I think I may be in a bit of a bind. I have a 1969 2.5 ton deuce and one of the front springs was shot and it was leaning (and one of the rear, but that's another story). I bought a used set off someone on this forum several weeks ago that he said came off a 2.5 ton. I am just now getting time and got everything off and put one of the newer set on and at that point noticed that even though it would bolt up their wasn't as much extra thread on the bottom of the u-bolts. Then it hit me, the springs he sold me have 12 leafs instead of 10 like the one I removed. So now instead of sagging on that side it sits a good bit higher. Would these be 5 ton springs he sold me? I did not put the other side on as I presume these are the wrongs springs and I would just have to take both back off.
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Question about front springs
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DieselBob
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I'm no expert but maybe the replacement came from a "A3" model. Not sure they use a different spring or not but I would think a 5 ton spring would be much longer and wider than a deuce.
You might be right. In reading for the last 2 hours it appears that the 5-ton springs may be wider and take different size pins and may actually have 16 leafs, maybe someone can confirm. Also, I saw several people say in a couple posts that their deuce springs (without a winch) had 12 leafs (14 leafs with a winch), and I saw pictures of some with 12. So if these are deuce springs with 12 leafs than I wonder why mine had 10 and why I see pictures of some with 10? Maybe the older units had 10 leafs. Either way, if these are for a deuce, which I hope is the case, then I will install the other side and work on replacing the rears next.
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5-ton springs won't bolt up. They are a lot more than just a extra leaf, they are massively bigger.
If you have both sides I'd just go ahead and bolt up the other side and call it a day.
If you have both sides I'd just go ahead and bolt up the other side and call it a day.
DieselBob
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I have a 71 deuce and will check the number of leafs tomorrow. Mine is a non-winch truck so maybe this will shed some light on the difference.
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There is no way to confuse them: 5ton springs are 3 inches wide while M44 series springs are 2-1/2".
All Deuces I have ever worked on had 12 leaves. The difference between models is in the thickness of flat-stock material used for the spring leaves. The gassers (with- and without winch) are 4 inches, stacked. (BTW: same height, width and length as lower spring pack from M105 trailer).
The MF powered A1's and A2's came with 4-3/8", stacked height. A3's also have 12 leaves; not sure on the thickness there, but it looks similar to the A2.
When converting gassers to MF I have often re-used the stock gasser springs and redistributed the various length's to add two more leaves (total of 14). (IMO, it contributes to a softer ride).
I have never seen any Deuces with just 10 leaves. Maybe someone knows where they came from...?
G.
All Deuces I have ever worked on had 12 leaves. The difference between models is in the thickness of flat-stock material used for the spring leaves. The gassers (with- and without winch) are 4 inches, stacked. (BTW: same height, width and length as lower spring pack from M105 trailer).
The MF powered A1's and A2's came with 4-3/8", stacked height. A3's also have 12 leaves; not sure on the thickness there, but it looks similar to the A2.
When converting gassers to MF I have often re-used the stock gasser springs and redistributed the various length's to add two more leaves (total of 14). (IMO, it contributes to a softer ride).
I have never seen any Deuces with just 10 leaves. Maybe someone knows where they came from...?
G.
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DieselBob
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Checked the front springs and I have 12.
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This is interesting...I just picked 5 random deuces with diesels from out back and 4 had 12 leafs and 1 had 10. I also checked 3 gassers and they all had 12. Now the mystery remains; why do some only have 10 leafs?
I also checked an A3 and it has 12 also.
I also checked an A3 and it has 12 also.
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Aha... so what manufacturer/ production year is that "odd" one? Can you measure the total spring pack (stacked) height ...? (If I had to guess: 3.75"..... ????)
G.
G.
peashooter
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GRINGELTAUBE- could the 10 leaf pack be the oddball that would get the larger spring shim that has nearly 9 degrees of angle to it rather than the more common 4 degrees? I've attached a picture you put together of them a while back.
DEUCER-which one of these spring shim seats looks like the ones on your truck?
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I bet there is a difference in the thickness of the leaves, in the 10 leaf spring pack, to bring it to compare with the 12 leaf pack. Still the question is, what company used them?
Every time I have done spring work, I have found that its best to change them out in matched sets. Springs get tired over time, and relax, and can loose their arch.
Every time I have done spring work, I have found that its best to change them out in matched sets. Springs get tired over time, and relax, and can loose their arch.
I willed sure but mine did not have much of an angle if I recall, likely 4 degrees.
Also, the measurement of the two were different with the 10 being less thick than the 12. I cannot remember how much, I can measure but at least a half inch. The u-bolts were barely long enough for the 12.
Also, the measurement of the two were different with the 10 being less thick than the 12. I cannot remember how much, I can measure but at least a half inch. The u-bolts were barely long enough for the 12.
gimpyrobb
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Bringing this back to the top!
Tyler busted a spring pack at Haspin this year. I was able to source a spring for him to swap out, but it has 10 leaves instead of the 12 his has. I guess this is still un-answered.
I guess I'll have to measure spring-leaf height.
Tyler busted a spring pack at Haspin this year. I was able to source a spring for him to swap out, but it has 10 leaves instead of the 12 his has. I guess this is still un-answered.
I guess I'll have to measure spring-leaf height.
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Yes, please, measure the total stack height and/or leaf-thickness. And also, what model and year of manufacture was that "donor"-truck...?
This has been a mystery... for too long!
G.
This has been a mystery... for too long!
G.
Shoot, now you all got me wanting to go out and count the leaves/measure the pack on the trucks in my motor pool. I think that the '66 out there does lean a little one side.
gimpyrobb
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Well I needed one for my M35 since the pass side sags so much(Hmm, maybe thats the reason the truck laid over! It wasn't anything my driving skills lacked- WOOHOO! It was mechanical failure.) I got a "set" but only needed one, so I sold him the other. I guess I will trade him the matching one and take his one good one. I got the spring perches with them, so if we are lucky, he might measure the perches for us.
Chevracer87
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Working on it now
Chevracer87
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Okay here's the numbers for the 10 leaf. The perches look like the standard 4 degree. They measure 17.5mm on the low side and 23.5mm on the high side. The spring pack I have disassembled so I'm unable to get the entire thickness. However, each leaf measures roughly .375 or 3/8's