PA residents and the M818

[jpfever]

I was wondering if anyone in PA had an M818 and if they had anyto upgrade their DL per PA Motor Vehicles. I ask because I am loking at buying one, and not upgrading to a Class C CDL license. ( per DMV they informed me that I would need to get a Class C license)

 

[gunboy1656]

I don't have a 5 ton, but I can say I have not heard of a class C CDL. Most of the people I know have theirs registered as antique. Limits their use, but exempts the weight.

What are you going to use it for?

 

[jpfever]

Actually, looking at removing the 5th wheel and putting a 9 foot bed on it for errands to Home Depot, Lowes, running my kayaks out to the lake. I know that there are other trucks out there, just like the look of 5 ton.

 

[lsansone]

have my 5 ton registered in CT, but limits what you can do with it. In CT you are not allowed to carry things in the bed. so your home depot stuff would get you gigged. I think if you want to use it as you describe, you will end up commercial and a class b cdl

 

[rwbrown72]

Search "CDL" and read all the posts and then go and talk to the DMV. If you are "Not For Hire" and only hauling your own stuff.... Read the other threads.... I'm just saying!
By the way JP... Are you looking at the one on ebay? If you are, let me know. It belongs to me!

 

[Sephirothq]

Flame suit on,

As per Penn Dot. I have been informed that I require at least a Class B noncommercial license to operate any vehicle over 26,000 lbs GVW.

I have my M818 at 57,000 lbs GVW with an antique tag.

You can get a learner's permit for $5 from a driver's license center. There is no test to take for the permit. You need to schedule a driving test with the vehicle you intend to use it for. You will need a driver that has an appropriate license to operate the vehicle.

Ok

You could title your truck at 26,000 lbs but that leaves no room for any other weight.
done
flame suit off.

 

[ecostruction]

I got a 5 ton 818 up here in York I might be looking to sell. Real nice truck. Titled in PA.

Aside from that, the folks at PennDOT aren't real sure how to handle this situation, at least the 5 or so people I've talked to. I wanted to register it for use, but without a requirement for a CDL. If you registered it at 26k lbs, that would give you roughly 6500 lbs payload and 10k towed weight. Class B license is 26,001 lbs and over for a single truck. Class A is any trailer over 10,001 lbs. Even though PA offers a non-commercial license, PennDOT doesn't know how to do them. Process is same for Commercial and Non-commercial. From my research it would make the most sense to do a Commercial Class A license. Even though there is more to do, in the long run, it will provide you with the most flexiblity and your chances of finding someone with a non-commercial class b/a license in PA is slim. The one person I talked to at PennDOT didn't realize they offered a non-commercial license.

Just my .02

Eco

 

[ecostruction]

In PA you can get into trouble for driving a F250 towing a trailer with a trailer GVW of 10001 lbs or over. That truck trailer combination requires a class A license. However, in the past if you tried to take a test in that combination they would laugh at you and deny the test. It's been challenged recently and a few people have been able to take the test in a similar combination.

 

[jpfever]

Search "CDL" and read all the posts and then go and talk to the DMV. If you are "Not For Hire" and only hauling your own stuff.... Read the other threads.... I'm just saying!
By the way JP... Are you looking at the one on ebay? If you are, let me know. It belongs to me!

I like your 818, I've got to unload a Jeep before I can think of buying another toy. Wish I had the funds to purchase yours. It's sharp.

 

[jpfever]

I got a 5 ton 818 up here in York I might be looking to sell. Real nice truck. Titled in PA.

Aside from that, the folks at PennDOT aren't real sure how to handle this situation, at least the 5 or so people I've talked to. I wanted to register it for use, but without a requirement for a CDL. If you registered it at 26k lbs, that would give you roughly 6500 lbs payload and 10k towed weight. Class B license is 26,001 lbs and over for a single truck. Class A is any trailer over 10,001 lbs. Even though PA offers a non-commercial license, PennDOT doesn't know how to do them. Process is same for Commercial and Non-commercial. From my research it would make the most sense to do a Commercial Class A license. Even though there is more to do, in the long run, it will provide you with the most flexiblity and your chances of finding someone with a non-commercial class b/a license in PA is slim. The one person I talked to at PennDOT didn't realize they offered a non-commercial license.

Just my .02

Eco

If you decide to sell it or not, I am interested in coming out to take a look. Like about 40 mins from York.

 

[rwbrown72]

PennDOT: Quakers on Patrol!

 

[nhdiesel]

In PA you can get into trouble for driving a F250 towing a trailer with a trailer GVW of 10001 lbs or over. That truck trailer combination requires a class A license. However, in the past if you tried to take a test in that combination they would laugh at you and deny the test. It's been challenged recently and a few people have been able to take the test in a similar combination.

Thats the way NH is. If the truck is over 26,000 GVW, commercial is needed, unless its an RV. And its only an RV if it meets certain criteria (has a bed and running water I believe...would have to check). Doesn't matter if its for personal use, it still requires CDL.

They also go by the truck's original data plate. If you take a 5-ton and register it for 25,900 lbs. and you get stopped by the DOT, they check the data plate and you get a ticket regardless of registered weight.

