I dont think I would want to sink money into a turbo kit for the 6.2. Id rather just go right to Duramax or Cummins and have a bulletproof truck. Worst case id go turbo 6.5 cause you can find them cheap.

It requires a 2.5" body lift minimum to do the duramax conversion. You must also swap the transmission as well. Even used duramax engines are expensive. You don't really want an LB7 due to the non-VGT turbo and the injectors failing. You don't want an LLY ether; the compressor is running at the ragged edges of the compressor map in stock form. The LBZ is the next one in the lineup. It just so happens to be the most sought after as well =$$$$. The Allison trans is also not cheep. And both are individually controlled by their own control module. You need custom hoses made to get the factory hydroboost to work with the D-Max power steering pump. You need to upgrade your front springs as well, cause the engine is heavy. That's why is about $30K on average to have the swap done and done right. Yes, I've done this swap before.

the only 2 cummins I would use would be a 6BT 5.9 12 valve or 24 valve (converted to a P-Pump injection pump). The cummins is an easier swap to do; no body lift required, no electronics. But no where near the power the d max has, is a heavier engine, and requires trans and drive shafts to be swapped do due to overall length of the engine.

But I can handle these swaps as well.just don't get sticker shock at how much it cost to swap in a cummins or d max.

 

[HETvet]

Great idea, one which I have personally tossed around for quite a while. There are huge numbers of new HMMWV owners that do not have the ability to properly fix/upgrade their trucks, just look at the upcharge people are willing to pay to "Plan B" for a fixed/upgraded truck. My personal reservation with this is that when you convert a hobby to a business, the last thing you want to do after 10 hours of wrenching on someone's HMMWV is wrench on your own.

This is not just HMMWV work we do. It's all wheeled former military vehicles. I personally don't own any military vehicles. But I mod and/or repair cars and trucks all day every day now and still take on side jobs and work on my own vehicles. It's my personal form of therapy.

 

[HETvet]

From a business perspective, keep in mind that the number of surplus HMMWV's being sold is very finite, we will not see this kind of volume much longer.

Sit and run the numbers on how much work you need to keep the shop out of the red and if you can do that volume now, and if you can when these trucks are no longer being surplussed.

well again, this is not just HMMWVs we do. It's all military wheeled vehicles. The advantage to the HMMWV specialist is it translates over the the civilian H1. Plus rural VFDs, LEO have former military vehicles and need repair and service as well.

 

[HETvet]

An interesting option to consider...

A buddy has a 6.2 with Banks kit and 4L80E in his M1028 and it's a totally different truck.

I had been planning to go with a 6.5T drivetrain from Southern Metals but it doesn't sound like that's going to happen now so, considering I'm going to have to go a different route, this has my attention as an alternative but only if it's going to work with my DWF intake setup.

I've already got the late model 242 in my truck so would just need the turbo engine and 4L80E.


I had gone back and forth on 6.5T and Dmax swaps. With the Dmax, sure you get gobs more power and fuel efficiency but you lose one of the best assets the HMMWV has, the waterproofing it's engineered with, especially when it's enhanced with the DWF kit.

Just some food for thought, the LSSV is powered by a duramax. And, if coolant and oil stays in the engine, by default water can't get in.
Moral of the story, it can be water proofed. Neglect will un water proof it though.

 

[ken]

How about also becoming a dealer or a remanufacturer in Texas. Bonded titles, ETC. So you could help people with title issues.

 

[HETvet]

We are planning on having one of our guys get their dealers licence and every vehicle we sell will be completely street legal and documented as such