Other boost options

[skysix]

Has anyone tried two smaller turbo's (one per side) to reduce the turbo lag/get boost at lower RPM's?

Or a blower - again for lower RPM power?

Or a blower/turbo combo (with a wastegate natch)?

Also curious as to how hard it is ($$) to safely prep engine for boost over 10 (safely) and where the new limit is.

 

[gungearz]

What about propane injection for more boost...?

 

[Westech]

Building a 6.2 to handle lots of fuel and boost is a very pricy road to go down. It takes a lot of work and heavy inspections to make sure a 6.2 block and internal parts can handle it. I just read a build on the Internet (google 6.2 diesel build) and it to me might not sound worth it. Well over 5 grand in parts and machine shop services for 225 hp.
A 6.2 is a 6.2. A high compression diesel made for good fuel economy and around the same power as the gas engines of that time. If you try to make it a hot rod it's going to cost ya. Live with what it is or for the money you might want to re power it.

 

[twomorestrokes]

Agreed. Turbo lag is a moot point on a 6.2 really anyway as they come on fairly early and with 10 psi max there is no lag issues with this "powerhouse" lol. Turbo lag is felt with more heavily boosted engines that can handle the extra hp. The 6.2 is all about lag anyway.

 

[skysix]

so I should be able to get the full 10 psi boost at 1500-1800 rpm?

 

[insanejecke]

What about propane injection for more boost...?

I have been thinking the same thing cost less then a turbo and when you need it you can turn it on.

 

[Skinny]

I'm not an expert with diesels or propane injection but I think the only advantage of propane on an NA diesel is maybe more complete combustion. Putting any more hydrocarbons into an NA diesel whether it is diesel or propane will result in over fueling and black smoke. Probably why no one does it.

I agree on modding a 6.2 diesel...no point. Someone on here had an extensive thread on building a 6.2 Detroit. I just don't get it. I think doing a 6.5 turbo setup is cool if done on the cheap. Same thing for doing a pair of small turbos if you have the fab skills. Trying to make a powerhouse or compete with the other diesels on the market is not going to happen. I hate to say it but a Cummins fits the bill and will make double the power on the same budget. It will also do it and still not explode. Not to jump on a bandwagon but there is a reason why so many people use that engine for swaps.

Having said all that, I wouldn't mind if my 6.2 made more power

 

[Iceman3005]

As for the 6.2........well lets me start first with I have been die hard cummins guy for 20 years now, and most everyone I talk to bad mouth's the 6.2, having said that I started doing my own research about 6 months ago becuase I haven't been able to get any straight answers. After countless hours reading books studying gm tech manual's and and reading information on the internet (more tec manuals), I have come to the understanding that these engine's where in fact designed to be work horses. the early years of the 5.7 diesel are the starting point of the gm failures with diesel's and by the time the 6.2 came out the reputation had been set. Then in 1995 with the introduction of the electronic injection pump and all its short commings, it set the stage for the reputation of all the 6.2's and 6.5's. After reading several articles on a turbo 6.2 diesel, these engines where beating the early dodge cummins in Horsepower and torque, beating it in the 1/4 mile and the hill climb with a 8000 lb. trailer, they where only 2 seconds behind the power stroke in the hill climb but 6 seconds faster than the dodge(early year of dodge).

From what I have read these engines are very reliable and can handle up to 20 psi of boost (with arp head studs), and 400 HP. the only two downfalls are bad harmonic balancers, this should be the first thing you check and repair if the rubber ring looks dry rotted or is squishing out, switching to a fluid harmonic balancer is strongly recommended. This is the only reason the cranks break is due to bad harmonic balancers NOT pulling heavy loads or increasing power. Also the cooling passages on the back of the block causes poor cooling when MORE power is added or HEAVY loads are towed, but there are higher GPM water pumps to solve this problem.