Technically if I hook an M105 trailer behind my Deuce, I need a Class A CDL in NH. The combination of truck and trailer are over 26,000 (2400 lb. trailer, 5000 load capacity=7400 gvw; 13000 lb. Deuce, 10k capacity=24000 gvw, combined for 31,400 GVW.) Just putting a small car trailer behind the Deuce would get me nailed if they bothered to pay attention.

Because every state is different, and even different DOT officers and branches believe different things, your best bet is to go to your local DOT and ask them. Compare what they tell you in person to what you can find for PA official law, then use your judgement for what you have to do to keep everyone happy. Being legal to the technicality of the law doesn't help if the actual DOT officers want to give you a hard time. If you live an area like I do, the actual law means nothing to them.

Example in point, a friend has a M211. It didn't come with turn signals, so according to NH law, none are needed, unless it was factory equipped. Also exempt because he's using antique registration, so he's double exempt. but our local DOT officer told him he better put turn signals on it. He did it, because whether legal or not, this is the officer who he would be dealing with around here. Its easier and cheaper to comply than to go through a court battle with the DOT.

Jim

 

[antennaclimber]

If you get Antique or Classic tags, you do not need a CDL.

This information is on the PENNDOT web page:

"[FONT=Courier New,Courier New]Commercial motor vehicle.[/FONT]" A motor vehicle designed or used to transport passengers or property:
(1) if the vehicle has a gross vehicle weight rating of 26,001 or more pounds or such lesser rating as the department shall adopt under the provisions of section 6103(c) (relating to promulgation of rules and regulations by department), as determined by Federal regulation and published by the department as a notice in the Pennsylvania Bulletin;
(2) if the vehicle is designed to transport 16 or more passengers, including the driver;
(3) if the vehicle is a school bus; or
(4) if the vehicle is transporting hazardous materials and is required to be placarded in accordance with department regulations.
The term does not include an antique or classic motor vehicle, or an implement of husbandry, or any motor home or recreational trailer operated solely for personal use, or motorized construction equipment, including, but not limited to, motorscrapers, backhoes, motorgraders, compactors, excavators, tractors, trenchers and bulldozers.

 

[Sephirothq]

That is where the noncommercial license comes in or so i have been told by PennDOT

 

[rwbrown72]

If you get Antique or Classic tags, you do not need a CDL.

This information is on the PENNDOT web page:

"[FONT=Courier New,Courier New]Commercial motor vehicle.[/FONT]" A motor vehicle designed or used to transport passengers or property:
(1) if the vehicle has a gross vehicle weight rating of 26,001 or more pounds or such lesser rating as the department shall adopt under the provisions of section 6103(c) (relating to promulgation of rules and regulations by department), as determined by Federal regulation and published by the department as a notice in the Pennsylvania Bulletin;
(2) if the vehicle is designed to transport 16 or more passengers, including the driver;
(3) if the vehicle is a school bus; or
(4) if the vehicle is transporting hazardous materials and is required to be placarded in accordance with department regulations.
The term does not include an antique or classic motor vehicle, or an implement of husbandry, or any motor home or recreational trailer operated solely for personal use, or motorized construction equipment, including, but not limited to, motorscrapers, backhoes, motorgraders, compactors, excavators, tractors, trenchers and bulldozers.

What he said!

 

[jcappeljr]

I have my 5 ton tagged historic,but I have a class A cdl.

 

[Monkeyboyarmy]

Hey Eco. Just curious if that applies to out-of-staters too. I just talked to the OHP about cdl stuff and they said that I could drive a semi truck for non-business purposes without a cdl (although I may be questioned and have to prove non-comm) but if I were to go out of state, I may have to follow the rules of that state. Any ideas?

 

[nhdiesel]

Once you go out of state, you get into federal laws, and from everything I have read on trucking forums, ANYTHING over 26k requires a CDL.

And on this "not for hire", it has been tried in many places, and people have gotten bitten hard by it. If you tow a trailer that isn't in your name, its for hire. If you haul some building materials home for a friend, you are for hire. If you get caught for any of this, it can be a very large fine and possible loss of license.

Jim

 

[rwbrown72]

Once you go out of state, you get into federal laws, and from everything I have read on trucking forums, ANYTHING over 26k requires a CDL.

And on this "not for hire", it has been tried in many places, and people have gotten bitten hard by it. If you tow a trailer that isn't in your name, its for hire. If you haul some building materials home for a friend, you are for hire. If you get caught for any of this, it can be a very large fine and possible loss of license.

Jim

Good points.... I said originally that all of this is highly dependent on how you use your truck. I have had this discussion with a lot of people who know a lot about the law. The people who have a CDL mostly think that you have to have a CDL. Why not, they have them. It would be advisable to get the training anyway, but that doesn't answer the original question. My answer: It Depends.

 

[southdave]

Hey Eco. Just curious if that applies to out-of-staters too. I just talked to the OHP about cdl stuff and they said that I could drive a semi truck for non-business purposes without a cdl (although I may be questioned and have to prove non-comm) but if I were to go out of state, I may have to follow the rules of that state. Any ideas?

It, all about revenue no logic to it
btw the CDL is can of worms now, with med. card and requirements on age and dual nature of laws ect.. No one agency Knows the full story cause the change the requirement constantly.