The marine 6.2's where pushing over 600 HP, they where the same block, crank, pistons, heads, etc. as the civi 6.2. The only reason it could handle more power is the marine engine has the whole lake to cool the motor, not a small radiator.

Kennedy diesel is a good place to start if your looking for more power.

 

[Skinny]

I agree that the 6.2 gets a bad rap and they work well in stock form. Would you really want to have a 400-600hp 6.2? It is like a grenade with the pin out. Do you have any data on this marine 6.2 because I'm very skeptical on that number being a stock figure.

Just for comparison, if you jump up into a MDT weight class vehicle, you will still see the Cummins 5.9 in school buses, box trucks, etc. along with marine applications. These engines are so detuned in a 1 ton truck chassis it is not even funny. Don't see too many Class A coaches driving with a Detroit 6.2 back in that era.

 

[Iceman3005]

Peninsular diesel is the company that took the 6.2 and adapted it to the marine applications, the're the ones that started the high HP for the 6.2. Kennedy Diesel, another source for performance parts, Also Heath diesel.

If you had read the thread you would notice I put "early dodge" in brackets! Yes the cummins is a lot better motor, just getting tired of people giving false info about an engine. If you also would have read the thread correctly you would see that I have spent months researching this, it can't fit into a thread nor do I have that many hours to sit here and type it up.

 

[RiceBurnerBrian]

Great thread to read about our 6.2's, right now I am saving up for a "possible" Banks turbo kit for my CUCV...

 

[twomorestrokes]

Yes there are a few diesel engines that I'd rather have in my 1008. If it wasn't such a hard and expensive swap I'd have a Duramax and an Allison 6 speed. However, my original intention was to own a cheap wood hauler that I could just park behind the barn when not in use and NOT mess with it. I ended up with a clean, very heavy duty 30,000 mile truck from Nevada that ran great but had the power of a slug. I went the cheapest route possible and found a 6.5 'Burb being parted out on C/L and bought the turbo setup from it for $400 including electric fuel pump . Say what you want about the 6.2 but it's hard to toss a good running low mileage engine when a cheap used turbo will make it run like you thought it should in the first place but didn't. Still no powerhouse, but with spring pressure set at 10-12 psi max, power comes on early and truck runs even better at higher speeds and while towing. Cruses at 65 easily at 9 psi and 800-900 degree manifold temps depending on load. Nice mod if you don't expect miracles.

 

[Iceman3005]

Yes there are a few diesel engines that I'd rather have in my 1008. If it wasn't such a hard and expensive swap I'd have a Duramax and an Allison 6 speed. However, my original intention was to own a cheap wood hauler that I could just park behind the barn when not in use and NOT mess with it. I ended up with a clean, very heavy duty 30,000 mile truck from Nevada that ran great but had the power of a slug. I went the cheapest route possible and found a 6.5 'Burb being parted out on C/L and bought the turbo setup from it for $400 including electric fuel pump . Say what you want about the 6.2 but it's hard to toss a good running low mileage engine when a cheap used turbo will make it run like you thought it should in the first place but didn't. Still no powerhouse, but with spring pressure set at 10-12 psi max, power comes on early and truck runs even better at higher speeds and while towing. Cruses at 65 easily at 9 psi and 800-900 degree manifold temps depending on load. Nice mod if you don't expect miracles.

Nice clean setup! I'm also in the works.......hopefully to do the 6.5 turbo on mine! As for other turbo mod's I have never seen one with a blower, maybe one from a 8v53 might work. I did see a home made twin turbo setup on ebay a couple of months ago, can't remember how much he wanted or if it even sold. I was a little dissappointed, he said the motor had never been started so he didn't know what the turbo's would do or if it would even work.

I also did some research on a cummins 5.9 turbo for the 6.2, both the chevy 6.5 turbo and the 5.9 cummins turbo use the same flange and bolt pattern so I thought about using that instead of the 6.5 turbo on my 6.2. The 5.9 turbo can move a lot more air, might help egt's come down a lot.

 

[Skinny]

I understand you did a bunch of research and of course everyone on a CUCV board would be sensative about a 6.2 because that is what they have but buildling a 6.2 is like putting granite counter tops in a single wide mobile home. Yes it can be done, doesn't make it right. Good news is that we live in a country where my opinion really doesn't matter so have at it. When I say 'building' I mean more than just installing a 6.5 turbo setup, I mean higher quality crank/pistons/machine work/etc.

I want a little more power but am not ready to pull a 6.2 with 10k miles on it when it runs perfectly fine.

 

[twomorestrokes]

Nice clean setup! I'm also in the works.......hopefully to do the 6.5 turbo on mine! As for other turbo mod's I have never seen one with a blower, maybe one from a 8v53 might work. I did see a home made twin turbo setup on ebay a couple of months ago, can't remember how much he wanted or if it even sold. I was a little dissappointed, he said the motor had never been started so he didn't know what the turbo's would do or if it would even work.

I also did some research on a cummins 5.9 turbo for the 6.2, both the chevy 6.5 turbo and the 5.9 cummins turbo use the same flange and bolt pattern so I thought about using that instead of the 6.5 turbo on my 6.2. The 5.9 turbo can move a lot more air, might help egt's come down a lot.

I saw that dual turbo setup as well. A stock 6.2 would never be able to handle anywhere near the capabilities of that system. A stock 6.5 setup moves more than enough air for the 6.2 in stock form and is easily capable of scattering the engine all over the road if you don't keep it under reigns with spring pressure high enough to limit the boost. Sometimes mine spikes to 12 psi momentarily and I even saw it touch 15 psi for a moment while towing, and you need to worry about that. As far as EGT's go, I've never been up toward the limit yet.

 

[Iceman3005]

http://heathdiesel.com/news/news/500hp-diesel-race-engine.html

There are some pics there of the 500HP 6.5 / 6.2 twin turbo, water injected motor!

 

[Skinny]

Interesting engine build

I'm not sure how replacing every component in a 6.2 and adding twins along with water injection (not to mention probably cutting its service life down) is comparable in price and practicality to a base 6BT or ISB which would take nothing more than some turbo/IP mods (6BT) or reprogramming (ISB) to make very comparable power with completely stock internals. Doing it all day long without blowing apart and maintaining fuel economy. I just don't understand why someone would go through the trouble.

 

[Iceman3005]

Interesting engine build

I'm not sure how replacing every component in a 6.2 and adding twins along with water injection (not to mention probably cutting its service life down) is comparable in price and practicality to a base 6BT or ISB which would take nothing more than some turbo/IP mods (6BT) or reprogramming (ISB) to make very comparable power with completely stock internals. Doing it all day long without blowing apart and maintaining fuel economy. I just don't understand why someone would go through the trouble.

To prove to everyone that says it can't be done that it can! That these engines where actual designed to be a heavy duty powerfull workhorse, yes I am a cummins guy all the way but its still very cool that these engines are capable of producing decent horsepower to somewhat keep up with the powerstroke and cummins.

 

[1958 M274]

 

[Skinny]

To prove to everyone that says it can't be done that it can! That these engines where actual designed to be a heavy duty powerfull workhorse, yes I am a cummins guy all the way but its still very cool that these engines are capable of producing decent horsepower to somewhat keep up with the powerstroke and cummins.

I'm curious what the price tag on that engine was.

One thing I'd like to do is take a junkyard supercharger off of something like a Mercedes (belt driven non-roots style) and mount it on the 6.2 in a low boost application. Maybe use a HMMWV crank pulley for an extra belt. I've noticed how much my 6.2 hates starting from a dead stop up hills in 2HI. Granted I do have 37's and the TH400 is a power robbing slug with a tall first gear ratio. Numerous times I've had to drop her into LO in order to get up a driveway or give a tug to a piece of equipment that is stuck (fork trucks).